Detroit City Council nixes funding for new police headquarters

[kraig]

Silly question time. Has there been an actual detailed plan on what and how the 55 million would be spent?

The building has already been renovated by MGM. Which means it's wired up the butt. I would think that the majority of the equipment used by the officers would make the move from the current headquarters. A state of the art Crime Lab isn't going to run more than 10 million or so. So the question remains. What will the 55 million be spent on?

[Meddle]

So the question remains. What will the 55 million be spent on?

Cushy chairs?

[jtf1972]

Why not move the council meetings to Comedy Central?

[Bigb23]

Ray - you light up my day every time you post. Keep them coming, old man in blue.

[sumas]

Kind of hate to see the city get any money. Finney High was supposed to have been leveled and rebuilt by now with federal money. Did note that there was a ground breaking event. Nothings happened that I can see, just a sign.

Pretty sure I posted this info before but I volunteered with JEBA and designed plantings for Jefferson. Had to buy plant stock through a city approved vendor. Paid 15,000 dollars [[might have been $18,000) for plant stock I could have bought for $2,500. All they did for that fantastic markup was deliver. Kind of queered me on projects handled by city.

Mariner Park, another great example of who has the money, a few Million county dollars handled by Parks @ Rec. but keep looking around for everything spec'ed and it just is not there.

Put in a petition for historic designation for several east area river front parks. That was 2005, occaisionally for amusement I follow up on that petition. The city [[historic designation advisory board) hasn't even reviewed it, to vote.

I am not real big on city extra funding. The slush is too deep. When money goes to and is controlled by area resident/business groups things get done.

[gwatts]

If you are unable to fund the daily operation of the city such as police services, fire fighting, EMS an other daily needs, how are you going to fund the repayment of 100 million?

[DetroitPlanner]

Didn't the County pay more for the Parking structure than they did the Guardian Building??

As far as I know the Guardian has no parking spaces of thier own. They did buy the building on Woodward looking to turn it into what would probablybe the world's skinniest parking structure, but nothing ever came of it.

On the plus side, the City could get some revenue off of the MGM structure on days when parking is at a premium downtown. Heck they can even charge visitors to the police fire HQ or employees for parking! This would incentivize carpoling and transit use.

[stasu1213]

I don't trust Mr Pugh on this one. Does the city business he had ceased with the Mayor includes not sending the inspectors out to soon to open businesses such as the Ye Olde Butcher's Shoppe and other businesses to give them the ye or nay to open. It appears the Mr Charles is pouting like a spoiled little kid. I always had thought that the new police HQ should had been built from the ground up. The is a big lot that sits on Gratiot next to the county jail and across from Frank Murphy. A five story police and fire head quarters could be built on that spot. Spread it out instead of up and build a five to ten story parking structure next to it. Council should had never approved of that 66 million purchase of the former MGM Casino only to renege on it's renovation.

[mam2009]

I don't trust Mr Pugh on this one. Does the city business he had ceased with the Mayor includes not sending the inspectors out to soon to open businesses such as the Ye Olde Butcher's Shoppe and other businesses to give them the ye or nay to open...Council should had never approved of that 66 million purchase of the former MGM Casino only to renege on it's renovation.

The Council doesn't control the operational aspect of inspectors going out each day. So no cause to worry on that front, statsu. I'm guessing that Council President Pugh was referring to the role that the Council has in approving contracts and other budget-related matters. From my understanding the Council feels that the Administration has unnecessarily sued them and the Council President's comments mean that they are still seeking to persuade the mayor to resolve this matter expeditiously without going through the expense and inconvenience of a court battle over what can be easily perceived as a petty squabble.

[Gistok]

OK... time to separate some facts from myths...

1) The city bought the temporary MGM Casino Building and 3000 space parking garage for $6.3 million,.... NOT $66 Million...

2) the large swath of land at St. Antoine and Gratiot is owned by Greektown Casino... and the casino paid $34 million for the land and demolition costs. They were going to use it as their permanent casino... only later to change their minds and stay in their temporary Greektown site. If anyone thinks they're going to just give it away to the city or county.... guess again!

