Small guerrilla art project on Chene near Ferry.

[Stosh]

If you don't like this "vandalism," don't worry. The firebugs who have been burning every building along Chene, McDougall and Mount Elliott will clear away all that "vandalism" within the next year or two.

I'm sorry, but calling these guys' work vandalism strikes me as disproportionate. You know: How dare the people who live in the neighborhood appropriate empty buildings slated for arson!

I didn't respond to that. I responded to your flippant attitude toward vandalism in general. I noticed that you didn't reply to the legalization of graffiti. Maybe the "red light" district and the grafitti "artists" can have a field day there, as well in your own neighborhood.

It's a damn shame that the area is pretty much devoid of the buildings that once made it a great place to live, work, and shop. And it's attitudes like yours, and others, that made it that way. Any time you allow a crime to take place, even seemingly harmless ones, that decreases the chances of a neighborhood's survival.

The horror of Chene is that it was allowed to happen by the people who abandoned it. And those that remained behind, or moved in didn't care enough or was afraid to say anyting about the decay and crime.

My take on all this is that there are people in the city as well as others outside that like fires, and are picking the easy targets, with no eyes on the ground. Or uncaring eyes. Also, the homeless have a tendency to burn buildings down as well, on accident.

[Detroitnerd]

I didn't respond to that. I responded to your flippant attitude toward vandalism in general. I noticed that you didn't reply to the legalization of graffiti. Maybe the "red light" district and the grafitti "artists" can have a field day there, as well in your own neighborhood.

May I kindly ask you where I've exhibited a flippant attitude toward vandalism? To my knowledge, this is my first post on this thread.

It's a damn shame that the area is pretty much devoid of the buildings that once made it a great place to live, work, and shop. And it's attitudes like yours, and others, that made it that way. Any time you allow a crime to take place, even seemingly harmless ones, that decreases the chances of a neighborhood's survival.

That's a little strange to me. First of all, I wonder if you even know my attitudes. Second, these art projects are the work of people who live in the neighborhood. They were likely the same ones who put little fake cakes in the window of a nearby bakery as a gag. [[Anything to make it look occupied -- but the arsonists hit it anyway.) They are the REASON for that neighborhood's continued survival, and they are doing creative things to create little signs that there are people there.

The horror of Chene is that it was allowed to happen by the people who abandoned it. And those that remained behind, or moved in didn't care enough or was afraid to say anyting about the decay and crime.

What do people do about decay? Well, I thought it was pretty creative to give the bakery the appearance of having stock, with their cupcake sculptures. They're the ones reporting the crime, trying to balk arson, and then when they do art projects people blame them for this "vandalism"? That's odd to my mind.

My take on all this is that there are people in the city as well as others outside that like fires, and are picking the easy targets, with no eyes on the ground. Or uncaring eyes. Also, the homeless have a tendency to burn buildings down as well, on accident.

Well, looking up and done the main drags between St. Aubin and Mount Elliott, my guess is that people are being paid to start these fires. Not the people who live there, mind you. I've talked to some of them and it seems to be their theory too. But don't be upset by one little act of artistic "vandalism." See for yourself. Walk down Farnsworth on the block west of Moran and you'll see a thriving community with almost every house occupied. Those are likely your "vandals." You know: The people who don't care about the neighborhood.

[Stosh]

May I kindly ask you where I've exhibited a flippant attitude toward vandalism? To my knowledge, this is my first post on this thread.

Sorry, but it's just a little hard to distinguish who's who when you are pissed off. I guess that is just my fault for not distinguishing that. But defending this is like defending someone that litters.

That's a little strange to me. First of all, I wonder if you even know my attitudes. Second, these art projects are the work of people who live in the neighborhood. They were likely the same ones who put little fake cakes in the window of a nearby bakery as a gag. [[Anything to make it look occupied -- but the arsonists hit it anyway.) They are the REASON for that neighborhood's continued survival, and they are doing creative things to create little signs that there are people there

.

I don't mind the cakes. That was a nice gesture, considering it is what it once was, a bakery. I don't mind art projects. I am not a fan of general grafitti, as you may have noticed, or even cared about. They put those in the window after it was demolished.

