More luxury homes are going on the market in Metro Detroit as sales accelerate.

[Shollin]

The vast majority of Metro Detroit residents don't live in urban wastelands or the exurban fringe.

I'm not saying we should force people to move anywhere, but I personally don't understand why people prefer to pay big bucks for crappy construction in the middle of nowhere, instead of an established neighborhood in a nicer community.

For example, why not Farmington Hills instead of Milford? Taxes are higher, but almost everything else is better. I don't getting paying 500k to live next to junkyards and trailer parks.

I just find the irony by some on here judging and criticizing these people. These people can easily say they cannot understand paying $1700 a month to live in Detroit which has no city services and could be insolvent in a month or two. If I had money I would buy in Grosse Pointe but I'm not going to sit on my high horse and judge people who live north of 59.

[Bham1982]

I just find the irony by some on here judging and criticizing these people.

I'm just giving my opinion. I'm not saying they're bad people or anything; I just don't get the mindset.

If I had money I would buy in Grosse Pointe but I'm not going to sit on my high horse and judge people who live north of 59.

This is kinda my point, though. Grosse Pointe is often the same price or cheaper than these new communities. Why does a family-sized house in GP cost the same as a crapbox in Milford?

I'm just saying that in most metros, the highest cost housing tends to be in older suburbs or [[in a few cases) the city center. It's probably true that the $1 million+ housing in Metro Detroit tends to be in Bloomfield-Birmingham-Franklin-Orchard Lake-GP Shores, but, below that level, a lot of folks want to want to live in some giant McMansion in Northville Township or something.

[p69rrh51]

I wonder how much the value of "classic" Detroit homes has held up over the last seven years. What does it cost a year to heat and maintain those Boston Edison homes?

Depends on the size of the home. There are homes ranging from 1,500 Sq.Ft. to 20, 0000 Sq. Ft. and of course they are 80-100 years old more or less.

[JVB]

Many people don't want to live in Grosse Pointe because you're literally blocks away from Beirut. Plus taxes in Grosse Pointe tend to be a lot higher than many suburbs. I would never want to live way out like Milford though.

[Bham1982]

Many people don't want to live in Grosse Pointe because you're literally blocks away from Beirut. Plus taxes in Grosse Pointe tend to be a lot higher than many suburbs.

Yeah, proximity to Detroit probably does depress prices somewhat. Taxes are higher, but services and schools are like 10,000 times better than in some township.

And intangibles like architectural quality, community feel, and beauty are off the charts compared to the exurbs. I would personally prefer a real neighborhood, with a history and dependible services.

[Johnnny5]

Yeah, I'm not anti-luxury home construction.

I just don't personally understand the "mansion in farmland" phenomenon. It's not like these areas have good services, good schools, or really anything appealing outside of low taxes. They have horrible traffic, no stores or restaurants, and are a million miles from anything.

I have friends that bought in the Milford area, and to me, it's just awful. The schools aren't really good [[Wixom schools), there are no services [[good luck when it snows), traffic on I-96 is horrendous, and all the homes look like cardboard boxes. Their home is huge, but they can't afford to furnish all the rooms. It's supposedly "luxury living" but there are trailer parks and junkyards everywhere. Oh, well.

Sorry, but you are seriously misinformed if you actually believe anything you just posted. For starters Wixom does not have it's own school district. I assume if you are not aware of that fact I doubt you are aware how well the schools compare to others. [[Wixom is served by Huron Valley, Walled Lake and Novi Community Schools).
I live in Milford on the edge of Wixom and have to say that the local services here and there are both top notch! The roads get plowed, the pot holes get fixed quickly and "No stores or restaurants"?????? Every other freaking building in Milford is a restaurant! As for shopping it's a 15 minute drive to the mother of all shopping districts in Novi and there are also many locally owned retailers as well as big box stores within 5 minutes of my home in Milford. "Junk yards and trailer parks everywhere?" Please let me know where you saw the junk yards, I'm always looking for a deal on parts. Unfortunately, I only know of one scrap yard in all of Milford and Wixom and it's on a road that I'm rather certain you have not driven. There are 3 trailer parks in Wixom and Milford, two of them are side by side off of Wixom Road and the other is off of Old Plank on the edge of Milford.

Cardboard boxes for homes? Yeah, I do have to admit there are quite a few cookie cutter vinyl sided subdivisions, but there are also lots of homes here from the mid to late 1800's, million dollar lakefront homes, large well built homes on acreage, affordable condominiums and apartments and more. If all you're looking for are Pulte track homes then I guess that's all you are going to see. Same as some suburbanites bragging about the burned out vacant lots they saw on their trip to Detroit won't even mention the well kept homes that sat across the street.

