Removing Freeways

**maxx** · January-13-11, 06:16 PM

http://www.preservenet.com/freeways/...Proposals.html
Planned Freeway Removals

The following freeway removals are being planned by city and state governments:

Rochester, NY, Innerloop: The Inner Loop completely circles downtown Rochester, and the city has planned to remove it since 1990, when it completed its "Vision 2000 Plan" for downtown. In addition to this official city support, there is strong citizen backing to "demote the moat." The city is now studying the impact of this plan on traffic, and then will try to get funding for it.

Trenton, NJ, Route 29: The freeway was initially designed to remove trucks from local streets, but truck traffic was banned from it before its completion. In response to complaints from the city, the state Dept. of Transportation is now planning to remove this freeway and replace it with a boulevard and local street grid, freeing up 18 acres of land for development. This plan is one of NJDOT's “smart growth corridor studies.”

Akron, OH, Innerbelt: Inspired by the example of Milwaukee, Akron mayor Don Plusquellic has proposed removing the Innerbelt freeway to promote economic development. The city is now conducting a $2 million study of this freeway removal.

Washington, DC, Whitehurst Freeway: City officials are discussing plans to remove this three-quarter-mile-ling freeway, which divides Georgetown from its waterfront, and to replace it with a boulevard. There are also preliminary discussions of removing other elevated freeways, including Southeast Freeway near the Capitol and part of the Rock Creek and Potomac Parkway near the Lincoln Memorial.

So what freeway could Detroit do without? And how about that ugly noisy People Mover that goes nowhere?

**Gistok** · January-13-11, 07:02 PM

... wouldn't it be cheaper to reduce the PM noise than to spend 10s of millions tearing it and all the stations down??

My choice of freeway removal... M-53.

**Hermod** · January-13-11, 07:15 PM

Originally Posted by Gistok

My choice of freeway removal... M-53.

Sine the M-53 freeway doesn't come within eight miles of the Detroit city limits, how does it cause you any gas? What wonderful neighborhoods or classic buildings died when it was built?

**Gistok** · January-14-11, 02:26 PM

It just happens to be the freeway that least impacts me.... I don't see any of them disappearing anytime soon...

As for wonderful neighborhoods dying... I doubt that any neighborhoods died building I-94. They did it in such a way that it didn't cut the huge swaths that the Jeffries took out. And it was done in a way that didn't destroy the Harper Ave. retail district [[that however is happeningly slowly ever since without the freeway's impact)...

Augustiner · January-14-11, 03:04 PM

Originally Posted by Gistok

And it was done in a way that didn't destroy the Harper Ave. retail district [[that however is happeningly slowly ever since without the freeway's impact)...

I would be surprised if the two were entirely unrelated. If you build an expressway right behind a retail district [[that is to say, between the retail district and its prospective customers on the adjoining residential streets), decline would seem to be a fairly natural and obvious result.

**Gistok** · January-14-11, 04:48 PM

Originally Posted by Augustiner

I would be surprised if the two were entirely unrelated. If you build an expressway right behind a retail district [[that is to say, between the retail district and its prospective customers on the adjoining residential streets), decline would seem to be a fairly natural and obvious result.

Augustiner.... I moved to the area near Harper & Morang back in 1960... and Harper was a thriving commercial district for decades. Of all the Detroit freeway expansions the Harper/I-94 was likely the most successful [[unlike the Jeffries)... and 40 years later the commercial strip and neighborhood finally started being hurt by urban blight, not the freeway. Perhaps the large number of roads and pedestrian bridges that cross I-94 along the Harper route help as well... and making Harper's commercial route similar to a service drive along much of the meandering east side route, actually helped instead of hurt that stretch.

**iheartthed** · January-14-11, 05:28 PM

Originally Posted by Gistok

It just happens to be the freeway that least impacts me.... I don't see any of them disappearing anytime soon...

As for wonderful neighborhoods dying... I doubt that any neighborhoods died building I-94. They did it in such a way that it didn't cut the huge swaths that the Jeffries took out. And it was done in a way that didn't destroy the Harper Ave. retail district [[that however is happeningly slowly ever since without the freeway's impact)...

