Chrysler Auto Workers Busted

**gazhekwe** · September-23-10, 05:16 PM

I've been thinking about this all day. You know, not so long into the past, it used to be OK to go out and have a beer at lunch. Then came the Christian Sharia law invading our lives. Now, if someone has a beer at lunch you all want to perform career capital punishment on them. Where is the evidence that a beer for lunch is affecting these guys' job performance? Job performance is the one criterion the employer has to judge employees.

FWIW, I have never been a drinker, but I can't see why everyone is anxious to off these guys because they like having a beer for lunch.

**Rockin' Best** · September-23-10, 05:18 PM

Originally Posted by Hypestyles

On a side note-- is that old movie "Blue Collar" on dvd yet? Harvey Keitel, Richard Pryor, Yaphet Kotto? I've never seen it. Is it any good?

I really liked "Blue Collar" for its story line and shooting. Now it's also a time capsule - it was shot at Checker Motors in Kalamazoo [[unless they built a sound stage to replicate it). That's pretty cool in itself...

**FlyingJ** · September-23-10, 05:24 PM

WTF are these comments about?; "OOOhhh, it's Management Versus Labor! Oohhhhhh it's the FOX News Channel Agenda[[operating via a 62-year old DuMont affiliate?) attacking the progressive cause!" I was BORN under the pentastar, my dad worked his way via WSU & U of M out of the ghetto[[where my grandfather dropped dead walking home from his GM Factory gig, save a nickel on the streetcar). I knew a ton of guys-& their kids-who would brag about f'ing up a car on the line as some sort of half-assed class warfare, if you read "Rivethead" by Ben Hamper he takes a flamethrower to Michael Moore's treatise on the poor, afflicted assembly line guy-instead they're all drunk screwing around in those dark, crappy bars that were around the corner of every assembly plant I've ever seen. Even as a child I thought "that's really dumb, that crap will biye these clowns on the but one of these days". Everybody got-to use an aviation term-fat, dumb & happy, so when the Boomtown faded the rats starved. My neighbors out here had His & Her PT Cruisers. I have no idea if the characters in that video put them together but her transmission fell out on the I-15...I never saw Bill O'Reilly in the bushes with a monkey wrench, either. Anyway her husband immediately sold HIS PT & it's been a Japanese driveway ever since. Does anybody back there THINK about that? Do they care? Not that I'm Emily Gail here but lose the victim card & flush those turds, because only the people who believe in Detroit are the ones who truly pay for these eff ups;
http://jalopnik.com/5646242/former-d...car-dealership

**BagAJellyDonuts** · September-23-10, 05:36 PM

You don't know what's going to happen to these clowns.

Yeah they've been suspended, so what?

Until the UAW membership demands that their union will take a hard line stand against this crap, it will keep on going.

**Magnatomicflux** · September-23-10, 05:40 PM

Originally Posted by gazhekwe

I've been thinking about this all day. You know, not so long into the past, it used to be OK to go out and have a beer at lunch. Then came the Christian Sharia law invading our lives. Now, if someone has a beer at lunch you all want to perform career capital punishment on them. Where is the evidence that a beer for lunch is affecting these guys' job performance? Job performance is the one criterion the employer has to judge employees.

FWIW, I have never been a drinker, but I can't see why everyone is anxious to off these guys because they like having a beer for lunch.

There's nothing wrong with a beer or two for lunch. The guys I was refering to anyways are COMPLETELY HAMMERED or completly screwed up on coke. And it's not at lunch, it's on the job, everyday, all day. I can't tell you how many vodka and OJ's I've encountered on the plant floor. And it's so common place, that they just walk around with it in a clear plastic party cup. On top of that, they then get on their fork lift, pick up a 10,000 pound ladel of molten aluminum and drive around with it spilling it everywhere along the way. These privilaged driveres also reserve the RIGHT to run your ass down if you're in the way. I mean....if he has to jam on those brakes for sober little me, he's going to have a tidle wave of 780 degree aluminum flying at everyone within 15 feet.
So no...this is not acceptable.

I truly feel bad for the wrap that the vast majority of these workers, who are honest hard working folk, have to put up with because of the bad apples. But it's those guys as well who need to stand up and say enough is enough. Stop supporting these fucks just because there your "brother".

**One Shot** · September-23-10, 06:10 PM

I think the video is hilarious-of course due to editing. Honestly this crap has been going on for years and will not stop. To the rest of the nation this is typical Detroit.

thatguy123 · September-23-10, 06:10 PM

Originally Posted by Magnatomicflux

? One guy had a Mazda 6 parked in a Ford hourly lot. He came and reported that his car had been vandalized. I check it out and scratched ...to the metal, across his hood, trunk and doors was "THANKS FOR BUYING FORGEIN ASSHOLE"

Mazda....Ford...............don't one own the other?

Yes, Ford owns Mazda. The person who did the vandalism, if found, should be executed on site. One less retard for the world to worry about

**Magnatomicflux** · September-23-10, 06:13 PM

LOL

I would have to agree. They must not realize half the parts they put in a Ford, also go into a Mazda.

**oldredfordette** · September-23-10, 06:14 PM

Oh well.

I admit right off that I didn't watch the clip, I don't watch local "news" - I haven't believed anything they report for a very long time. Including the weather. But I digress.

As a steward, I have to defend workers who have been accused of substance abuse on the job*. I have had varied success at defending them. Either way, I believe very strongly that every worker has a right to union representation. If they are found guilty, they have to suffer the consequences. In my workplace, you have to go through rehab and a period of probation where they can spot test you whenever they like. I think this is an eminently fair deal. Some people are just assholes who like to fuck off on the job, some people have serious substance problems and deserve a chance to fix themselves. If you can't stay sober on the job you can't expect to be there long.