[p69rrh51]

Many people don't want to live in Grosse Pointe because you're literally blocks away from Beirut. Plus taxes in Grosse Pointe tend to be a lot higher than many suburbs.

Living a block and a half away from "Beirut" as you call it does have its moments, but then I leave my front door open most nice days, and I do not worry to much about crime[[yes there is a crime but the pointes usually we have less crimes per 1000 residents than Bloomfield or Birmingham). What most do not care for are the lack of amenities such as restaurants.
As for taxes yes they are higher than most but you also get more bang for you buck mainly the schools!

[Shollin]

It's funny people talk about Grosse Pointe's proximity to Detroit yet crime rates are incredibly low. Grosse Pointe has managed to keep Detroit out. Harper Woods fell to Detroit but Grosse Pointe is holding strong. If you live up by Vernier and Jefferson, you're kind of far from Detroit.

[Bham1982]

Sorry, but you are seriously misinformed if you actually believe anything you just posted. For starters Wixom does not have it's own school district. I assume if you are not aware of that fact I doubt you are aware how well the schools compare to others. [[Wixom is served by Huron Valley, Walled Lake and Novi Community Schools).

Their kids attend Walled Lake Schools. The school is in Wixom, so I thought it's Wixom schools, but it's Walled Lake. The scores are less than impressive.

I live in Milford on the edge of Wixom and have to say that the local services here and there are both top notch! The roads get plowed, the pot holes get fixed quickly and "No stores or restaurants"?????? Every other freaking building in Milford is a restaurant!

I don't think most would agree with this. Services are generally poor in low tax jurisdictions. No taxes means no services. You're talking volunteer firefighters, limited pickup schedules, poor libraries and the like.

Re. restaurants I know that area, and there are barely any restaurants except for the fried fast food crap on the I-96 exits. Good luck getting something outside of Dominos or McDonalds.

"Junk yards and trailer parks everywhere?" Please let me know where you saw the junk yards, I'm always looking for a deal on parts.

Drive along I-96 and there are big junkyards of rusting equipment past Beck Rd. There's another big one closer to the Milford exit. It looks junky along that whole stretch. You also have the giant power lines towering over 96.

I know of trailer parks off Wixom Rd., Napier Rd. and 8 Mile, and all are next to "luxury" new home developments. I personally couldn't see spending 500k to live next to trailers.

[iheartthed]

Of the few glimmers of hope I had for this region was that this type of stupid development was dead, buried, and never to return. Guess I was wrong.


http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2...text|FRONTPAGE

I've said it before, but they never fixed the problem to begin with. Time for that Detroit area green belt...

[JVB]

Living a block and a half away from "Beirut" as you call it does have its moments, but then I leave my front door open most nice days, and I do not worry to much about crime[[yes there is a crime but the pointes usually we have less crimes per 1000 residents than Bloomfield or Birmingham). What most do not care for are the lack of amenities such as restaurants.
As for taxes yes they are higher than most but you also get more bang for you buck mainly the schools!

It's funny people talk about Grosse Pointe's proximity to Detroit yet crime rates are incredibly low. Grosse Pointe has managed to keep Detroit out. Harper Woods fell to Detroit but Grosse Pointe is holding strong. If you live up by Vernier and Jefferson, you're kind of far from Detroit.

I'm not referring to the crime, just the proximity is enough to make many people with kids leery. If you live near Windmill Point in one of the nicest parts of Grosse Pointe what do you tell your kids? "Whatever you do when you ride your bike up the street DO NOT TURN LEFT!". Seems silly to have that much money and live in such a Dickensian area.

[iheartthed]

I'm not referring to the crime, just the proximity is enough to make many people with kids leery. If you live near Windmill Point in one of the nicest parts of Grosse Pointe what do you tell your kids? "Whatever you do when you ride your bike up the street DO NOT TURN LEFT!". Seems silly to have that much money and live in such a Dickensian area.

Just curious, exactly how often does a kid from the Pointes get harmed by a "Detroiter"?

[Shollin]

Just curious, exactly how often does a kid from the Pointes get harmed by a "Detroiter"?

I thought I just heard recently that a 12 year old Grosse Pointe girl was attacked by a Detroiter. I remember the discussion on here because more people were upset that the parent called Detroit third world than the fact a 12 year old was attacked.

[Detroitnerd]

I wonder how much the value of "classic" Detroit homes has held up over the last seven years. What does it cost a year to heat and maintain those Boston Edison homes?

