Final call, be blessed but only if black

[sumas]

sumas, just out of curiosity, if you and your husband seemingly disagree with the message the guy was trying to push with his paper, why would you both go out of your way to try and buy one from him?

Perhaps he picked up on that, and thus the negative reaction your husband received...

How would I know the message?. Can only assume it was negative if the guy wouldn't sell. I have deep respect for all religions that teach tolerance and respect for others. Fanatic fringes always seem to pervert any religion for whatever reason.

We have a community center down the street funded by a Muslim Mosque. They are involved in community and a welcome addition to our neighborhood.

We chase nothing except knowledge.

[aj3647]

How would I know the message?. Can only assume it was negative if the guy wouldn't sell.

Except you said that he offered to sell it to your husband for $2 and your husband flippantly declined after chasing him down. I don't think you were chasing knowledge but rather a confrontation.

It was probably like your reason to ask that; out of curiosity. I don't know too many folks hawking papers who would refuse a sale, do you?

You make the assumption, a false one in my opinion, that his primary motivation in selling a religious paper was to make money.

[canuck]

You make the assumption, a false one in my opinion, that his primary motivation in selling a religious paper was to make money.

Yes of course, but he wasn't equally proselytizing to white folks, that is the main issue. The Muslim religion has its faults, like varying degrees of rules of submission for women, but it preaches universally to all people. The NOI is another pair of shorts, it is as EastsideAl reminds us; a quaint reminder of the forces that put black folk apart from the mainstream for so long.

[iheartthed]

Yes of course, but he wasn't equally proselytizing to white folks, that is the main issue. The Muslim religion has its faults, like varying degrees of rules of submission for women, but it preaches universally to all people.

I'll respectfully disagree with you here. First of all, Islam is not monolithic and there are plenty of different interpretations of it, just as there are numerous different interpretations of Christianity, Judaism or any other religion with a mass following. But all of those religions mentioned heretofore do have in common the tenet that non-believers of said religion are in some way inferior. The degree to which they adhere to that principal is what differentiates the extremists from non-extremists.

a quaint reminder of the forces that put black folk apart from the mainstream for so long.

Of all the things that have kept black Americans from assimilating into the mainstream culture for most of America's nearly 250 year existence, I feel secure in saying that the NOI was a non-factor.

[Dan Wesson]

Of all the things that have kept black Americans from assimilating into the mainstream culture for most of America's nearly 250 year existence, I feel secure in saying that the NOI was a non-factor.

Agreed......

[canuck]

I'll respectfully disagree with you here. First of all, Islam is not monolithic and there are plenty of different interpretations of it, just as there are numerous different interpretations of Christianity, Judaism or any other religion with a mass following. But all of those religions mentioned heretofore do have in common the tenet that non-believers of said religion are in some way inferior. The degree to which they adhere to that principal is what differentiates the extremists from non-extremists.

I agree with you on that too. I am making a distinction though between NOI which preaches to a black audience exclusively and Islam which is generally proselytizing to a universal audience. There is a very vast audience in the Muslim world, and we tend to focus on the Middle East and the Gulf states because they are closer to us among other reasons. If you look at Indonesia, one of the biggest countries on earth, and the 4th most populous; it is overwhelmingly muslim, and in Southeast Asia. The next biggest Islamic country is Pakistan; also in Asia. There are the countries of Eastern Europe that also have important muslim populations. NOI was a fabrication create from pretty desperate circumstances and unfortunately became a sort of mafia. There are many weird outgrowths of large organized religions that populate mankind's need for truths throughout history.

Ultra-orthodox jewry came about after so many attempts at assimilation or destruction from pogroms in Easter Europe and the Russian Empire. If you look at the reflex of closing in on oneself for protection, religion affords a place for sub-groups like that to congregate and justify self-ostracism.

Of all the things that have kept black Americans from assimilating into the mainstream culture for most of America's nearly 250 year existence, I feel secure in saying that the NOI was a non-factor.

I agree with you there too. I was pointing out that NOI came about as a result of ostracism from the mainstream. The black separatist movement includes a great variety of expressions that negate the need of dealing with the mainstream. The other form of separatism is the ghetto culture that pushes violence in order to control through terror.

[Danny]

Bu the way the Black Nation of Islam started in Detroit on the corner of Linwood St. near Joy Rd and Clairemount St. by Elijah Mohammed.

Also during his childhood Elijah Mohammed grew up in Yemans St. between Conant Ave. and Jos. Campeau St. in Hamtramck in the early 1920s.

[Hypestyles]

side note: A former NOI member writes a heavily autobiographical book about his experiences and dealing with his dormant sexuality: http://brotherhassans.blogspot.com/2...out-black.html excerpted from blog post:

Later that night in the spring of 1993, I would learn, Aaron would hang himself in his dorm room in college. The young man I looked up to , that would always be good for a shot of emotional energy and positive spirit when I was feeling down, was struggling with a reality that he felt that he could never share with me. I felt a mixture of hurt, anger, confusion, and shock. A myriad of emotions swirled through my mind. This cannot be suicide, I thought. Someone must have taken his life, for some bizarre, stupefying, crazy and sick reason. It had to be murder. No way my homie would take his life like that.

When I received the phone call from another friend of ours in Chicago to tell me the news, I couldn’t sleep that night. Or the next night. For several nights after this tragedy, I would wander aimlessly around Tuskegee’s campus at night and sit near the famous statue of founder Booker T. Washington lifting the "Veil of Ignorance", wondering what I would do now that he was gone. I was furious on some selfish level that he would take his own life, when he knew that I needed him.

His energy and infectious laugh, coupled with his strict discipline and tireless dedication to study, helped me grow as a young man in that last year of his life by leaps and bounds. Just when I started learning how to stand up for myself, speak out for myself, thanks to him, he was now suddenly gone.

It’s very possible, from what I would later hear, that I was one of the last, if not the last person he spoke to before killing himself.


I had no clue, however, about the quiet “scandal” that was going on in Chicago at Nation Of Islam headquarters while I was at Tuskegee. Apparently, from what I was later told by several sources in the Mosque at the time, Aaron and “several other brothers” in the squad we belonged to, called the Task Force, [[we were called the “Task-Force“, because we were a squad of young men ages 16-25 being groomed to become the next leaders of the Nation of Islam. We considered ourselves to be the “elite”, the rising young guns, those next in line for potential leadership within the ranks of the nation Of Islam.)were having sexual relations with each other .

I was told by several sources that the highest ranking member of the squad, whom we shall call “Ali” had been allegedly caught by his own wife having sexual relations with ANOTHER brother in the same squad , “Marcus 12 X” . [[ In the Nation, when members were first entering the Nation they were given the last name “X”, to symbolize the unknown ancestral disconnect that slavery brought upon the Black community.).


While this fire-storm of controversy was swirling within the ranks of the Nation Of Islam behind the scenes, I was clueless as to any of the events that were transpiring. How ironic, that I was so scared to tell my own squad members that I think I might be gay, and then find out that SEVERAL of them were already gay and I never knew! Go figure, I thought. Why couldn’t Aaron feel free to tell me what was going on with him? What was he afraid of?

[sumas]

[QUOTE=aj3647;474097]Except you said that he offered to sell it to your husband for $2 and your husband flippantly declined after chasing him down. I don't think you were chasing knowledge but rather a confrontation.

My husband wasn't remotely flippant, just refused to participate in an apparent racial taunt. Seeking knowledge has never been a sin in my book. Confrontation is almost a hilarious comment. Racial/religious slights are not in my perview, maybe yours, couldn't comment, don't know you.