3) the county bought the Guardian Building for about $14 million... and also bought that small building behind it along Woodward... but the biggest part of the $33.5 million deal was buying up the Fort & First Parking structure.... so yes the county workers do have a place to park, and that skinny building they own along Woodward is not needed for parking...
http://www.metromodemedia.com/devnew...unty10307.aspx

4) Detroitnerd... I don't know why you think the old MGM temporary site is so ugly.... it looks 1000% better than the former IRS center that was rebuilt for the casino site. it's better looking than a lot of buildings in downtown, and if there's anything shabby about it, I don't see it. And as has been mentioned... a lot of the $212 spent on upgrading that building is not carpeting and drapes.... it's on electronic/wiring infrastructure. Those are items that would NOT have to be replaced with a state of the art police station and state crime lab. Removing faux Art Deco exterior trim is pennies on the dollar, as compared with buying another downtown building, gutting it and starting from scratch.

5) If the DPD cannot utilize a large portion of the 3000 space parking structure... then they could lease it out for daily or monthly rentals for other downtown workers.... no reason the city can't earn some money off of their $6.3 million investment.

[gazhekwe]

My window in the State Plaza overlooked the casino project as it was built, and the IRS building before that. They took a permanent building and enhanced and added to it, and built that parking structure. They spend many days pounding foundational panels deep into the ground. Many a day the noise drove me completely nuts and seriously interfered with telephone work. Those who worry that a "temporary" casino building is unsound have no need to be troubled. That building and the parking structure are good and solid.

[Detroitnerd]

I don't know why you think the old MGM temporary site is so ugly.... it looks 1000% better than the former IRS center that was rebuilt for the casino site.

That former IRS building? The brutalist eyesore that haunted that side of downtown for years? My mother used to work in it, and I still thought it was absolutely the ugliest building in Detroit. Even uglier than the Ren Cen. And you know what? If a building looks ten times as good as that ... um ... it's still fuglier than the Ren Cen. Sorry, man. I can't go for it. It looks like a big old shoebox of a building, and I can't tell how you refit that building, designed for cars to drive in from all over, into a building that is easy for citizens to walk to, with a welcoming entrance and a pedestrian friendly lobby. I just don't see it happening.

What DO I see happening? Take a look at the last few "innovations" in the police department, especially the one on the east side where they closed the precinct at Mack and Gratiot and merged operations with the northern precinct and created a new police northeastern headquarters located up on Nevada. Oh, it's a great facility ... if you DRIVE there. It has parking lots and lots of space to drive and park your car. I'm sure the police must love it. It's probably easier to park there and a nearer drive for them. It's a nice building and it must feel great to know your electrical outlet is going to work.

But what about the people in the precinct who have to make a police report? They may live all the way down by the Heidelberg Project. How do they get to the precinct? The old one, the one that was near a major intersection and a fading shopping district, had a clear entrance near where people lived. Now, in a city where most adults have difficulty getting a working car and a driver, they have to DRIVE up to the new, sparkling quarters of our brave law enforcement officers. Does this have the intended effect of fewer citizens filing police reports? Does it help solve any crimes? Or prevent any? Admittedly, though, it's a nice new facility and police can drive right in and park. But it's far away from where it should be, and, really, that's what GOOD URBAN DESIGN is about: nearness to and integration with the function of a facility. Police stations need to be near jails. Police stations need to be near people. Police stations can't just be plopped down in a place because it's a sweet deal for a casino and because there's a parking structure with thousands of spaces.

Anyway, for a police department that is failing to live up to its federal decrees for about 10 years now, I believe we can wait a little while to find a suitable home for their new headquarters.

[kraig]

The Council doesn't control the operational aspect of inspectors going out each day. So no cause to worry on that front, statsu. I'm guessing that Council President Pugh was referring to the role that the Council has in approving contracts and other budget-related matters. From my understanding the Council feels that the Administration has unnecessarily sued them and the Council President's comments mean that they are still seeking to persuade the mayor to resolve this matter expeditiously without going through the expense and inconvenience of a court battle over what can be easily perceived as a petty squabble.

So they respond to his pettiness with some pettiness of their own? Which means we're back to the Kwame threatening to shut down the fireworks for not getting his way, Ken Cockrel threatening to shut down the NAACP dinner for not getting his way and Rose Collins, Reeves and Conyers singing onward Christian Soldiers. So much for this new day crap.

[Fnemecek]

EXACTLY the sort of moronic infighting that will keep this city in its dark-age doldrums for the forseeable future. Very disappointing

If that's true then every city in the Free World is trapped in the dark-age doldrums.

