I-94 Expansion Project [[Roadway to Detroit's Future)

[SteveJ]

5 lanes wide?

Seriously?

For the record, I do think the bridge work is necessary.

But yeah, this was already beaten to death in the original thread about it, but it would cost just as much to build and maintain this expansion project that it would a decent transit system for Detroit.

Yeah but the Feds will pay 90% and we badly need an expansion on I-94 for all the truck traffic heading between Illinois and Port Huron. The Feds also pay 90% when it comes to maintenance. Don't try to mix this with a bus system. Completely different topics.

[EL Jimbo]

Yeah but the Feds will pay 90% and we badly need an expansion on I-94 for all the truck traffic heading between Illinois and Port Huron. The Feds also pay 90% when it comes to maintenance. Don't try to mix this with a bus system. Completely different topics.

It's actually 80%. Also, doing this project won't come from a special pool of federal money that isn't currently being tapped. MDOT gets money from the feds every year to do projects. In order to do this mega project, it just means that the money used for it is not being used to do a whole bunch of other projects the money could go towards.

[Gistok]

It's actually 80%. Also, doing this project won't come from a special pool of federal money that isn't currently being tapped. MDOT gets money from the feds every year to do projects. In order to do this mega project, it just means that the money used for it is not being used to do a whole bunch of other projects the money could go towards.

It's not like this is being done in 1 year... this is likely a 5+ year project... so the money will be spread out....

I do agree with the need to widen I-75 between from 8-16 Mile. Why I-75 is 4 lanes near Frankenmuth escapes me??

I disagree with the need to change the Square Lake exit off of I-75. It may be a left Exit... but due to its' enormous size... the cost would never be worth it.

I also think that I-94 should be widened from 2 to 3 lanes from US-23 [[east of Ann Arbor) to Jackson Rd. [[west of Ann Arbor).

[EL Jimbo]

It's not like this is being done in 1 year... this is likely a 5+ year project... so the money will be spread out....

I do agree with the need to widen I-75 between from 8-16 Mile. Why I-75 is 4 lanes near Frankenmuth escapes me??

I disagree with the need to change the Square Lake exit off of I-75. It may be a left Exit... but due to its' enormous size... the cost would never be worth it.

I also think that I-94 should be widened from 2 to 3 lanes from US-23 [[east of Ann Arbor) to Jackson Rd. [[west of Ann Arbor).

It's going to be A LOT of money. Much more so than your typical road work. MDOT could fix a lot more miles of road for the amount they are putting into this.

[j to the jeremy]

Widen more roads...disinvest in transit...I'm now accepting suggestions for a new city to move to after school.....

[Brian1979]

I-94 really needs to be widened throughout the state, I drive to Chicago on a regular basis and use I-94 all the time, the added third lane in K-Zoo is nice now the traffic flows through there smoothly before the traffic would backup it was two lanes. With as much truck traffic that uses I-94 it should be a three lane throughout the state and four in the entire Detroit area, the trucks get in the left lanes to pass each other and take five minutes to pass, you are driving at 75-80 mph and these trucks are going 60 and taking up your time.

[wolverine]

I-94 really needs to be widened throughout the state, I drive to Chicago on a regular basis and use I-94 all the time, the added third lane in K-Zoo is nice now the traffic flows through there smoothly before the traffic would backup it was two lanes. With as much truck traffic that uses I-94 it should be a three lane throughout the state and four in the entire Detroit area, the trucks get in the left lanes to pass each other and take five minutes to pass, you are driving at 75-80 mph and these trucks are going 60 and taking up your time.

Union Station really needs to quadruple decked beneath Clinton St, I travel from Chicago on a regular basis and use Amtrak all the time, the added space in the lower concourse is nice now and people flow through there smoothly. Before the room would crowd up when just half the size. With so much freight traffic that uses the rails, it should be widened to 3 tracks throughout the state and 4 tracks in the entire Detroit area, the freight trains switch to another track to pass Amtrak and take 2 hours to pass. You are traveling 70-75 mph and these freight trains are going 15 and taking up your time.


just kidding, but semi serious. Though, I've still found awful traffic backup in K-zoo despite the widening. I can still dream of faster train travel times though. The Quadruple decked station with a maglev to the airport is probably going to happen before Detroit gets light rail anyway.