A couple of years ago someone on here posted a before and after of the I-94 and Lodge interchange. The interchange alone looked like it wiped out nearly a square mile of previously development land...

**Detroitnerd** · January-14-11, 05:44 PM

Originally Posted by iheartthed

A couple of years ago someone on here posted a before and after of the I-94 and Lodge interchange. The interchange alone looked like it wiped out nearly a square mile of previously development land...

Yeah, probably about four or five blocks were ripped out to make that interchange, and old-fashioned "diagonal" that is actually pretty economical as a footprint. It was crowded with houses. They must have ripped out scores of homes to build that thing.

**TKshreve** · January-16-11, 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by Gistok

It just happens to be the freeway that least impacts me.... I don't see any of them disappearing anytime soon...

As for wonderful neighborhoods dying... I doubt that any neighborhoods died building I-94. They did it in such a way that it didn't cut the huge swaths that the Jeffries took out. And it was done in a way that didn't destroy the Harper Ave. retail district [[that however is happeningly slowly ever since without the freeway's impact)...

My father once told me that the Links of Chandler were shortened due to the creation of I-94. They're short enough now imo.

Also, my mom used to do business over there with an upholstery shop on Harper near Connor/Chalmers. Not sure if it's still there, but she always said they did a tremendous job. It's a lost art really.

**reddog289** · January-16-11, 03:26 PM

They could get rid of the Southfield Freeway and it wouldn't bother me a bit. Never did like that ride.

**stasu1213** · January-13-11, 07:05 PM

Detroit could do without the davison. Detroit could probably do without the Jeffries if light rail goes up Grand River. Once Detroit's downtown get a major retail district the people mover will be good for it. Dropping riders off at different spots

**RO_Resident** · January-13-11, 07:34 PM

I don't think anyone would miss I-375 if were to be boulevarded.

**DetroitHabitater** · January-13-11, 07:45 PM

The lodge south of 75

**Brian1979** · January-13-11, 07:50 PM

75 between 375/Gratiot and 96. Instead of going downtown 75 could multiplex with 94 and come back down 96 and on. I just think it'd be nice without 75 there to connect downtown to midtown.

**rhythmc** · January-13-11, 09:20 PM

Interesting thread. I've not been around the city enough to have a real opinion. I do think that freeways into the city were fine for their time [[generally, the time period where most Americans were fleeing to the 'burbs) but they've also been used as a means of ridding cities of certain types of neighborhoods [[very bad). With the exception of freeways that go directly to the Ambassador bridge I don't think any should cut through the city. They cause the city to be disjointed and hinder walkability.

**mwilbert** · January-13-11, 09:34 PM

I don't think anything like this is going to happen anytime soon, but I think we could lose both the Lodge and 375 south of the Fisher. 375 cuts off Lafayette Park and the east riverfront from downtown, and the Lodge cuts off Corktown. It wouldn't take that long for traffic to get downtown on the surface.

I also agree that it is lamentable that the Fisher divides downtown from Midtown, but removing that seems like it would disrupt traffic patterns more.

**iheartthed** · January-13-11, 09:56 PM

I'd get rid of 375 completely. I'd also get rid of the Fisher between I-96 and the 375/75/Gratiot interchange.

**eastland** · January-13-11, 10:15 PM

I don't think the GM execs would go for 375's removal -- would take them too long to get back to Bloomfield.

DC48080 · January-13-11, 10:40 PM

Originally Posted by eastland

I don't think the GM execs would go for 375's removal -- would take them too long to get back to Bloomfield.

And for the other rank and file employees in the Ren Cen to get to their homes in Northwest Detroit, Warren, Dearborn, and any other neighborhood or suburb.

Don't try to make this thread about putting down the evil unsustainable suburbs or those God awful evil rich executives who live there.