A new police HQ won't solve any of Detroit's problems any more than keeping the current one will.

Changing the line up on channel 10 won't solve any of Detroit's problems any more than keeping the current line up will.

This is just two politicians fighting for the best starting position in advance of the next mayoral election. Nothing more. Nothing less. It happens everywhere there are elections.

[NorthEndere]

A little background about the project...

- In July of last year, the city council agreed to the purchase of the building on a land contract with the understanding that the city was to pursue low-interest stimulus bonds [[4.55% rate) to renovate it. So, someone switched their vote when it came around for the time to actually use the bond money.

- The City of Detroit sold $100 million bought up by Wall Street in early December, after it having been approved by the State of Michigan.

- From my understanding, it was always clear that the whole $100 wouldn't be solely for the renovation of the building, but that most of them would. The remainder [[about $34 million) will be used for other city building projects as they arise.

- The bond will be payed off with property tax revenues.

- Oh, this is conceived a full-on public safety headquarters. It won't just include a new state crime lab and the headquarters for DPD, but also the headquarters for the Detroit Fire Department.

- No one - not the council, not the mayor, not anyone - seems to have any doubt that this renovation will be done by 2012. It's viewed as a temporary setback over other petty squabbling over another issue. The council is holding the renovation hostage for the time being.

[stasu1213]

A little background about the project...

- In July of last year, the city council agreed to the purchase of the building on a land contract with the understanding that the city was to pursue low-interest stimulus bonds [[4.55% rate) to renovate it. So, someone switched their vote when it came around for the time to actually use the bond money.

- The City of Detroit sold $100 million bought up by Wall Street in early December, after it having been approved by the State of Michigan.

- From my understanding, it was always clear that the whole $100 wouldn't be solely for the renovation of the building, but that most of them would. The remainder [[about $34 million) will be used for other city building projects as they arise.

- The bond will be payed off with property tax revenues.

- Oh, this is conceived a full-on public safety headquarters. It won't just include a new state crime lab and the headquarters for DPD, but also the headquarters for the Detroit Fire Department.

- No one - not the council, not the mayor, not anyone - seems to have any doubt that this renovation will be done by 2012. It's viewed as a temporary setback over other petty squabbling over another issue. The council is holding the renovation hostage for the time being.

If this is true then someone on the council is possibly being paid off to switch his/her's vote. Just like Monica Conyers switching her vote at the last minute for the synegro deal.

[mam2009]

If this is true then someone on the council is possibly being paid off to switch his/her's vote. Just like Monica Conyers switching her vote at the last minute for the synegro deal.

Whoa! The reasons that this approval for receipt of the bond funds hasn't been approved yet has been reported in the press. Councilmember Jenkins has said that Council needs to know how the extra $ 35-40 million will be spent before it gets spent and Council President Pugh says the Mayor needs to drop the Cable Commission lawsuit & compromise with Council regarding broadcast of Council meetings.

Like NorthEnder said, EVERYONE expects this project to proceed on time. Those two members of Council have not expressed any objection based on the merits of the headquarters project. To the best of my recollection this vote was 3-6. When the purchase of the MGM property was approved last summer it was 5-3 because Kwame Kenyatta was still on medical leave. SJ & CP both were in favor of the project & haven't said anything, to my knowledge, about having a change of heart. And Kwame Kenyatta stated at the table that he feels disrespected by the Administration regarding the cable commission spat.

[Locke09]

Whoa! The reasons that this approval for receipt of the bond funds hasn't been approved yet has been reported in the press. Councilmember Jenkins has said that Council needs to know how the extra $ 35-40 million will be spent before it gets spent and Council President Pugh says the Mayor needs to drop the Cable Commission lawsuit & compromise with Council regarding broadcast of Council meetings..

The public should want to know how the extra money will be spent as well. Bonds are approved by the public for specific purposes. They can only be spent for those purposes. They can't be used to provide slush funds for whatever building projects an administration thinks they might want to undertake in the future. So that doesn't make sense if that's what the Bing administration said.

Maybe the sale of other approved bonds was mixed in with the sale of the public safety bond. In any event, the Bing administration should be able to easily divulge how the bonds will be spent, since that was supposed to be determined before it was placed on the ballot.

