Obama No Longer Has A Mental Disorder

[canuck]

Canuck, I think you've been drinking demican national corporation kool-aid. In the estimations of increasingly more and more people and pundits, Obama has mishandled almost everything - wars, health care, negotiations with republicrats, etc. And especially everything pertaining to the preservation of the middle class, such as union's right to organize, jobs, unemployment, foreclosures, loans, credit, NAFTA, etc, etc, etc, ad infinitum. He failed in his first two years, but got a bump at the end of this session of congress. The only way he'll get along from here on out is to sell what remains of his soul to the tea party, corporations, mega-rich and whomever else buys the elections. nObama is a failure. Most people just don't want to give up their last glimmer of hope that our 'saviour' is everything but. We elected a right-winger in disguise. He's not a fighter and he's not a 'saviour'.

jiminnm Not exactly a ringing endorsement, since Carter was arguably the worst Prez in recent memory [[at least until GWB gave him a run for the title). I suppose that means after Obama leaves office, we'll be treated to a couple of dozen books from him explaining why he really wasn't so bad and why all those after him are.

Worker's unions rights to organize has very little to do with the feds unfortunately in the US as far as I know. As Nafta goes, 1200 folks lost their jobs at an Electrolux factory 2 weeks ago in a suburb of Montreal [[L'Assomption). These union workers found out one morning the plant was closing in a coupla months. The very next day, the company announced plans to open a factory in Memphis and 1200 new jobs. The US gained in that bit of Nafta shuffle. I think Obama still comes from a place not so endeared to the corporate side of american life. I think people overestimate the power of te presidency just as they overestimate the value of the constitution and other artefacts in order to keep the ball rolling in their heads... Nothing will come of demonizing Bush or Reagan and same for Obama. I still think Carter was cut short by the media on account of Iran and its lovely revolution. They managed to stick the blame on Carter because of two helicopters chewing their blades in a commando rescue effort. It was cheap then and it is cheap now. Carter managed to get Sadat and Begin to agree to negotiate, was an intellectual and a statesman, but also a man connected to farming and small communities.

[1KielsonDrive]

I agree with you about Carter, but as far as nObama goes, he was and is severely overestimated. I was one of the overestimators. I worked my ass off for him and spoke on his behalf. Now the tables are turned. nObama used me to get him into office and then turned his back on me and all working class people. Now, it's my turn to criticize his weakly efforts to bring about 'Change You Can Believe In'. Do you see anything resembling 'Change You Can Believe In'? nObama is a poseur. The only reasons people put up with him is because of who preceded him - who could ever be that bad? and they're listening to demican propaganda.

[TKshreve]

negotiations with republicrats

Now that's worth a chuckle.

[1KielsonDrive]

When was the last time you heard nObama was meeting with Unions or working class people to discuss the economy? Yet, he's always meeting with republicrats and business 'leaders'. He has a right-wing view of the world. I personally think nObama campaigned as a moderate to slightly left candidate, to draw in moderates, liberals and independents, when in reality he's a conservative on most everything except a few issues like DADT. He doesn't even support gay marriage. We were all so fed up with Bush and Cheney we fell like rocks for nObama's ?charisma?

[firstandten]

When was the last time you heard nObama was meeting with Unions or working class people to discuss the economy? Yet, he's always meeting with republicrats and business 'leaders'. He has a right-wing view of the world. I personally think nObama campaigned as a moderate to slightly left candidate, to draw in moderates, liberals and independents, when in reality he's a conservative on most everything except a few issues like DADT. He doesn't even support gay marriage. We were all so fed up with Bush and Cheney we fell like rocks for nObama's ?charisma?

Hey, I get it that you feel betrayed, but its not like he did a bait and switch on you. He told folks all along how he was. He said it in his books and he said it on the campaign trail and he said it during the town halls trying to get various parts of his agenda passed.

