Ontario Moves to $15 per hour minimum wage

[Wesley Mouch]

I would note how little the other issues in the labour changes are being touched on [[paid sick days, more vacation after 5 years, equality btw F/T and P/T workers) etc.

I would also like to touch, for those referencing Europe that the entire EU requires 4 weeks paid vacation w/most countries requiring more, in addition to paid state holidays.

All those benefits are really important, and should also be universal in our USofA. The question isn't whether they are 'good'. The question is whether they are best obtained by government dictate, or by the market.

When the government dictates, you get the wondrous taxis that Detroit has. The market delivers Uber. I prefer the market.

[Canadian Visitor]

All those benefits are really important, and should also be universal in our USofA. The question isn't whether they are 'good'. The question is whether they are best obtained by government dictate, or by the market.

When the government dictates, you get the wondrous taxis that Detroit has. The market delivers Uber. I prefer the market.

Under these changes all companies remain free to set their own benefits and wages, they simply can't set them below the legal minimum standard.

No different from mandating that an employee must be given a meal break on a long shift, or be allowed to use a washroom, or that they can't be made to work a 20-hour day.

Businesses retain extraordinary flexibility in what their final package of wages, benefits and hours look like, with the government only intervening to set a rock-bottom where we agree no one should be treated any worse than 'this'.

That is no great imposition on business.

It is sad that its necessary in so far as most businesses have established a lack of willingness to do better on their own. That being the reality, gov't intervention in setting the regulation is needed.

Again, one could go to the Scandinavian models, and impose unionization by sector and full sectoral bargaining.

Technically the government would stay out of it.

However, it still a collective imposition model.

[GMan]

I have nothing against minimum standards but I am curious why this is in the Discuss Detroit section???

[Canadian Visitor]

I have nothing against minimum standards but I am curious why this is in the Discuss Detroit section???

I chose this spot for a couple of reasons.

1) This affects Windsor directly, and is therefore local to Detroit.

2) A change of this type in a region which borders Michigan may allow for or precipitate change [[one of the standard arguments against raising standards being, 'but we have to compete w/those folks right across the state/national boundary')

[GMan]

I chose this spot for a couple of reasons.

1) This affects Windsor directly, and is therefore local to Detroit.

2) A change of this type in a region which borders Michigan may allow for or precipitate change [[one of the standard arguments against raising standards being, 'but we have to compete w/those folks right across the state/national boundary')

Well nothing against the topic, but I have seen some other regional topics moved.

As for competing across borders, only those with means [[cars / education ) can participate in that. I don't think Windsor is going to steal any minimum wage workers from the Det. metro region because of a raise of their minimum wage.

[313WX]

Well nothing against the topic, but I have seen some other regional topics moved.

As for competing across borders, only those with means [[cars / education ) can participate in that. I don't think Windsor is going to steal any minimum wage workers from the Det. metro region because of a raise of their minimum wage.

Besides, post-9/11 border security would make that highly unlikely.

[archfan]

I have nothing against minimum standards but I am curious why this is in the Discuss Detroit section???

Because, if you believe some news sites, raising the minimum wage will cause a complete breakdown in society, leading to savagery and barbarism. Then it's only a matter of time before the hoards cross the Ambassador Bridge...

[Wesley Mouch]

Right under this forum's heading it says:

Since 1999 the Internet's Largest Discussion of all topics relating to the Detroit - Windsor Family of Communities. All Detroit, all the time, all in one place.

Pretty clear to me that this forum includes Windsor.

It also is important to Detroit because our sister city will be experiencing a controversial change to employment, that it warming thought of by all progressives.

Most economics believe that MW increases cost youth jobs. As posted above, some believe that benefits outweight that cost.

I believe that youth employment in Detroit is critical, and that a MW increase isn't in Detroit's benefit. In fact, I believe elimination of this unnecessary and harmful intervention in employment markets disproportionately harms Detroiters.

Its a very important Detroit issue, regardless of your opinion.

[GMan]

Okay Okay I get it. I just wondered why when the impact will have no effect over here. Good luck to our Canadien neighbors, guess this will help them pay for their electricity rates.

[canuck]

Okay Okay I get it. I just wondered why when the impact will have no effect over here. Good luck to our Canadien neighbors, guess this will help them pay for their electricity rates.

Ontario, maybe. Montreal on the other hand is less than half the cost of Detroit's and Toronto's electric bill. The power is overwhelmingly hydroelectric and thus renewable. We got rid of our only nuclear plant recently. No coal, no gas.

Check electric rates on page 11 of this document:

https://issuu.com/hydroquebec/docs/c...51578/39216309

[Wesley Mouch]

Back to MW in Ontario, and by inference, Michigan...

Conservative newspaper Seattle Times cites MW study commissioned by highly conservative City of Seattle via right-wing University of Washington. Done by non-partisan, non-profit National Bureau of Economic Research -- I've no idea who they are.

The problem with studies is that everyone cites only studies that support their position. This supports mine. I don't know the NBER, but if Seattle and UofW hired them, I have to think they're not a conservative anti-fact group.

A key finding: 3% increase in pay for low-wage workers. A 9% reduction in hours. Net 6% earnings loss for low-wage jobs. NBER/Seattle Times..

For an average low-wage worker in Seattle, that translates into a loss of about $125 per month per job.

Citation: UW study finds Seattle’s minimum wage is costing jobs

It is just one study, but if you care for low-wage workers, you may want to reconsider the Fight to $15. It feels good. But it hurts the poor.

[MikeyinBrooklyn]

It is just one study, but if you care for low-wage workers, you may want to reconsider the Fight to $15. It feels good. But it hurts the poor.

The primary motives for leftist leadership [[not rank and file liberals on the street) are NOT to help the poor. They are a) achieving and keeping power, b) making themselves feel good by publicly demonstrating their willingness to spend other people's money to help people, c) punish the perceived affluent [[as defined by anyone having any more than they do). There are a great many things a leftist won't do that would help the poor.

[Wesley Mouch]

The primary motives for leftist leadership [[not rank and file liberals on the street) are NOT to help the poor. They are a) achieving and keeping power, b) making themselves feel good by publicly demonstrating their willingness to spend other people's money to help people, c) punish the perceived affluent [[as defined by anyone having any more than they do). There are a great many things a leftist won't do that would help the poor.

Read a blog post recently wherein the author pointed out that the data from this report shows that MW increases INCREASES INCOME INEQUALITY. Banish the thought!

[Bham1982]

The primary motives for leftist leadership [[not rank and file liberals on the street) are NOT to help the poor. They are a) achieving and keeping power, b) making themselves feel good by publicly demonstrating their willingness to spend other people's money to help people, c) punish the perceived affluent [[as defined by anyone having any more than they do). There are a great many things a leftist won't do that would help the poor.

What on earth is "leftist leadership" in the U.S. context? I mean, is there even such a thing in the U.S.? It sounds like Bigfoot or something.

Hillary Clinton was far to the right of the right-leaning candidates in other First World countries. Angela Merkel is certainly left of Clinton, and she's CDU [[Germany's most conservative major party). If Merkel were running in America she would be considered a pinko Commie.

Is there ANY prominent Leftist in any position of power in the U.S.?
I mean, we already have basically the lowest taxes on the rich in the developed world and the crappiest services for the poor and working class.