Sterling Heights, MI.

[Gistok]

I'm having a mental block picturing Clinton Twp [[at 876 ft) being much higher than Sterling Heights [[at 614 ft), especially since Clinton Twp is "downriver" [[Clinton River wise) from Sterling Heights. 262 ft. difference is quite a difference in relatively flat metro Detroit. Can anyone think of a high elevation in Clinton Township?

[JDKeepsmiling]

I think that the car analogy is a really great one. I live in Plymouth [[not the McMansions in Plymouth Twp.), which while being a suburb, is definitely more walkable and in the future transit oriented then most. It is really all about perceived values. Luckily for most posters on the forum, there is a national trend, especially among Millenialls, toward living in the exsisting urban fabric. There was just an article in Builder Magazine [[I work in construction material sales) about this trend, and how builders should look at dense, infill development to meet the needs of this trend. So hopefully we will see some infill in the D, and in the Inner Ring burbs when the economy gets going again. JD

[crawford]

[[As for me, I'll stay far away from "Sterling Whites.")

While Sterling Heights, is pretty, well, "white", it's super-diverse, since Chaldeans and Arabs usually check "white" on the Census.

Additionally, as mentioned, there's a very large recent Eastern European immigrant population, and a substantial Asian population.

And while Sterling Heights' black population is small, it has been exploding in size. It's probably 10 times what it was back in the 1980's.

Really the only population Sterling Heights doesn't have is Latinos. It's certainly more diverse than most of Detroit city proper or most suburbs.

[Det_ard]

Less crime and better services than where? Other suburbs? Detroit? Other regions? That was a very vague post.

So they have growth because they don't look like a third world country and have real stores? Then why do we have stagnation and depopulation in Grosse Pointe, Livonia, and others?

The depopulation is often caused by a decrease in average household size. The number of households stays roughly constant but a family of 5 becomes an empty nester household of 2. Families would move to a suburb with good schools and stay there well after their kids are out of the house. Longer live expectancies exacerbate the trend. It's a problem for the school systems in places like West Bloomfield because they now have fewer children in the school district. That's why many suburban school districts participate in Schools of Choice.

What's not happening is what you appear to implying, that people are moving out of GP and Livonia. There's some of that happening there now, as with everywhere else, due to the economy and foreclosures but over the last 10 -15 years those communities have lost population due to the decrease in household size.

[East Detroit]

Hamtramck Heights.

Where people bleach their driveways and sneer toward those down Mound Rd who haven't arrived yet.

[Searay215]

Hamtramck Heights.

Where people bleach their driveways and sneer toward those down Mound Rd who haven't arrived yet.

Ah...yes Detroit - 2 teenagers shot in 24 hours....how nice it must be.

[Retroit]

Either I don't have as discerning taste as the rest of you or I'm getting tired of these "city comparisons", because in my opinion there are only three distinct places in metro Detroit.

1. The really nice places [[Grosse Pointe Shores, Bloomfield Hills, etc.)
2. The not nice places [[ghettos in Detroit, etc.)
3. The nice places [[everywhere else)

[["Niceness" measured by how desirable these areas are to the general population, as evidenced by home prices.)

[mwilbert]

Either I don't have as discerning taste as the rest of you or I'm getting tired of these "city comparisons", because in my opinion there are only three distinct places in metro Detroit.

1. The really nice places [[Grosse Pointe Shores, Bloomfield Hills, etc.)
2. The not nice places [[ghettos in Detroit, etc.)
3. The nice places [[everywhere else)

[["Niceness" measured by how desirable these areas are to the general population, as evidenced by home prices.)

I don't know about "discerning taste", but it appears these distinctions are not important to you. I can't tell the difference between cognacs [[they all taste vile). However, to me the differences between some of these places are so vast that I can't really identify with your viewpoint.

[Bearinabox]

Either I don't have as discerning taste as the rest of you or I'm getting tired of these "city comparisons", because in my opinion there are only three distinct places in metro Detroit.

1. The really nice places [[Grosse Pointe Shores, Bloomfield Hills, etc.)
2. The not nice places [[ghettos in Detroit, etc.)
3. The nice places [[everywhere else)

[["Niceness" measured by how desirable these areas are to the general population, as evidenced by home prices.)