What do people do about decay? Well, I thought it was pretty creative to give the bakery the appearance of having stock, with their cupcake sculptures. They're the ones reporting the crime, trying to balk arson, and then when they do art projects people blame them for this "vandalism"? That's odd to my mind.

The cakes were removable. The paintings, probably not.

Well, looking up and done the main drags between St. Aubin and Mount Elliott, my guess is that people are being paid to start these fires. Not the people who live there, mind you. I've talked to some of them and it seems to be their theory too. But don't be upset by one little act of artistic "vandalism." See for yourself. Walk down Farnsworth on the block west of Moran and you'll see a thriving community with almost every house occupied. Those are likely your "vandals."

I doubt that these properties are even privately owned now. I'll look and see, but that's debatable. Hard to have a profit motive when there is no profit. Or even minimum worth. Who would insure these?

[Pam]

Funny pictures on a removable plywood sheet!

Yeah, they seem to be sticking to drawing on those and not the buildings themselves. So I'm not quite sure how it qualifies as defacing or vandalising the buildings.

[Detroitnerd]

I doubt that these properties are even privately owned now. I'll look and see, but that's debatable. Hard to have a profit motive when there is no profit. Or even minimum worth. Who would insure these?

The suspicion I heard was that if the buildings were burned down, the parcels would be cleared and then the land would likely be easier to develop. Not saying it's true, but just restating some of the fears of these local residents.

And, as for that "vandalism," these people appear to be covering holes in the buildings to secure them, then decorating the boards.

Again, looking into the matter, learning what's happening, meeting the people and making reasoned decisions is a whole lot better than taking instant hip shots under the "broken windows" theory. Especially when it seems as though you agree with the very people you're wagging a finger at.

Just sayin'.

[Jimaz]

Here's the Google Street View of the building for those who want to scan the area.

[Stosh]

The suspicion I heard was that if the buildings were burned down, the parcels would be cleared and then the land would likely be easier to develop. Not saying it's true, but just restating some of the fears of these local residents.

And, as for that "vandalism," these people appear to be covering holes in the buildings to secure them, then decorating the boards.

Again, looking into the matter, learning what's happening, meeting the people and making reasoned decisions is a whole lot better than taking instant hip shots under the "broken windows" theory. Especially when it seems as though you agree with the very people you're wagging a finger at.

Just sayin'.

Hmmm so you've heard of the theory. Good job.

I'd sooner them take up residence in one of the non burnt buildings and teach the residents how to paint. Or something. Partner with some of the myriad churches down there for a neighborhood watch, for what it's worth. Symbolic acts are nice, warm and fuzzy... but really, what is being accomplished with what amounts to photo ops?

[Jimaz]

A block south of there there's what appears to be a security guard overlooking a delivery to a party store. Now that's just plain sad.

But a block to the east there's a woman sweeping the street!

[n7hn]

some have asked what good is the "graffitti/Vandalism"...... from afar looks like its bringing residents together to strengthen the sense of community as well as provide supervision and direction to kids..... shame on them

[Django]

More work today was done, this time I helped out. Im thinking of starting a simple Facebook page for anyone who wants to get involved in brightening up the strip.

Looking for ideas, paint, lumber and labor.

Stay tuned if interested.

Stosh, maybe you can contribute in your own way somehow.

[Meddle]

One's a new bridge, the other an abandoned building, but otherwise, what is the difference:

http://www.detroityes.com/mb/showthr...light=grafitti

[Stosh]

Stosh- Have you never been to St Louis or to Culver's restaurants? Concrete cakes are basically ice cream cakes. You suburbanites are always on the prowl to ruin anything good happening in the city. Grow up

Yes, we are. Always, looking to put down what we can.

Last time I looked, concrete wasn't ice cream. If it were, there would be a lot of difficulties keeping roads together.... or maybe that's what "rocky road" ice cream is for?

Have some more wine and cheese. Or maybe some face paint?

It seems to be on the forclosure list for Wayne county.
http://www.waynecounty.com/mygovt/tr...Foreclosed.pdf

Now if these people wanted to, the property next door, the former bakery, has been foreclosed for 6500 dollars. The upstairs was once a dance hall back in the day.