Can't win an argument? Change the subject.

[p69rrh51]

I'm not referring to the crime, just the proximity is enough to make many people with kids leery. If you live near Windmill Point in one of the nicest parts of Grosse Pointe what do you tell your kids? "Whatever you do when you ride your bike up the street DO NOT TURN LEFT!". Seems silly to have that much money and live in such a Dickensian area.

My wife's cousin lived on Barrington a few homes from Windmill Pointe for almost 20 years and his backyard butted up to the homes on Alter. He was never broken into, and his children were never harmed. All the kids in the area do know not to go past Barrington although Alter is a quiet neighborhood. The only problem are the parks at the foot of Alter and there is not an easy way to get to them from Windmill Pointe. But then with Windmill Pointe and Patterson Parks why would they want to go to Detroit?

[Detroitnerd]

I just find the irony by some on here judging and criticizing these people. These people can easily say they cannot understand paying $1700 a month to live in Detroit which has no city services and could be insolvent in a month or two. If I had money I would buy in Grosse Pointe but I'm not going to sit on my high horse and judge people who live north of 59.

Shollin, there are more choices than exurbs and Detroit. You do understand that, yes? Because it seems whenever anybody on this thread has criticized the choice of living in exurbia, you bring up the city of Detroit, as if that's the only other choice.

There are lots of choices. We have a huge oversupply of exurban McMansions, and if you read the literature on the next generation of homebuyers, you'll find this is the type of housing for which there is the bleakest prognosis. As others have pointed out, buying in the second or third ring of suburbia often offers a better mix of amenities for the price you pay. Some people prefer first-ring: For instance look at all the drinking and dining choices in Ferndale that have cropped up over the last five years.

And, sure, some people prefer Detroit, but I don't think we're discussing that. You and Hermod seem to be the only ones determined to bring that up.

[Detroitnerd]

Many people don't want to live in Grosse Pointe because you're literally blocks away from Beirut.

Hahahahaha.

[Hermod]

Can't win an argument? Change the subject.

I don't see where that is changing the subject. The argument was that exurban homes cost too much to maintain and heat and their value was dropping. I made the observation that the same could apply to 5,000 sq ft houses in the D.

[Detroitnerd]

I don't see where that is changing the subject. The argument was that exurban homes cost too much to maintain and heat and their value was dropping. I made the observation that the same could apply to 5,000 sq ft houses in the D.

You see, we were talking about exurbia. The original post was about exurbia. The discussion it engendered was about exurbia. The aesthetic discussion was about exurbia. And that's why bringing up homes that are as far away from exurbia as you can get is called CHANGING THE SUBJECT.

You simply cannot get any more disingenuous, Hermod.

[Hermod]

are you kidding me ? some people never learn.
wayyyyyy too much house, 5 bedrooms 5 baths. unless they have 4 kids whats the point , then you are still going to be stuck with it in 20 years once the kids are gone .
Didn't we already go through this ?

Some times an empty nester needs a place to keep his beloved books.

Attachment 16577

[Shollin]

Shollin, there are more choices than exurbs and Detroit. You do understand that, yes? Because it seems whenever anybody on this thread has criticized the choice of living in exurbia, you bring up the city of Detroit, as if that's the only other choice.

There are lots of choices. We have a huge oversupply of exurban McMansions, and if you read the literature on the next generation of homebuyers, you'll find this is the type of housing for which there is the bleakest prognosis. As others have pointed out, buying in the second or third ring of suburbia often offers a better mix of amenities for the price you pay. Some people prefer first-ring: For instance look at all the drinking and dining choices in Ferndale that have cropped up over the last five years.

And, sure, some people prefer Detroit, but I don't think we're discussing that. You and Hermod seem to be the only ones determined to bring that up.

These inner ring suburbs don't offer the same as exurbia. I raised two kids in Harper Woods in a 1000 square foot house and there were a lot of times I wish I had a larger house with a larger lot for them to play in. My point is people on this forum like to praise any apartment building that opens in Detroit and then points there finger at people who want to build their own home in exurbia. I find the irony amusing.

[Hermod]

You see, we were talking about exurbia. The original post was about exurbia. The discussion it engendered was about exurbia. The aesthetic discussion was about exurbia. And that's why bringing up homes that are as far away from exurbia as you can get is called CHANGING THE SUBJECT.


You simply cannot get any more disingenuous, Hermod.