So you think the most expensive community out of any given list of places will always be the one that fits your needs the best? Given unlimited funds, you would always choose to live in the most expensive possible house in the most expensive possible area? Is this also how you shop for cars? Clothes? Groceries? Your credit card company must love you.

[Gistok]

That may happen but claiming it as fact a couple posts in is a little pre-mature on your part.

Oh, and to add - Macomb County sucks.

Ah... but it has some of those nice HCMA Metro Parks that you're so fond of paying for...

[DetroitDad]

Ah...yes Detroit - 2 teenagers shot in 24 hours....how nice it must be.

Nobody is even talking about the City of Detroit, we are comparing suburbs.

[Crumbled_pavement]

Nobody is even talking about the City of Detroit, we are comparing suburbs.

I'm going to be called a racist for this post but I'm far from a racist. Some of my best friends are white. I even invited a white person to my house for dinner once. Anyhow, everything on this site is a comparison to Detroit. Some people just need a place to be worst than where they live so they can feel like they really live in paradise. Now everybody can start unfairly labeling me as a racist for my opinion, even though all the people I work with are white and I have never said anything disparaging about any of them!

[DetroitDad]

I'm going to be called a racist for this post but I'm far from a racist. Some of my best friends are white. I even invited a white person to my house for dinner once. Anyhow, everything on this site is a comparison to Detroit. Some people just need a place to be worst than where they live so they can feel like they really live in paradise. Now everybody can start unfairly labeling me as a racist for my opinion, even though all the people I work with are white and I have never said anything disparaging about any of them!

Detroit is what makes suburbia look good. Do you think if we didn't have that comparison, that the suburbanites would actually be willing to improve their communities even more, instead of the cultural stagnation that has taken place [[as in; we are great because we have good schools, low crime, etc.. Okay, so you don't live in a third world community, is that all you aspire to achieve?)?

That is really the overtone in the "Suburbs are Unsustainable" thread.

[Retroit]

Bearinabox, the reason some places have expensive houses [[#1 on my list) is because a lot of people want to live there, but only those with a lot of money can afford to.

The reason that some places have inexpensive houses [[#2 on my list) is because few people want to live there.

The reason that most of us live in the indistinguishable suburbs [[#3) is because we don't want to live in place 2, but can't afford to live in place 1.

I really don't see much difference between $150,000 homes in Sterling Heights, St. Clair Shores, Southfield, Taylor, etc. And their main roads are equally indistinguishable. What is the difference between a McDonald, Taco Bell, Kmart or Home Depot in any of these cities?

Are we trying to make ourselves more different than we really are? Does our familiarity with a certain place make us more comfortable and thus cause us to assess that area as more desirable?

I would even argue this on a much broader basis. I've been to middle-class areas throughout the country, and honestly, they all look alike.

[DetroitDad]

Bearinabox, the reason some places have expensive houses [[#1 on my list) is because a lot of people want to live there, but only those with a lot of money can afford to.

The reason that some places have inexpensive houses [[#2 on my list) is because few people want to live there.

The reason that most of us live in the indistinguishable suburbs [[#3) is because we don't want to live in place 2, but can't afford to live in place 1.

I really don't see much difference between $150,000 homes in Sterling Heights, St. Clair Shores, Southfield, Taylor, etc. And their main roads are equally indistinguishable. What is the difference between a McDonald, Taco Bell, Kmart or Home Depot in any of these cities?

Are we trying to make ourselves more different than we really are? Does our familiarity with a certain place make us more comfortable and thus cause us to assess that area as more desirable?

I would even argue this on a much broader basis. I've been to middle-class areas throughout the country, and honestly, they all look alike.

Generally, the quality of schools seem to have a huge impact on the home prices of an area, and how desirable it is.

[mwilbert]

I would even argue this on a much broader basis. I've been to middle-class areas throughout the country, and honestly, they all look alike.

I don't doubt this is your experience, but I don't find it true even if you restrict yourself to the Detroit area. To me, Sterling Heights doesn't look like Pleasant Ridge. It just doesn't. Neither one of them look anything like Oak Park, IL, or the Sunset neighborhood in San Francisco, or Arlington MA, or the middle class sections of Palm Springs.