**Brian1979** · January-15-11, 07:37 PM

Originally Posted by iheartthed

I'd get rid of 375 completely. I'd also get rid of the Fisher between I-96 and the 375/75/Gratiot interchange.

Mine as well take 75 out all the way up to 94.

**boogiechillen** · January-14-11, 07:13 AM

I would like to see the removal of I-375 and the capping of I-75 South between John R and Grand River. Some sort of promenade park built over that portion of the freeway is an interesting pipe dream.

NorthEndere · January-14-11, 08:04 AM

In my dreams, The Fisher would be taken underground for most of its course, or done away with altogether from the Jeffries to where it ends at Gratiot. 375 never made much sense to begin with unless you were a GM employee once they took SEMTA out of commission, so it could be taken out or boulevarded. I think the Lodge has always served a pretty useful purpose, but the sheer size of the interchange with the Fisher seems like total overkill, and does the Fisher's interchange with the Chrysler/375.

Anyway, I think taking out the Fisher or reconfiguring it in some way would open up a lot of room to allow for the reconnection of downtown to its surrounding neighborhoods.

**Hermod** · January-14-11, 08:14 AM

Originally Posted by NorthEnder

In my dreams, The Fisher would be taken underground for most of its course, or done away with altogether from the Jeffries to where it ends at Gratiot. 375 never made much sense to begin with unless you were a GM employee once they took SEMTA out of commission, so it could be taken out or boulevarded. I think the Lodge has always served a pretty useful purpose, but the sheer size of the interchange with the Fisher seems like total overkill, and does the Fisher's interchange with the Chrysler/375.

Anyway, I think taking out the Fisher or reconfiguring it in some way would open up a lot of room to allow for the reconnection of downtown to its surrounding neighborhoods.

This opens up a topic which has always caused controversy in cities that lie along "through" interstates. Should the main interstate go through the city or should it go around the city?

Should the current I-275 be renumbered I-75 and the Fisher-Chrysler-aokland county portion on I-75 be redesignated as I-275?

Richmond went through this with I-95 and I-64. For a long time, they insisted that these roads went "though" Richmond and resisted completion of the beltway as "bypassing" Richmond.
Finally they agreed to completing the beltway and routing I-95 and I-64 around Richmond with the interstates running through the cities designated as alternate routes.

As long as Fisher-Chrysler remain I-75, you are not going to tear them up.

**ghettopalmetto** · January-14-11, 09:38 AM

Originally Posted by Hermod

This opens up a topic which has always caused controversy in cities that lie along "through" interstates. Should the main interstate go through the city or should it go around the city?

Should the current I-275 be renumbered I-75 and the Fisher-Chrysler-aokland county portion on I-75 be redesignated as I-275?

Richmond went through this with I-95 and I-64. For a long time, they insisted that these roads went "though" Richmond and resisted completion of the beltway as "bypassing" Richmond.
Finally they agreed to completing the beltway and routing I-95 and I-64 around Richmond with the interstates running through the cities designated as alternate routes.

As long as Fisher-Chrysler remain I-75, you are not going to tear them up.

Actually, I-95 and I-64 DO go right smack through downtown Richmond. I've driven it dozens of times.

With that said, I-375 in Detroit is a waste of space, as is the Lodge south of I-94. There are probably some exits that can be done away with on the remaining freeways, so that they serve their intended purpose instead of acting as high-speed "local" roads.

DetroitPole · January-14-11, 10:49 AM

The problem is not so much that we're not removing them, but actually widening and expanding them [[now I-94, totally unnecessarily) in a region that hasn't had population growth in 30 years - and our state was the only state to lose population in the last ten!

It's still 1965 here. Do people wonder why Michigan is in the toilet?

Removing them won't happen. And it isn't because of the suburbs, it is because of the ex-burbs. This region is so ridiculously far-flung and sprawling, people commute so far for everything, and mass transit has been so thoroughly dismantled [[or actually removed in some burbs) that not only would removing certain freeways be a non-starter, our economy [[what's left of it) would probably collapse. We are totally dependent on them. It's the other crack for Metro Detroit.