[mam2009]

The public should want to know how the extra money will be spent as well...

This comment also goes to the heart of why the Council says that its meetings should continue to be aired as they were previously in their entirety Monday thru Thursday. City Council meetings are PUBLIC and their deliberations are subject to public comment and public scrutiny. Keeping the meetings on air in the evenings Monday thru Thursday gives the public an opportunity to see its government at work UNEDITED. Their argument is about providing as many opportunities for TRANSPARENCY in government as practicable. What you see is what you get -- good or bad, slips of the tongue, mumbles under their breath, brilliant & insightful inquiries, stupid or self-serving soap box moments, etc...

I read an unrelated article recently where, Russ Bellant, a community appointee to the Detroit Works Task Force stated that he and another participant in a DW Task Force meeting believed that the meeting had been unnecessarily closed to the public when a reporter was asked to leave. The purpose of the meeting seemed to be strategizing about the rollout for next round of community meetings. I just mention that as a contrast to how the Council is required by law to conduct business -- openly. That is not a criticism of the Mayor.

[kraig]

Whoa! The reasons that this approval for receipt of the bond funds hasn't been approved yet has been reported in the press. Councilmember Jenkins has said that Council needs to know how the extra $ 35-40 million will be spent before it gets spent and Council President Pugh says the Mayor needs to drop the Cable Commission lawsuit & compromise with Council regarding broadcast of Council meetings.

Like NorthEnder said, EVERYONE expects this project to proceed on time. Those two members of Council have not expressed any objection based on the merits of the headquarters project. To the best of my recollection this vote was 3-6. When the purchase of the MGM property was approved last summer it was 5-3 because Kwame Kenyatta was still on medical leave. SJ & CP both were in favor of the project & haven't said anything, to my knowledge, about having a change of heart. And Kwame Kenyatta stated at the table that he feels disrespected by the Administration regarding the cable commission spat.

If those two members don't have any objections based on the merits of the headquarters project, then they should have voted for it. As far as Pugh and Kenyatta, the Mayor and Council deal with thousands of items and billions of dollars a year. It's childish to to take things to that level. But, don't think for a minute that I don't view the actions of Bing limiting Council's television time due to sour grapes on his part, childish as well.

As far as Jenkins having any real concerns, I call Bullshit on that. If she had any legitimate concerns, she wouldn't have voted to purchase the building for 6 million dollars which resulted in the City losing 2 million dollars a year in revenue that MGM was paying in property taxes.

Jenkins real concern is trying to get a contractual hook up for Strategic Staffing Solutions along with Rev. Jim Holley and Horace Sheffield. It's widely known on the streets who's running Jenkins.

[kenp]

Kenyatta is a stubborn guy, but one of the few in Detroit politics I respect. He seems to be rejuvenated after his leave. What I cant figure out is where is the dispute. Is this about the un accounted for money [[100mill vs 67 to renovate) or is it this tv business. I heard Pugh on the radio friday saying we [[Detroit council) wont conduct any city business until the TV thing is straightend out. I dont trust Pugh on any matters regarding the city, he is not a qualified leader. However if Kenyatta has a problem here I would like to know what it is.

[kraig]

Kenyatta is a stubborn guy, but one of the few in Detroit politics I respect. He seems to be rejuvenated after his leave. What I cant figure out is where is the dispute. Is this about the un accounted for money [[100mill vs 67 to renovate) or is it this tv business. I heard Pugh on the radio friday saying we [[Detroit council) wont conduct any city business until the TV thing is straightend out. I dont trust Pugh on any matters regarding the city, he is not a qualified leader. However if Kenyatta has a problem here I would like to know what it is.

Kenyatta stated that he felt disrespected that the Council has had their television time reduced. For the most part, Kenyatta is an even keeled guy. But, he has his moments of pettiness as well.

[kenp]

Is it reasonable to say the renovation plan would have passed if not for the TV issue?

[luckycar]

My Bloomfield Park fantasy!And only 12.5 miles north of 8 Mile.

[Detroitnerd]

The Fire Department is moving there too? I have changed my mind. I'm glad the city is forgoing $2 million in property taxes per year to buy a building for $6 million that wouldn't have sold, across town from the justice campus, with a plan to leave TWO buildings in downtown vacant, a Hans Gehrke and an Albert Kahn. It's pure genius.