He said he didn't believe in gay marriage, but he supports DADT. He said afghanistan was the war to fight and Iraq was the war to get out of, hell, he told black folks that a rising tide lifts all ships or in other words no special treatment for the inner city brothers and sisters were unemployment is around 50%. In the town halls while pushing health care, he stated single payer because of the way our health care system has operated over the past few decades is unworkable. If we started a health care system from scratch he would support single payer. He's a pragmatist .. he rather be flexible and get you something than stand on principle and get you nothing. Thats the way DC works. There's too much money in the game to play it otherwise. And I still voted for him and will do so again. Do I agree with everything he does ? No. But looking at the political landscape he's the best out there. The cumulative effects of 30 years of Reaganomics with some help by Clinton are not going to be erased in 4 years to be truthful not in 8 years

[1KielsonDrive]

Hey, I get it that you feel betrayed, but its not like he did a bait and switch on you. He told folks all along how he was. He said it in his books and he said it on the campaign trail and he said it during the town halls trying to get various parts of his agenda passed.

He said he didn't believe in gay marriage, but he supports DADT. He said afghanistan was the war to fight and Iraq was the war to get out of, hell, he told black folks that a rising tide lifts all ships or in other words no special treatment for the inner city brothers and sisters were unemployment is around 50%. In the town halls while pushing health care, he stated single payer because of the way our health care system has operated over the past few decades is unworkable. If we started a health care system from scratch he would support single payer. He's a pragmatist .. he rather be flexible and get you something than stand on principle and get you nothing. Thats the way DC works. There's too much money in the game to play it otherwise. And I still voted for him and will do so again. Do I agree with everything he does ? No. But looking at the political landscape he's the best out there. The cumulative effects of 30 years of Reaganomics with some help by Clinton are not going to be erased in 4 years to be truthful not in 8 years

firstandten, you're too reasonable for me. I'm angry.

[maxx]

For all of you who think one major party is as bad as the other, do you think the Republicans would do this?
http://www.npr.org/2010/11/03/130596...sey-mine-in-ky
"...The Labor Department took an unprecedented step against a Kentucky coal mine Wednesday, asking that a federal judge shut it down immediately to protect the lives of those who work there....For 33 years, the agency has had the authority to take mining companies to federal court when they have serious and persistent safety violations. But this "injunctive relief" section of the Federal Mine Safety and Health Act has not been invoked until now..."

[1KielsonDrive]

For all of you who think one major party is as bad as the other, do you think the Republicans would do this?
http://www.npr.org/2010/11/03/130596...sey-mine-in-ky
"...The Labor Department took an unprecedented step against a Kentucky coal mine Wednesday, asking that a federal judge shut it down immediately to protect the lives of those who work there....For 33 years, the agency has had the authority to take mining companies to federal court when they have serious and persistent safety violations. But this "injunctive relief" section of the Federal Mine Safety and Health Act has not been invoked until now..."

Thanks maxx. No, I don't think the republicrats would do this. But, how long has it taken the demicans to do it? And, how often do the demicans actually do something like this? The two party system is a myth. We have a one party system that takes gobs and gobs of money from the same sources. In the end, what either party does for a particular client [[I didn't say citizens), is determined by which side of the party that client gave the most money to.

[Detroitej72]

The two party system is a myth. We have a one party system that takes gobs and gobs of money from the same sources. In the end, what either party does for a particular client [[I didn't say citizens), is determined by which side of the party that client gave the most money to.

I see that being the case more often than I care to admit.

[maxx]

He might had have fewer problems if he let people continue to call him Barry which was how he was known thru college.

It didn't seem to help Jimmy Carter who Republicans still like to point to inspite of Carter's accomplishments:

April 18, 1977 Carter addresses the nation on the emerging energy “catastrophe,” proposing additional taxes on gasoline and fuel-efficient automobiles.
August 4, 1977 The Department of Energy is established, consolidating the Nuclear Regulatory Commission and the Energy Research and Development Administration into a single agency.
September 17, 1978 Carter signs the Camp David Accords producing “a framework for peace” in the Middle East. The Camp David meetings are landmark negotiations between Israeli prime minister Menachem Begin and Egyptian prime minister Anwar Sadat.
January 1, 1979 The United States and China establish formal diplomatic realtions for the first time since 1949.
April 5, 1979 Carter addresses the Nation on Energy, announcing the end of domestic support for crude oil and that Americans “will have to use less oil and pay more for it.”
June 12, 1979 Carter proposes National Health Plan to Congress.
June 18, 1979 Carter and the Soviet Union’s Leonid Brezhnev signs the Strategic Arms Limitation Talks II [[SALT II) Treaty in Vienna, limiting each nations’ strategic weapons.
December 2, 1980 Carter signs the Alaska lands legislation, protecting over 100 million acres from exploitation.
December 11, 1980 Carter signs the Superfund Bill, designating 1.6 billion federal dollars to clean up toxic waste dumps.January 9, 1981Carter negotiates final terms for release of hostages from the Iran Hostage Crisis.