[Gannon]

I hung out with the amazing curvy dame and her friend last night for a while during and after that heavy storm, and heard the whole story of how this developed...how the neighborhood children wandered by one-by-one, steadily collecting into the group Django photographed.

They started making suggestions [[don't know exactly how that started, I think the sketch-dude asked them for help), and he drew whatever they said, sometimes hilariously precisely taking their language and translating it to pictures [[you'd have been proud of this exact use of words, Ravine!).

For instance, after a slew of oddly violent requests [[these children are all from Farnsworth, and their parents are mostly non-violent war protesters, and keep the kids from bad tv and video games), one young lady asked for a pile of 'smoking' pancakes. So, he stuck a cigarette in the middle of the stack.

Later on, they realized she might've meant 'steaming' instead of 'smoking', so damn the literal interpretations! But at least it turned the suggestions towards food instead of warring creatures, the next girl wanted waffles.


All in all, it was an impromptu outreach to the children [[which it was never INTENDED to be), and quite the Rorschach Test of them, too! And it made both a visually exciting improvement to the overall destruction of Chene Street AND a great conversation starter here and during a rainstorm-enabled spur-of-the-moment neighborly meetup.


To this gadfly and rogue philosopher, that ain't nothin' but a GOOD thing!


Cheers

[Gannon]

Well, "curvy" wasn't really a quote; I didn't actually hear, or read, anyone use that word. I was facetiously employing the current euphemism.

And please note that I am backward-bending my poor, time-ravaged vertebrae, to a most excruciating angle, in the effort to overlook the fact that you appear to be giving me an order.

Consider him your verbal yoga coach, sounds like you needed this bend and more, you're getting less flexible over time!

[Sstashmoo]

Quote: "You suburbanites are always on the prowl to ruin anything good happening in the city. "

Translated: Something really post-apocalyptic looking that I can take pictures of and post on internet forums.

When prospective investors look at these properties that are tagged, it says something loudly: Keep out. Just because you taggers and photographers have given up on the areas, doesn't mean everyone else has.

[Detroitej72]

Any way you slice it, the painted boards sure make the area more appealing to the eye than a bunch of wide open burnt-out buildings.

I think these residents have turned something negative into a positive, but then again, some folks think the world renowned Heidelberg Project is a dump as well...

[Bearinabox]

Quote: "You suburbanites are always on the prowl to ruin anything good happening in the city. "

Translated: Something really post-apocalyptic looking that I can take pictures of and post on internet forums.

When prospective investors look at these properties that are tagged, it says something loudly: Keep out. Just because you taggers and photographers have given up on the areas, doesn't mean everyone else has.

I snorted audibly at the mention of "prospective investors." Have you been anywhere near Chene St. in the last two decades, Sstash?

[Det_ard]

I realize the artist-types want to make art, but if it were my neighborhood I'd rather see them devote their time and money to mowing an overgrown park or fixing up an elderly person's home. Lawn mowing and house repair isn't very sexy but the art projects seem to satisfy the artists' needs more than the needs of the people who live in the neighborhood. A bit selfish if you ask me.

[malmarson]

How about a post from someone who actually tried to take care of Zaremski's-the spot with the cartoons on-me and my brother, for the actual owner, good old Richard? [[Though I think Zaremski's is now lost to the county on unpaid taxes.)

The things about that building on Chene-the cool old vintage clothes, the old wood fixtures, the endless collections of Chene history, the roof-top garden-which, I noticed, a bit may be still existing on the scrap of roof of Zaremski's-went up in smoke 2 years ago. We gave up trying then to keep the building's boarded up. I think the barbershop across the street is the business now trying to clean things up on Chene.

If anyone should be asked if they like or don't like the cartoon mural, it should be them. Myself, since I can't go back into Zaremski's anymore to look for vintage bras with Richard, I like the idea of anything that makes Chene look better.

PS-If anyone wants a history of the area, U of M is collecting information on a Chene history project.

[Sstashmoo]

Quote: "I snorted audibly at the mention of "prospective investors.""

How loud did you snort when they erected the Casino's in that shithole?

