Why does it have to be Us vs Them?

[kraig]

DetroitPole... I don't know what the point is of this comment here??

As for the City's Water & Sewage Department... they are the most inept group of people I have ever had to deal with....

5 years ago my late mother had a huge water bill that winter. I looked at her meter and found that they hadn't read it in nearly a year... and they were sending her threatening letters about not having her [[outside) meter read.

This upset mom greatly, and I had to make 4 separate visits to their office at McNichols & Schoenherr to finally get someone out to do nothing more than a simple accurate meter reading. By my 4th trip I went postal and made a big scene at the water dept. office until a supervisor said they would have someone there that week.

But mom [[in her 80s then) was so upset over being worried about having her water turned off... that she [[who used to be very proud of her green lawn) never watered her lawn again [[the last 4 years of her life) over the anguish that the incompetent city water department put her thru.

Yes that department is as useless as any government entity I have ever met. They were too inept to simply send someone out to read a simple f'ing water meter.

And you wonder why the suburbs want to take them over????

I'm sorry to hear about what you and your Mother had to go through. But that's not why some suburban politicians want to take over the water department. They want to do it for the money. Money is the same reason why DPS is taken over every few years. There's always a bond of either a half billion or more on the table at the time of the takeover. Hell, as bad as DDOT is, no one from the burbs is trying to take that over. Why? Because there's no money in it.

[Lowell]

...that's not why some suburban politicians want to take over the water department. They want to do it for the money. Money is the same reason why DPS is taken over every few years. There's always a bond of either a half billion or more on the table at the time of the takeover. Hell, as bad as DDOT is, no one from the burbs is trying to take that over. Why? Because there's no money in it.

Profoundly simple: They want to do it for the money. This is not an us vs. them. It is about the money.

Detroit is also stuck caring for probably 85% of the region's poor, disabled, felons, ex-felons and homeless and being rewarded with obscenely high insurance rates for that service.

I don't seen anyone lining up take any of those over either.

In fact I am having difficulty seeing what Detroit gets out of this deal. A cessation of whining?

Here is a suggestion. Have a limited IPO for the DWSD. Get a valuation and have each community in the system buy shares equivalent to its usage but is also limited to that amount.

Let's say Livonia uses 5% of the system and the value of the system is $10 Billion, Livonia ponies up their $50 million and has a 5% say in the system. Detroit would retain it 25% share and collect $7.5 billion. As a minority shareholder it would only have a quarter of the director seats and policy and rates would be decided by the majority of paying owners of the system.

That's about how it happens in our free market economy, right?

[shovelhead]

Profoundly simple: They want to do it for the money. This is not an us vs. them. It is about the money.

Detroit is also stuck caring for probably 85% of the region's poor, disabled, felons, ex-felons and homeless and being rewarded with obscenely high insurance rates for that service.

I don't seen anyone lining up take any of those over either.

In fact I am having difficulty seeing what Detroit gets out of this deal. A cessation of whining?

Here is a suggestion. Have a limited IPO for the DWSD. Get a valuation and have each community in the system buy shares equivalent to its usage but is also limited to that amount.

Let's say Livonia uses 5% of the system and the value of the system is $10 Billion, Livonia ponies up their $50 million and has a 5% say in the system. Detroit would retain it 25% share and collect $7.5 billion. As a minority shareholder it would only have a quarter of the director seats and policy and rates would be decided by the majority of paying owners of the system.

That's about how it happens in our free market economy, right?

At this point the DWSD would then become a for-profit entity. There would be a lot of negatives then such as loss of tax free status, a board of directors overseeing the operations. The SEC overseeing the IPO, an in-depth analysis of all facets of operation by the SEC before the offering. Previous pension obligations would be another sticking point, most likely IMO Detroit would be on the hook for them. And would the state and federal governments allow this this to happen, the scenario of a quasi-public corporation, a for profit [[now) entity owned by a municipality sold off in shares to other municipalities? Maybe I'm missing something here. Not being sarcastic, I just don't understand.

Another point, the $7.5 billion revenue you theorize that comes available, would that have to be retained by the DWSD and not returned to the city's General Fund? IPO's are launched to take a company public AND to generate funds for development, expansion and day to day operating expenses until the time that it becomes profitable. If the funds were not retained by the DWSD, would the new "company" not be fully funded and loaded down with debt? And what benefit would the city get from this if the generated funds stayed with the DWSD and not to the General Fund? It would lose a source of income thereby reducing funding to other departments. What else generates funds for the city's operation, income and property taxes and operation of DDOT and City Airport. Not enough there to sustain the city's day to day expenses IMO. And again my question comes up, does the MPSC now take control of pricing?


And last of all, what would happen in this scenario, DWSD is sold, offered as a IPO, revenue from the shares sold given to the General Fund instead of the new entity due to a court ruling that the proceeds belong to the city. The new company, in say ten years becomes insolvent. Bankruptcy declared, Now that it is a publicly held company, the assets are sold at public auction, It is either broken up and sold off piecemeal, or a large foreign interest [[say China) buys the whole thing, Then what happens to the whole mess?

Again, no horse in this race, just looking at a bunch of what ifs............

[Hermod]

Detroit is also stuck caring for probably 85% of the region's poor, disabled, felons, ex-felons and homeless and being rewarded with obscenely high insurance rates for that service.

I don't seen anyone lining up take any of those over either.

What per cent of the area poor, disabled, felons, ex-felons, and homeless are generated by Detroit? What per cent are generated elsewhere and moved to Detroit? Should Detroit take care of their own?

I would think that Florida and California would have more of a case to complain about having to take care of others' homeless problems.

[kraig]

What per cent of the area poor, disabled, felons, ex-felons, and homeless are generated by Detroit? What per cent are generated elsewhere and moved to Detroit? Should Detroit take care of their own?

I would think that Florida and California would have more of a case to complain about having to take care of others' homeless problems.

A lot of communities in the metro area have no support system for the homeless or mentally ill, Engler made sure about the latter. Therefore, Detroit becomes the destination for those that have never lived in Detroit, but, have nowhere else to go. A lot of neighboring cities transport their citizens that are unable to care for themselves to Detroit and just leave them there.