No, you spurious sophist, the attack on exurbia was made because it was detrimental to the "holy city" and the main disadvantages listed for a 5,000 sq ft house in exurbia was that it cost too much in maintenance and that the heating expense was too much. In addition, it was decried that the value of such homes had declined drastically since 2006. I thereupon compared a 5,000 sq ft home in exurbia to a 5,000 sq ft home in Brazzaville on the Detroit River where the upkeep, heating bills, and taxes were a big bite out of an annual income and the intrinsic value was depreciating faster than an ice cream cone on an hot August day.

[Bham1982]

These inner ring suburbs don't offer the same as exurbia. I raised two kids in Harper Woods in a 1000 square foot house and there were a lot of times I wish I had a larger house with a larger lot for them to play in.

I agree that 1,000 ft. is small, but then why 5,000 ft? I just don't get the huge jump in size, when 90% of the homes are between these two extremes.

I don't see why a typical family needs these huge homes. If they want to buy it, fine, but in many cases I see they can't even afford to furnish the place.

Keep in mind that the majority of U.S. households have no children. So the "typical" household in 2012 is childless, and that should be the focus of most homebuilders. Given the demographic realities, what's the point of a giant house unless you're some big-bucks baller?

[Det_ard]

I will never get this sort of lifestyle either, and am mystified that it has returned so quickly.

Who on earth would spend over $2 million for a crappily constructed home in a township with poor services and declining schools? Why does anyone need 7500 ft.? What does that cost to heat in the winter?

I don't see how "normal people" [[meaning almost everyone, so household incomes below 200k and net worth below a million) want a home with more than 4,000 ft. What do you do with all that space?

If you're some millionaire baller, then good for you, but I don't understand your run-of-the mill professional, even with good incomes, buying some 5,000 square foot home in some godforsaken township, across from cows and trailer parks, and with all that space for nothing.

Hell of an opening strawman, Bham. The article referenced in the original post discusses a home in West Bloomfield at Walnut Lake and Halstead. Schools and services are considered good relative to most other suburbs and the city.

You assume the home has "crappy construction". Why? While it is possible to build a modern home poorly, or use the cheapest materials, the pricey new homes I've been in have been well-constructed with quality materials. The old=good, new=crap viewpoint is uninformed. For every knockout Palmer Woods mansion there are 100 Brightmoor shacks. The "solid" 1920's brick EEV house may have solid oak doors and leaded glass built-in bookcases but may also have undersized floor joists, sagging 2x4 roof rafters, asbestos in the vermiculite insulation [[if it had any insulation at all), absent or poorly designed duct runs, asbestos wrapped hot water pipes, leaky windows, overall poor energy efficiency for the size, dangerous knob-and-tube wiring, lead water supply piping, tiny closets, a "penalty-box" kitchen designed to keep the little woman hidden, too few bathrooms for today's family needs, or other common old house maladies. I generally prefer old house styles to newer styles but you have to accept the negatives too.

In that area of West Bloomfield there are a lot of Chaldean families where the adult children often live with the parents. It's common to have three generations in the house. So if they can afford it, what business is it of ours how they choose to live?

You ask why does any one need 7500 sqft. You might as well ask why does anyone need 7500 songs on their iPod? Or 15 watches, or 50 pairs of shoes, or 8 bikes or a top of the line Mac when a simple PC will do what most users need. It seems a little intrusive and intolerant to be so concerned with how others choose to live their private lives and allocate their funds.

I have a suggestion for all those who are so mystified as to why some people choose to live as they do. Take the opportunity to actually find out. Talk to them with an open mind. Leave your biases and preconceived notions at home. Discover what their priorities and values are, what makes them tick and why they've made the choices they've made. It might be an eye-opening experience for you. They're not some strange offshoot of the human race. Your inability to understand them [[not simply create a self-serving caricature) is more a reflection of your efforts thus far than of their "otherness".

Then again, it can be entertaining to poke fun at the "others", so keep chucking stereotypes out there until you feel sufficiently superior.

[poobert]

I thought I just heard recently that a 12 year old Grosse Pointe girl was attacked by a Detroiter. I remember the discussion on here because more people were upset that the parent called Detroit third world than the fact a 12 year old was attacked.

There was no proof he was a Detroiter other than he was black. He could have easily been from Grosse Pointe, Harper Woods, or Timbuktu for that matter.

Whether you live in Boston Edison or Brownstown I don't think anyone here should really be happy about these new developments [[mutations, perhaps?). There is already way too much supply and not enough demand with the housing stock in the region. Your property values and mine will likely continue to suffer.

Yet for a few pests here their first, tired old recourse is to slam Detroit, for no apparent reason other than it's what they know.