[Brian1979]

Union Station really needs to quadruple decked beneath Clinton St, I travel from Chicago on a regular basis and use Amtrak all the time, the added space in the lower concourse is nice now and people flow through there smoothly. Before the room would crowd up when just half the size. With so much freight traffic that uses the rails, it should be widened to 3 tracks throughout the state and 4 tracks in the entire Detroit area, the freight trains switch to another track to pass Amtrak and take 2 hours to pass. You are traveling 70-75 mph and these freight trains are going 15 and taking up your time.


just kidding, but semi serious. Though, I've still found awful traffic backup in K-zoo despite the widening. I can still dream of faster train travel times though. The Quadruple decked station with a maglev to the airport is probably going to happen before Detroit gets light rail anyway.

Well I think there is something like 18 Amtrak lines that come into Union Station, as well as six Metra lines so that's 24 train lines coming into the station. I think Ogilvie only has 3 Metra train's and Randolph Street has 2. Union is a pretty bustling place.

I've hit some traffic in the K-Zoo area with the three lanes but it's not as bad as when it was only two, I hope they get done with the construction at the Westnedge exit soon. I've been routed around traffic jams in the Paw Paw area twice in the last six months, I've driven to Chicago and back at least 20 times in that time span. The express station for the airports would do really well I think but it would probably take some ridership off of the blue and orange lines, the orange line doesn't really have high ridership anyways and Midway shuts down overnight.

I was really hoping that Detroit would get light rail this time, it would do a lot to create an urban fabric, possibly as dense as Chicago's but most likely not. I-94 should at least be widened in the Ann Arbor and Jackson area's, it's already six lanes from the border to exit 34 [[I-196).

[Wesley Mouch]

I-94 really needs to be widened throughout the state, I drive to Chicago on a regular basis and use I-94 all the time, the added third lane in K-Zoo is nice now the traffic flows through there smoothly before the traffic would backup it was two lanes. With as much truck traffic that uses I-94 it should be a three lane throughout the state and four in the entire Detroit area, the trucks get in the left lanes to pass each other and take five minutes to pass, you are driving at 75-80 mph and these trucks are going 60 and taking up your time.

Sacrilegious! You mean adding lanes improved something? Everyone knows that induced demand results in increased congestion when you add lanes. Please check the new congestion and report back correct facts.

[Brian1979]

Sacrilegious! You mean adding lanes improved something? Everyone knows that induced demand results in increased congestion when you add lanes. Please check the new congestion and report back correct facts.

Traffic is going to backup when congestion is present there is no way around it, but adding a third lane did improve the traffic flow in the K-Zoo area, I drive that stretch enough to know that it did improve the traffic flows. The 40 mile stretch from K-Zoo to I-196 gets backed up in areas especially around Paw Paw for some reason. This didn't add traffic to the expressway it was already there to begin with.

[hortonz]

I would like to know if the I-94 expansion project is linked to the Essex Windsor Parkway that is being built to link highway 401 in Windsor to the new border crossing being touted by federal governments on both sides of the border. A friend of mine suggested that the purpose of the I-94 work and the Essex Windsor Parkway is to allow motorists travelling from Chicago to Toronto to bypass the cities of Detroit and Windsor. I would not be surprised if that was the end result.

[Wesley Mouch]

I would like to know if the I-94 expansion project is linked to the Essex Windsor Parkway that is being built to link highway 401 in Windsor to the new border crossing being touted by federal governments on both sides of the border. A friend of mine suggested that the purpose of the I-94 work and the Essex Windsor Parkway is to allow motorists travelling from Chicago to Toronto to bypass the cities of Detroit and Windsor. I would not be surprised if that was the end result.

