What is today's protest At City-County about?

[noise]

Are you unfamiliar with the civilized world? I'm a little confused why you're unaware of the fact that we already do value these rights.

Have you posted a single "fact" in this thread?

I employ around 50 people. I also gladly pay taxes and donate to charities. These are my civic responsibilities. I'm not a selfish leech.

[guito13]

Are you unfamiliar with the civilized world? I'm a little confused why you're unaware of the fact that we already do value these rights.

Have you posted a single "fact" in this thread?

I employ around 50 people. I also gladly pay taxes and donate to charities. These are my civic responsibilities. I'm not a selfish leech.

Do you employ 50 people due to you running your own business or do you "employ" them as you are a manager of them while you work for a bigger entity than just yourself?

IN a civilized world people work for what they have, they do NOT expect others to pay for their expenses.

I pay taxes as well, although not gladly as I think they are misspent. Its my responsibility to take care of my own and help others who TRY and who are down on their luck. It is NOT my responsibility to fund the leeches NOR is it their right to have others pay for their laziness....agree?

[ABetterDetroit]

Attachment 23371
• Increase in the minimum wage to $15/hr and an end to falling wages and unequal two-tier pay schemes -- $7.45 is not enough.

Cmon $7.45 is a joke wage for anyone who can keep a job.
How ironic that the same right wing nut jobs that constantly bitch about the cost of providing for the poor are just as determined to not let the less skilled but willing to work no way out of poverty. Try a little math out for change, how much does it cost of your tax dollars to raise 1 child in poverty? What are that kids chances compared to kids not raised in poverty? What is the cost of that? [[prisons, more kids raised in poverty, etc.) Whats a citizen that pays taxes worth vs. one that just consumes taxes? 3 bucks a hour more for folks that can stay employed isn't going to hurt the economy only help it.

[guito13]

Cmon $7.45 is a joke wage for anyone who can keep a job.
How ironic that the same right wing nut jobs that constantly bitch about the cost of providing for the poor are just as determined to not let the less skilled but willing to work no way out of poverty. Try a little math out for change, how much does it cost of your tax dollars to raise 1 child in poverty? What are that kids chances compared to kids not raised in poverty? What is the cost of that? [[prisons, more kids raised in poverty, etc.) Whats a citizen that pays taxes worth vs. one that just consumes taxes? 3 bucks a hour more for folks that can stay employed isn't going to hurt the economy only help it.

What is your reason for supporting this?

DO you make minimum wage or have you worked hard to better yourself and still think others who dont work to better themselves should get the same beneift as you but without having to work for it?

[noise]

Do you employ 50 people due to you running your own business or do you "employ" them as you are a manager of them while you work for a bigger entity than just yourself?

IN a civilized world people work for what they have, they do NOT expect others to pay for their expenses.

I pay taxes as well, although not gladly as I think they are misspent. Its my responsibility to take care of my own and help others who TRY and who are down on their luck. It is NOT my responsibility to fund the leeches NOR is it their right to have others pay for their laziness....agree?

I own my business.

If you don't like the concept of a "society", you're in for a rough life. We are talking about rights, not "expenses". I'm sorry you don't understand the difference. Go back and re-read the protest statement.

[noise]

What is your reason for supporting this?

DO you make minimum wage or have you worked hard to better yourself and still think others who dont work to better themselves should get the same beneift as you but without having to work for it?

Oh, you're one of those privileged "pull yourself up by the bootstraps" types that doesn't understand their privilege, nor have any knowledge of history or understanding of reality. Carry on.

[guito13]

I own my business.

If you don't like the concept of a "society", you're in for a rough life. We are talking about rights, not "expenses". I'm sorry you don't understand the difference. Go back and re-read the protest statement.

I guess its a fundamental disagreement, I don't believe people deserve a nice home and all their bills paid because they choose to be lazy. My society is one where people try to contribute, not depend on others for their well being.

But since you believe in that, how about you throw a few bucks my way to pay my bills?

[guito13]

Oh, you're one of those privileged "pull yourself up by the bootstraps" types that doesn't understand their privilege, nor have any knowledge of history or understanding of reality. Carry on.

Privileged? Yes, i am privileged to work my ass off, get an education, and get a job to take care of myself an my family. I saw my dad do this. He worked overtime shifts and went to school at night to take care of his family. I saw this and I try to emulate his work ethic.

Everyone has the same privileges as I do. Some choose not to utilize them, and i choose to not want to support or encourage such behavior.

