Busted!!! [[Finally)

[jiminnm]

I know what I do is illegal.

No more need be said.

[Gistok]

Gotta strongly agree with Pam.... not only do most people on this forum not urban explore without permission, I bet that the actual percentage who explore at all is quite small... and the foolish few who do so without permission is even smaller. Some here have had permission to do so... that's how I got into the late Madison Theatre, former Michigan Theatre, and still closed National and United Artists Theatres ... WITH permission... and even then it's still risky... busted my glasses while on a tour of one of the theatres.

There's probably more people who are NOT on this forum who urban explore here than there are ON the forum. Also... as a reminder NO criminal activity [[such as exploring) is allowed to be planned on this forum... a definite no-no...

Majohnson... you crack me up with your "you are a criminal" lecture.. saw you post that one on the drinking outside a bar thread....

[Magnatomicflux]

Yes, if they are special constables as post #15 suggests, i.e., they have a badge that says "Police" on it like "Detroit Public School Police", then you are correct. Post #1 said they were "Security Guards", which would be "unreasonable force" and lawsuit worthy if a security guard had a K-9 bite a fleeing suspect.

davewindsor, your acting like these Security guards have no cousre of action other than say "stop...or I'll say stop again". If you're at Devonshire Mall and steal stuff or assault someone, Security is well within their rights to physically detain you with handcuffs while they wait for the police if you don't want to co-operate and go with them peacably to the Security office. Don't argue, I took a handcuffing course with them. You don't need a badge for this stuff. The dogs....sure. Detaining people? Nope, its called citizen's arrest. This type of arrest includes arrests made by a Security guard who has been given permission by the company he/she is paid to watch. They can even continue their pursuit off-site if need be, and anyone who witnesses this pursuit also has the power to arrest the person fleeing.
The guy was caught commiting an offense, plain and simple. That's the way it works here anyways....every State is different, I don't know what Michigan law permits.

[davewindsor]

davewindsor, your acting like these Security guards have no cousre of action other than say "stop...or I'll say stop again". If you're at Devonshire Mall and steal stuff or assault someone, Security is well within their rights to physically detain you with handcuffs while they wait for the police if you don't want to co-operate and go with them peacably to the Security office. Don't argue, I took a handcuffing course with them. You don't need a badge for this stuff. The dogs....sure. Detaining people? Nope, its called citizen's arrest. This type of arrest includes arrests made by a Security guard who has been given permission by the company he/she is paid to watch. They can even continue their pursuit off-site if need be, and anyone who witnesses this pursuit also has the power to arrest the person fleeing.
The guy was caught commiting an offense, plain and simple. That's the way it works here anyways....every State is different, I don't know what Michigan law permits.

Clearly you didn't read my post again. I never said a security couldn't arrest somebody and detain them until the police arrive. If you walk out of Sears at Devonshire Mall with stolen merchandise, of course mall security could arrest and detain you until police arrive. That's common sense. Why would anyone think otherwise? A manager at Sears could also detain you until the police arrive. A security guard or a manager at Sears can also write you a Trespass Notice. All a trespass notice is is a piece of paper that says the suspect is no longer allowed on the property or you will call the police to charge them if they come back. It can even be handwritten. Security guards have the same rights any citizen has in dealing with assault or theft. What they can't do you is charge you with a Provincial Offense Notice that has a fine and a request for a hearing date attached to it [[which is what happened in this case). To do that, you need to be a Special Constable or WIndsor Police. Private companies cannot hand out PONs for trespassing.

Can a security guard chase you? Yes, I never said they couldn't. But, the security guard has to catch you first and they also have to decide if it's worth the trouble for someone running out of an abandoned building for minimum wage.

A security guard could make a case against the suspect and claim that he thought the camera was stolen from the building and was chasing a burglar even though it's far fetched [[I took photography in a in High School art class in the past and the school lent the class these expensive Pentax K-1000s--the school even had a dark room) Would it be advisable to purse in some run down neighbourhood in Detroit after seeing someone run out of an abandoned building? Probably not. For all anyone knows, he could chase the suspect to a dark alley where the suspect's group of frrends hang out and they'll beat the security guard senseless. .And a security guard is going to take this risk for minimum wage? But that is not even relevant because the security guard in this case was not a security guard, but a special constable and he also had a K-9.

[mallory]

So when are you going back in?