Can you explain how that might make sense? I94 is not on the route to the Essex Windsor Parkway [[unless you're coming from Port Huron -- and then, well, you've already got a good route to Canada)

[cramerro]

I would like to know if the I-94 expansion project is linked to the Essex Windsor Parkway that is being built to link highway 401 in Windsor to the new border crossing being touted by federal governments on both sides of the border. A friend of mine suggested that the purpose of the I-94 work and the Essex Windsor Parkway is to allow motorists travelling from Chicago to Toronto to bypass the cities of Detroit and Windsor. I would not be surprised if that was the end result.

Based on my somewhat dated knowledge of the project limits, the route from Chicago would not touch this project.

Chicago traffic would still have to take I-94 to I-96 back around to I-75 south [[past the Ambassador Bridge) to get to the NITC if they took only freeways. The I-94 project starts around I-96 but then goes east toward Porth Huron, with no real impact on the Chicago-Canada traffic. Chicago traffic could exit and take M-39 Southfield Rd over to I-75, but it is a surface street at that point [[maybe some improvements would come to M-39 to better handle that traffic?

Your question leads me to an interesting wrinkle... most freeway-based traffic using the NITC would have to drive past the Ambassador to get to the NITC exit. I'm envisioning that more truck traffic would use the NITC and traffic from downriver/Ohio and south, while the Ambassador would handle more metro and north auto traffic and some trucks. If they were really with it they'd use an ITS application [[Intelligent Transportation Systems) at the Metro ITS center to provide info on the freeway message boards with wait/delay times to help spread the truck traffic across both bridges. Matty would probably jam the signals...

[Wesley Mouch]

...
Chicago traffic would still have to take I-94 to I-96 back around to I-75 south [[past the Ambassador Bridge) to get to the NITC if they took only freeways. The I-94 project starts around I-96 but then goes east toward Porth Huron, with no real impact on the Chicago-Canada traffic. Chicago traffic could exit and take M-39 Southfield Rd over to I-75, but it is a surface street at that point [[maybe some improvements would come to M-39 to better handle that traffic?

Not true. Chicago -> Turnpike -> Toledo -> I75 -> Delray.

Your question leads me to an interesting wrinkle.....<snip>... the Metro ITS center to provide info on the freeway message boards with wait/delay times to help spread the truck traffic across both bridges. Matty would probably jam the signals...

HA!

[DetroitPlanner]

Not true. Chicago -> Turnpike -> Toledo -> I75 -> Delray.

I would not be so sure about that. I-94 cuts a hypotaneus [[sp? its been years since geometry!) and allows traffic to avoid a major city like Toledo. 80/90 is well S of Toledo, particularly if you consider the most logical way to avoid inner-city traffic congestion would be 280. There would be no shortage of trips however down I-75 anyways from the bridge but those would most likely end up in industrial centers of Ohio, Kentuckey, and places south. Most Illinois and Indiana trafffic would most likely want I-94 and make a decision at I-69 to go to Indiana or continue West.

[Genesyxx]

Too bad this doesn't include a mass transit option. A crosstown train would be a good look.

[Brian1979]

I don't understand why I-75 never gets mentioned for widening. It gets really heavy between 8 and 16 that's a 10 mile stretch of bumper to bumper traffic every single day and that's only 3 lanes in each direction too. I-75 is weird like that though it goes from 4 lanes in the city of Detroit to 3 lanes after 8 Mile to 4 lanes after Square Lake all the way to Joslyn, then 3 lanes all the way to I-475 then down to 2 lanes until 23 comes in, then to 4 lanes between I-475 and Bridgeport, back down to 3 lanes until you get to the other side of the Zilwaukee Bridge, then back to 4 lanes between I-675 and Wilder, then down to 2 lanes for most of the way up to the Soo, it might be 3 lanes in certain areas. The Zilwaukee Bridge is 4 lanes in each direction too, then it cuts off the right lane as exit ramps on both sides of the bridge.