[FlyOnTheWall]

3 bucks a hour more for folks that can stay employed isn't going to hurt the economy only help it.

You really have confused me with this one. $15/hr minus $7.45/hr equals 3 bucks an hour? You did say "Try a little math out for change".

OK, the old math I learned said $15/hr minus $7.45/hr equals $7.55. Over double the current minimum wage. Your math talks of $3.

Oh hell, I never did understand this new math anyway.

[KJ5]

The workers are the makers and the capitalists are the takers. PERIOD.

[EastsideAl]

For the better part of a century, protests and marches were an effective way to get things you wanted. We have now reached the limits of its effectiveness. But they won't believe it until they've tried it a few more times and get nothing more for their efforts.

Yes, it seems the era of protective limited appeasement and co-optation is over. Now we need actual revolution.

[Wesley Mouch]

WE DEMAND:
• Removal of the racist, anti-democratic, anti-worker, pro-bank Emergency Managers from Michigan cities and schools.

We are reaching the end of race as an issue. Now, black men like Orr can be decried as racist. Bravo.

• Defeat of the "Plan of Adjustment" that destroys pensions and loots city assets.
• Banks pay for destroying Detroit neighborhoods and jobs.

I'm with you here. If the city residents want to let the ship sink, I am all in favor. Let the system collapse completely. Marx predicted the collapse of capitalism. The collapse of Detroit would be an odd place to start -- but these are modern time.

• Full support for Public Education and termination of the failed Education Achievement Authority. No to charter schools.

Yes! Children in Detroit deserve no choice in their education. Give them back the DPS with no competition. They deserve it.

• Stop gentrification and the removal of poor and working people from Detroit.

Yes! Detroit's poor should be sentenced to a life in Detroit. They've got it good. Let's not take it away from them. Let's ban any money coming into Detroit to buy homes. Why should we let paradise be sold.

[unclefrank]

I want to the right to free housing, utilities, food, car and insurance. The car has to be a nice one too. In return I promise to lay on my couch all day and watch my free cable. I also promise to get out and vote [[multiple times) for the political party that will make all this possible. My current life of having to work 50 hours plus just to make ends meet is starting to suck. BTW, don't forget my big screen smart phone with no data limit.

[Honky Tonk]

We are reaching the end of race as an issue. Now, black men like Orr can be decried as racist. Bravo.

I'm with you here. If the city residents want to let the ship sink, I am all in favor. Let the system collapse completely. Marx predicted the collapse of capitalism. The collapse of Detroit would be an odd place to start -- buth these are modern time.

Yes! Children in Detroit deserve no choice in their education. Give them back the DPS with no competition. They deserve it.

Yes! Detroit's poor should be sentenced to a life in Detroit. They've got it good. Let's not take it away from them. Let's ban any money coming into Detroit to buy homes. Why should we let paradise be sold.

Bravo..........

[That Great Guy]

Let's change the state constitution to allow County Sales taxes. Then pay a 1 percent tax to pay for a Regional Transit Authority combing DDOT and SMART. This tax will be for Wayne, Oakland, Macomb and Washtenaw Counties and will pay for all community transit needs and line buses and rail. We have an aging population with the baby boomers retiring and now need more options of getting around as opposed to only roads.

This will reinvigorate the City of Detroit by getting those without cars or who rely on mass transit to work. Also, it would create union bus driver jobs and skilled management jobs paying over $100k per year. A boost to our economy in exchange for a small sales tax

[sumas]

I want to the right to free housing, utilities, food, car and insurance. The car has to be a nice one too. In return I promise to lay on my couch all day and watch my free cable. I also promise to get out and vote [[multiple times) for the political party that will make all this possible. My current life of having to work 50 hours plus just to make ends meet is starting to suck. BTW, don't forget my big screen smart phone with no data limit.

Fun stuff, my husband and I collect social security disability, we paid into the system our whole lives. Guess we are entitlement folk now. Nobody pays my cable, discontinued that because we live on our budget, don't have a free phone, sure didn't get a free car, raised two successful kids. So believe what you want, us Detroiters are pure scum according to you. We engage in our community. You have a very strange concept of what is Detroit. Sorry you work 50 plus hours, been there done that ourselves. Quit thinking Detroit's poor gets great stuff. That is so not real.

[Hermod]

Try a little math out for change, how much does it cost of your tax dollars to raise 1 child in poverty? What are that kids chances compared to kids not raised in poverty? What is the cost of that? [[prisons, more kids raised in poverty, etc.)