[Supersport]

There are so many misconceptions on here I don't even know where to begin, but I'll try. First off, DPS are hardly rent-a-cops, as they go thru the same academy as DPD, and are sworn in with the same police powers granted by the state of Michigan. As for the K9, do you really think a trained K9 is not sufficient evidence you were in the building? DPS dogs are arguably better trained than DPD dogs, and are allowed to enter a building and take an intruder down by force, where as DPD dogs are not.

You committed a crime, your camera was used during commission of that crime, and most certainly can be taken from you and placed on evidence. Your vehicle can also not only be taken, but also forfeited, and require a $1,500 or so fee to get it back. You could have just as easily been a scrapping, scoping out the building, just not removing items yet.

I deal with this "but this is Detroit" attitude daily. Some times its lifelong Detroiters, maybe transplants expecting some sort of law free entitlement because they moved here, and suburbanites too. Give me that attitude and I'm using my discretion to enforce the law to the fullest extent. Many of us Detroiters are sick of this "shit on Detroit" attitude. You think Oakland county is going to tell you to be on your way if you break and enter one of their schools?

[Supersport]

Also, DPS most certainly does still have sworn officers. They did contract some security company to a handful of schools last year. Robert Bob also has their police on the chopping block, to be replaced by a security company, but it has not happened yet. As bad as DPS is, if they replace their police with rent-a-cops, security will be a joke. We had NUMEROUS police runs to back up DPS officers at schools on "shots fired" both inside and outside schools in past years. What is an unarmed security guard going to do aside from run? In the end, it really doesn't matter I guess, DPS will be gone in the next 10 years, and perhaps rightfully so.

[EastsideAl]

As a Detroiter, I'm glad to hear that someone is actually out there patrolling our closed schools, and at least ticketing the people he/she finds trespassing there.

You say you know what you do is illegal, yet you persist in doing it, and then come here and whine like a baby when you get caught and get off relatively easy with just a ticket. I'm constantly amazed by the stones on some people, and the degree to which some folks will still justify their immature and selfish behavior while still claiming to be a responsible adult.

If, by "standing up for what you believe in," you mean that you believe that you somehow have a right to trespass on property that we Detroit taxpayers have paid for, then the only problem I have here is that this incident didn't result in you "standing" in jail rather than just getting a measly ticket.

[detroitbob66]

I know what I do is illegal.

So why fight it? Pay the ticket and don't waste the court's time.

after I took my pictures inside and crawled out the wide-open window. He wanted to see my camera, but I told him that it was private property

and I believed that he couldn't prove that I was in there.

Your 'private property' is evidence they have every right to seize and use against you in court to prove you were there.

I wouldn't waste their time there Meddle, but I HAVE to go to court as part of the process, so I mine as well explain myself. Besides that, who is really wasting time? I know, how about the police busting photographers instead of robbers, rapists, and murderers......Got it? Good!

[detroitbob66]

Gsgeorge.....You make very good point and I appreciate you being somewhat respectful. Like I said, I probably DID deserve the ticket and I will pay up for what I did. Ohh, and the officer told me the dog was barking at the window, but I couldn't hear it because I was so far in the massive building. I don't say what school because I don;t ant to draw attention to itor have other people get a ticket becuase they are watching it closely! There is no fence around it either, and I was already almost to the road when he officer and K-9 pulled up in their vehicle.

[detroitbob66]

I am not crying like a baby there Al, just explaining what happened....I said I probably deserve the ticket so just calm down over there. You would think your the one that got the ticket!

[detroitbob66]

Motown...funny thing is that it WAS Officer Greene and Nitro...ironic

[Magnatomicflux]

I wouldn't waste their time there Meddle, but I HAVE to go to court as part of the process, so I mine as well explain myself. Besides that, who is really wasting time? I know, how about the police busting photographers instead of robbers, rapists, and murderers......Got it? Good!

Yeah, since when was B&E against the law anyways? I had NO CLUE that an unfenced, vaccant property ment it was ok to enter.....provided of course, I have camera in hand, which is obviously some proof that you arn't a theif...right?
Yes, you're wasting the courts time. It wasn't the DPD that caught you anyways. Even if it were, you can't go harping about "don't they have better things to do then bust me and my camera?" Because the answer is no, not right now. Right now, they're interested in you committing a crime right in front of them. Unless you'd be cool with them responding to your 911 call about a strange man in your house taking pictures as "Is he stealing anything?" "No officer, he's just.....he's just taking pictures of stuff. Its really weird and I don't want him in my house." "Uh.....you know what? Nooooot really a concern of ours. We've got murderers and rapists to catch...sorry". Its not the DPSPDs specific interest to catch rapists and murderers. They are interested in keeping people like you, and people that steal they're stuff OUT.