[Vox]

How about a post from someone who actually tried to take care of Zaremski's-the spot with the cartoons on-me and my brother, for the actual owner, good old Richard? [[Though I think Zaremski's is now lost to the county on unpaid taxes.)

The things about that building on Chene-the cool old vintage clothes, the old wood fixtures, the endless collections of Chene history, the roof-top garden-which, I noticed, a bit may be still existing on the scrap of roof of Zaremski's-went up in smoke 2 years ago. We gave up trying then to keep the building's boarded up. I think the barbershop across the street is the business now trying to clean things up on Chene.

If anyone should be asked if they like or don't like the cartoon mural, it should be them. Myself, since I can't go back into Zaremski's anymore to look for vintage bras with Richard, I like the idea of anything that makes Chene look better.

PS-If anyone wants a history of the area, U of M is collecting information on a Chene history project.

You speak of Richard H. I am assuming?

And that collection project is closed from what I have gathered.

[malmarson]

Okay!!!!! I think I should continue this, for those who don't know some of the details of the area...

I live, and have lived near Chene almost all my life. My brother has owned and maintained businesses in the area since 1980. Because of this, and because of people he knows/knew, I know part of the histories of a lot of those buisinesses on Chene. I can't share privileged info. However, I can say some of the buildings have been long lost to the county on taxes. Someone, who I know, and rather love/hate [[very very long story), bought up a lot of Chene a while ago, and went wayyyy over his head. Some, but not all of the sadness of what happened to Chene was the hardheadness of a guy who thought he and his rather sad sack friends could do it all in taking care of Chene and was wrong.

Then, he [[the Chene owner) got into trouble. Then, he got very very sick. He no longer can handle taking care of buildings-that's all I can say without violating his privacy. My brother had someone watch and board up the corner of Chene and Palmer when he could, but, we weren't being reimburshed for it: we have our own area we also take care of. Then, the two guys, who were watching the place for our friend both died. Like I said, the big arson fire at Zaremski just was like the last straw of thousands of trying to help a screw-up....

I've been in a lot of those buildings, with that no longer owner of them. They were built to last. One of

So: in conclusion-I do have an idea what the last owner of Zaremski's would say about the art. He'd say: Nice, but Chene and I are both Polish. Also, I have a degree in Art History [[no lie, he does.)How about some Polish motifs? A big red Polish Eagle would be nice.

[malmarson]

Oh-just saw this: yes, I speak of Richard H.

Hm, I didn't know the project on Chene through U of M shut down. I do think the Hamtramck historical society has some stuff on Chene, though.

[slick]

I grew up in the Pole town Chene street area.
Did not even know it was pole town till the Cadillac removal began.

Attended Immaculate Conception school and church then to St Stanislaus.
My childhood memories is Chene street was the downtown area for Poletown.
Chene Ferry Farmers market was just as thriving as the Eastern market area.

The demise of Chene street began with
the riots of 67,
the closing of the Catholic parishes, thank you Archdiocese,
the final death knell was the loss of the homeowners with the Cadillac plant moving in.

Of course this is only my opinion, I am waiting to get beat up my the more enlightened on this forum.

[EastSider]

I grew up in the Pole town Chene street area.
Did not even know it was pole town till the Cadillac removal began.

Attended Immaculate Conception school and church then to St Stanislaus.
My childhood memories is Chene street was the downtown area for Poletown.
Chene Ferry Farmers market was just as thriving as the Eastern market area.

The demise of Chene street began with
the riots of 67,
the closing of the Catholic parishes, thank you Archdiocese,
the final death knell was the loss of the homeowners with the Cadillac plant moving in.

Of course this is only my opinion, I am waiting to get beat up my the more enlightened on this forum.

The church closings happened in 1989, after the neighborhood fell apart, except for those that were directly in the GM Poletown plant footprint.

Besides which, though, St. Elizabeth & St. Hyacinth are still both open. Neither of them have been clustered with other parishes, which I find notable when you look at the clustering process in general. All three of Southfield's parishes were clustered and condensed into one, yet these two Polish parishes are able to maintain their independence in the middle of a nascent prairie.