Well, if I thought that the tax dollars spent would go directly to giving that kid a chance to raise himself out of poverty and not to just funding his parent[[s) lifestyle choices, I might not begrudge the spending.

[Hermod]

Let's change the state constitution to allow County Sales taxes. Then pay a 1 percent tax to pay for a Regional Transit Authority combing DDOT and SMART. This tax will be for Wayne, Oakland, Macomb and Washtenaw Counties and will pay for all community transit needs and line buses and rail. We have an aging population with the baby boomers retiring and now need more options of getting around as opposed to only roads.

This will reinvigorate the City of Detroit by getting those without cars or who rely on mass transit to work. Also, it would create union bus driver jobs and skilled management jobs paying over $100k per year. A boost to our economy in exchange for a small sales tax

You keep this rant on "standby paste" for every thread you visit!

[Hermod]

The workers are the makers and the capitalists are the takers. PERIOD.

We could give the "workers" the Packard factory and let them start building cars without any capital or supervisors. They could pay themselves maximum wages. Wow, utopia will arrive.

[Hermod]

I pay taxes as well, although not gladly as I think they are misspent. Its my responsibility to take care of my own and help others who TRY and who are down on their luck. It is NOT my responsibility to fund the leeches NOR is it their right to have others pay for their laziness....agree?

Well, I am firmly of the belief that society [[as represented by the government) should be the feeder, houser [[is that a word?), and employer of "last resort". It doesn't mean that the food is necessarily that which the recipient wants, the "house" is in the location or the style the recipient wants [[and he/she may find the standards for sanitation irksome) , and the work may be more unpleasant than the recipient wants.

[guito13]

Well, I am firmly of the belief that society [[as represented by the government) should be the feeder, houser [[is that a word?), and employer of "last resort". It doesn't mean that the food is necessarily that which the recipient wants, the "house" is in the location or the style the recipient wants [[and he/she may find the standards for sanitation irksome) , and the work may be more unpleasant than the recipient wants.

SO who pays the government this money to take care of people who CHOOSE not to work? ME and maybe you? So take off of my plate, of which I am working hard to keep full, to give to others who "deserve" this....

No.

[noise]

I guess its a fundamental disagreement, I don't believe people deserve a nice home and all their bills paid because they choose to be lazy. My society is one where people try to contribute, not depend on others for their well being.

But since you believe in that, how about you throw a few bucks my way to pay my bills?

Oddly enough, nobody is protesting those things. You're making things up, which is what your types do.

[Hermod]

SO who pays the government this money to take care of people who CHOOSE not to work? ME and maybe you? So take off of my plate, of which I am working hard to keep full, to give to others who "deserve" this....

No.

Part of what we pay for a society. I don't want the homeless panhandling on the streets. I do agree with the old strictures for government support such as "taking the pauper's oath" and a system of work houses/poor houses/poor farms [[operated in a sanitary manner and with adequate nutrition). Yes, we have to pay taxes for that just as we pay taxes to support education, public safety [[police, fire/EMS), public roads, water and sewer, and the other elements of a society which isn't just "every man for himself".

In return, the government has to be a "good steward" of our tax monies [[of which the government of Detroit has obviously failed).

[noise]

It's not worth discussing these issues with guito13. [[S)he's the type that believes all poor people are "lazy".

I wonder if guito13 is a white laborer. Or "working class" as some call it.

[TKshreve]

You are a bunch of NOISE, no logic, no facts, just catch phrases that are par for the course. You think you have the "Natural Right" to have someone work to provide you with water and shelter?? Who do you think should do that work for you, slaves?

I have to say, good question. Where do all these naturally occurring goods come from?

Originally Posted by noise
Oh, you're one of those privileged "pull yourself up by the bootstraps" types that doesn't understand their privilege, nor have any knowledge of history or understanding of reality. Carry on.

I have to SMH every time I hear this phrase dismissed by posters. That's exactly what people down on their luck should do!

Are you saying someone else should pull these "unfortunate" peoples bootstraps up for them? What are you implying? Because it certainly doesn't sound like anything progressive at all. It sounds defeatist.

It's not worth discussing these issues with guito13. [[S)he's the type that believes all poor people are "lazy".

You have it backwards. Guito believes all lazy people are poor. And they should have no say in their standard of living, because they don't really give a F*&% where and when it matters.