So what did Gerry Ford do? What did Ronnie do for the average citizen other than lose his/her money in the S & L crisis?

[1KielsonDrive]

It didn't seem to help Jimmy Carter who Republicans still like to point to inspite of Carter's accomplishments:

April 18, 1977 Carter addresses the nation on the emerging energy “catastrophe,” proposing additional taxes on gasoline and fuel-efficient automobiles.
August 4, 1977 The Department of Energy is established, consolidating the Nuclear Regulatory Commission and the Energy Research and Development Administration into a single agency.
September 17, 1978 Carter signs the Camp David Accords producing “a framework for peace” in the Middle East. The Camp David meetings are landmark negotiations between Israeli prime minister Menachem Begin and Egyptian prime minister Anwar Sadat.
January 1, 1979 The United States and China establish formal diplomatic realtions for the first time since 1949.
April 5, 1979 Carter addresses the Nation on Energy, announcing the end of domestic support for crude oil and that Americans “will have to use less oil and pay more for it.”
June 12, 1979 Carter proposes National Health Plan to Congress.
June 18, 1979 Carter and the Soviet Union’s Leonid Brezhnev signs the Strategic Arms Limitation Talks II [[SALT II) Treaty in Vienna, limiting each nations’ strategic weapons.
December 2, 1980 Carter signs the Alaska lands legislation, protecting over 100 million acres from exploitation.
December 11, 1980 Carter signs the Superfund Bill, designating 1.6 billion federal dollars to clean up toxic waste dumps.January 9, 1981Carter negotiates final terms for release of hostages from the Iran Hostage Crisis.

So what did Gerry Ford do? What did Ronnie do for the average citizen other than lose his/her money in the S & L crisis?

December 11, 1980 ?????????

[1KielsonDrive]

[quote=maxx;213562]It didn't seem to help Jimmy Carter who Republicans still like to point to inspite of Carter's accomplishments:

April 18, 1977 Carter addresses the nation on the emerging energy “catastrophe,” proposing additional taxes on gasoline and fuel-efficient automobiles.
August 4, 1977 The Department of Energy is established, consolidating the Nuclear Regulatory Commission and the Energy Research and Development Administration into a single agency.
September 17, 1978 Carter signs the Camp David Accords producing “a framework for peace” in the Middle East. The Camp David meetings are landmark negotiations between Israeli prime minister Menachem Begin and Egyptian prime minister Anwar Sadat.
January 1, 1979 The United States and China establish formal diplomatic realtions for the first time since 1949.
April 5, 1979 Carter addresses the Nation on Energy, announcing the end of domestic support for crude oil and that Americans “will have to use less oil and pay more for it.”
June 12, 1979 Carter proposes National Health Plan to Congress.
June 18, 1979 Carter and the Soviet Union’s Leonid Brezhnev signs the Strategic Arms Limitation Talks II [[SALT II) Treaty in Vienna, limiting each nations’ strategic weapons.
December 2, 1980 Carter signs the Alaska lands legislation, protecting over 100 million acres from exploitation.
December 11, 1980 Carter signs the Superfund Bill, designating 1.6 billion federal dollars to clean up toxic waste dumps.January 9, 1981Carter negotiates final terms for release of hostages from the Iran Hostage Crisis.

So what did Gerry Ford do? What did Ronnie do for the average citizen other than lose his/her money in the S & L crisis?[/quote]
I'm not arguing for Gerry Ford or Ronnie Reagan and I'm not arguing that the demicans haven't been a smidgen better than their other half. Many demicans have been complicit in those crises. Why has nObama care been such a farce? It wasn't the republicrats who mangled and sacked it, though they certainly gave it their best shot, it was demicans fighting against their own party and nObama giving the house away before the first hand. They had a huge majority in congress and squandered it. Call them what you like, 'Blue Dogs', moderates, blah, blah, blah, it was demicans [[closet republicrats??) pursuing the same money as republicrats. If you're arguing the demicans are better than republicrats - YOU WIN. But I'll argue the true difference - and it's not much.