[Meddle]

Besides that, who is really wasting time? I know, how about the police busting photographers instead of robbers, rapists, and murderers......Got it? Good!

How did he know you hadn't dragged a child in there to do nasty things and then take pictures?

[AUSSIE]

Ok, but where are the photos?

Can we please have a looksie?

I planned to do a lot of ruin photos, maybe its not such a good idea, we have to respect that it is private property after all

I HATE FUN POLICE!

Cheers

[Shollin]

Ok, but where are the photos?

Can we please have a looksie?

I planned to do a lot of ruin photos, maybe its not such a good idea, we have to respect that it is private property after all

I HATE FUN POLICE!

Cheers

I would rather see the OP police mugshots than more pics of abandoned buildings.

[Bad Brains]

My biggest concern about the DYes urban spelunkers is that you very well may get hurt while exploring. Abandoned structures can be unstable, have unexpected holes in ceilings and floors, and have other hazards and dangers [[broken glass, exposed wires, etc). I love the pictures, but please be legal AND safe.

That's half the fun.

To the OP, you're best defense is to not say anything. Use your "right to remain silent" to your advantage. Say nothing, admit to nothing. You also don't need to share with all of us the fact that you pay taxes and go to college. That's completely irrelevant.

Also not smart to admit your guilt on internet message boards. I'm sure in this case it isn't a big deal, but just pointing this out for future reference.

[Zacha341]

Go to the 'search' section of this site and use key words such as 'ruins',
'ruin port', 'property', 'abandoned', etc. and you should find threads with links to photos.

There are many sites on google as well. Key words such as: 'ruins of Detroit', 'ruin porn' etc. You'll find PLENTY of photos!

Ok, but where are the photos?

Can we please have a looksie?

[48226]

Urban exploring is a cancer. Ive seen the the same process happen building after building.
1.Urban explorers break into building to take C0oL pictures [[leaves the place wide open)
2.Vandals and scrappers move in
3.Building gets scrapped and interior is destroyed [[fires, etc.)
4.Building becomes beyond rehab and the only option is demolition
5.Detroit loses

[neavling]

Urban exploring is a cancer. Ive seen the the same process happen building after building.
1.Urban explorers break into building to take C0oL pictures [[leaves the place wide open)
2.Vandals and scrappers move in
3.Building gets scrapped and interior is destroyed [[fires, etc.)
4.Building becomes beyond rehab and the only option is demolition
5.Detroit loses

Most urban explorers do not break into buildings. They wait until doors or windows are busted out by scrappers. So I don't think it's fair to blame most urban explorers for the denise of buildings. There are destructive urban explorers and those who are not. I also know urban explorers who secure buildings once they've found them open.

[Islandman]

Recycling old threads FTL.

[Danny]

You knew better, breaking and entering is still a crime.

[Bad Brains]

Urban exploring is a cancer. Ive seen the the same process happen building after building.
1.Urban explorers break into building to take C0oL pictures [[leaves the place wide open)
2.Vandals and scrappers move in

Oh yeah, I forgot that scrappers wait around for photographers to make entrances into buildings so they can get in to rip the building apart....

[48226]

There's no virtue in urban exploring. Is it helping the community? People do it for the rush that you could get commiting any other crime. Urban explorers are often the first to break into buildings because they want to be the first ones to "explore". They then upload their photos to the Internet to be seen. Others see that and want to "explore" the same buildings. Eventually the wrong people end up inside and damage is done. There's literally no justification for this activity. Its not sport, it's not art. It's criminal and it's exploitation. I see no distinction between urban explorers and scrapers. Trespassing just invites more trespassing.

[Zacha341]

Bottom line: it's trespassing, current or past activities. I am surprised those buildings are being watched at all. Better so that they may be, to keep someone from doing something other than taking photos!

Too bad there are so many properties standing open not boarded up at all. Right NOW!

There's a DPS building up on Claremont and the Lodge service drive, next to the Herman Keifer center that is a horror. Every window out, every door gone. Two story structure. Has a 'For Sale' sign on it. Who would? It needs to be torn down, like yesterday!

I just don't get it....I am a taxpayer, a Detroit citizen, and a college student. I have been caught before by DPS and just let go with a warning, but I probably deserve the ticket anyway. Ill look at it like I will pay $150.00 for amazing pictures of a school that not too many people have been into.