I don't know why I-75 is 4 lanes in each direction in some rural areas. I'm thinking it has to do with the northbound traffic on summer Friday's and southbound traffic on summer Sunday's, but why not have it 4 lanes in each direction from Detroit all the way to Bay City then?

The Lodge is 3 lanes each direction too, should we widen the Lodge now too?

[313WX]

I don't understand why I-75 never gets mentioned for widening.

Oh believe me, L. Brooks Patterson has not hesitated to shove that proposal in our face when the opportunity comes about.

That said, I would be in favor of shrinking I-75 south of I-94. It's way too wide for no good reason [[downtown is no longer the only center of commerce in the region).

In fact, we should also shrink I-96, and eliminate the express/local lanes. Again, there's no good reason for it to be that wide anymore.

[Wheels]

Oh believe me, L. Brooks Patterson has not hesitated to shove that proposal in our face when the opportunity comes about.

That said, I would be in favor of shrinking I-75 south of I-94. It's way too wide for no good reason [[downtown is no longer the only center of commerce in the region).

In fact, we should also shrink I-96, and eliminate the express/local lanes. Again, there's no good reason for it to be that wide anymore.

What are you thinking?
How or why would you shrink a freeway?
What would this accomplish?

[DetroitPlanner]

What would this accomplish?

1. increase congestion.
2. slow down raffic due to idling vehicles.
3. fill Detroit's neighborhoods with tailpipe pollutants.
4. waste a ton of gas due to idling on a congested freeway.
5. on the plus side in another 60 years when they go to re-reconstruct it, it will cost less. Of course the EIS will recommend a widening.

[313WX]

What are you thinking?
How or why would you shrink a freeway?
What would this accomplish?

I take it you've never driven I-75 south of I-94 [[4-5 lanes wide in each direction) or I-96 before.

Both are relatively empty, and heavily underutilized.

If we're calling in our debts. we might as well eliminate infrastructure which costs money to maintain that we're not using.

[Brian1979]

Oh believe me, L. Brooks Patterson has not hesitated to shove that proposal in our face when the opportunity comes about.

That said, I would be in favor of shrinking I-75 south of I-94. It's way too wide for no good reason [[downtown is no longer the only center of commerce in the region).

In fact, we should also shrink I-96, and eliminate the express/local lanes. Again, there's no good reason for it to be that wide anymore.

I'm in favor of making all the freeways within the Grand Blvd loop into boulevards except I-94 going through and I-96 and making I-75 go through on that route.

I would love to see no more Chrysler Freeway south of the Ford, no more Fisher Freeway from the Jeffries all the way to Gratiot, no more Lodge south of the Ford. Make them all into boulevard's and rename them Hastings Street [[Chrysler), Vernor Highway [[Fisher) and Sixth Street [[Lodge).

[Detroitnerd]

I'm in favor of making all the freeways within the Grand Blvd loop into boulevards except I-94 going through and I-96 and making I-75 go through on that route.

I would love to see no more Chrysler Freeway south of the Ford, no more Fisher Freeway from the Jeffries all the way to Gratiot, no more Lodge south of the Ford. Make them all into boulevard's and rename them Hastings Street [[Chrysler), Vernor Highway [[Fisher) and Sixth Street [[Lodge).

How interesting it would be to reclaim I-75 and rename it Hastings Boulevard!

[Detroitnerd]

Model D, booster of Detroit business, comes out against I-94 expansion, urges people to show up and let MDOT know this plan is not wanted or needed.

http://www.modeldmedia.com/features/opinion613.aspx

[brizee]

I've only been half paying attention to this project. I thought they were just trying to add a lane in each direction.

They're trying to more than fucking DOUBLE this thing?

Jesus.

How come phrases like "boondoggle" and "train/rail/road to nowhere" aren't being flung around?