Back to the television clip, which I haven't watched. For an example, a family member works for a city government, in the engineering department. A couple of years ago, there was a severe snowstorm, he was called in to work at 3am to begin plowing, worked through the morning and into early afternoon. They finally stopped for lunch, around 2:30. The work crew relaxed and had a long lunch. You guessed it, one of those stupid stations was following them and filming them. Did they explain these guys had been working without stopping for hours and hours? Did they stop to ask them the circumstances of their late lunch? No, they were shown on local TV, "frolicking" on the taxpayer dime. For months afterwards, locals would stop them and take them to task for their "laziness". It wasn't Faux News, it was a different bastion of bullshit and blather. Maybe those UAW guys were substancing on the job. Maybe they weren't. Just sayin'. Don't believe it just because it was on TV.

*3 times in 15 years.

**313WX** · September-23-10, 06:15 PM

Originally Posted by thatguy123

Yes, Ford owns Mazda. The person who did the vandalism, if found, should be executed on site. One less retard for the world to worry about

Eh, Ford doesn't *own* Madza, only a portion [[35%) of it.

**oldredfordette** · September-23-10, 06:16 PM

Yes, execution as punishment for vandalism. Very reasoned and fair.

**313WX** · September-23-10, 06:19 PM

BTW, I have no problem with them having a drink or smoke on THEIR break or lunch time. It's their business, as long as it doesn't interfere with their work [[which so far no one has proof showing it directly does).

**Magnatomicflux** · September-23-10, 06:26 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

BTW, I have no problem with them having a drink or smoke on THEIR break or lunch time. It's their business, as long as it doesn't interfere with their work [[which so far no one has proof showing it directly does).

There's nothing wrong with a beer or two for lunch. The guys I was refering to anyways are COMPLETELY HAMMERED or completly screwed up on coke. And it's not at lunch, it's on the job, everyday, all day. I can't tell you how many vodka and OJ's I've encountered on the plant floor. And it's so common place, that they just walk around with it in a clear plastic party cup. On top of that, they then get on their fork lift, pick up a 10,000 pound ladel of molten aluminum and drive around with it spilling it everywhere along the way. These privilaged driveres also reserve the RIGHT to run your ass down if you're in the way. I mean....if he has to jam on those brakes for sober little me, he's going to have a tidle wave of 780 degree aluminum flying at everyone within 15 feet.
So no...this is not acceptable.

Proof.
Source - my eyballs taking in my daily environment.

**Lowell** · September-23-10, 06:27 PM

Suck up kick down journalism at it's best and worst. Best for ratings, worst for picking easy victims. Humiliation seems to be the the media elixir of the moment. Witness all the humiliating rejection shows from American idol on down.

As for the union defending them what doesn't anyone understand?? Hey are legally obliged to do so.

Chill everyone we have allegations based on a for-profit ambush journalism story. Do you wish to condemn them on what you have been fed from highly cropped footage? Is that how we now hand out justice? If they were wrong discipline them. I don't hear anyone arguing with that. But at least give them their hearing.

**GOAT** · September-23-10, 06:37 PM

Who's a victim Lowell? The taxpayer for funding these idiots [[while the rest work hard)? The person who buys a shoddy product because of lax workers?

Sure they deserve a hearing but the fact is many of us know that this goes on daily and we are sick of it. After the hearing, when they are busted then what? Do we coddle them some more as it is done now?

How are the unions legally obliged to defend them when they are caught red-handed?

**Magnatomicflux** · September-23-10, 07:04 PM

Meh, paying union dues is like pre paying a defense attorney. They pay for a service and are entiled to be defended weather or not they're guilty.

**Lowell** · September-23-10, 07:11 PM

For there to be a victim Goat the busted workers would have had to have done something that caused damage to another person or property. Did that happened? You may draw sweeping generalized conclusions about societal victimization based on the highly edited and carefully produced footage you saw but it doesn't make a victim under our definition of justice on either side of the Straits. They are busted, seemingly, but that does not mean there is a victim of their poor choices or even a conviction. I'm not defending or coddling anyone just saying that the full story needs to be heard before we get the torches and rope.

**BagAJellyDonuts** · September-23-10, 08:02 PM

You guys have read the update?

On the freep they're saying that the guys they've found have been suspended.

They are also saying that Wolcheck got this story by a tip from a co-worker.

Couple questions for sure. Like why didn't management get or take a shot at these guys first. & what's it like where they were working now?

http://www.freep.com/article/2010092...caught-boozing

**Ltdave** · September-23-10, 08:09 PM

I would LOVE to know why a guy making 40 bucks an hour is only required to fart out ONE dollar for presciptions. Is it because WE pick up the tab when we purchase a vehicle?

wow! where can i get a $40 an hour job with the big three? ive been there 16 years, skilled trades and dont make that. MY SUPERVISOR doesnt make that much. my co-pay for 'scripts are $20 unless i go with mail-order for maintenance drugs [['continuous use like blood pressure, thyroid, asthma etc) which is then $8 or $10...

to address everyones concern about "the union defending the 5% of the workers who cause all the problems..." is because a little thing called the Wagner Act [[National Labor Relations Act) from 1935. the unions are REQUIRED to provide fair and competent representation of employees, at the personal risk to the representative if they fail to do so...

like i said above. ive been in the big 3 for 16 years. i DO NOT condone that behavior at all. never have, never will with the exception of doing what you want on your own time. those guys are doing nothing to promote the union or the company...

**marcwigle** · September-23-10, 08:18 PM

Originally Posted by Goose

Alcoholism is a disease. We should feel sorry for these guys, they need treatment. I hope Chrysler and their benefits package will provide the necessary treatment, perhaps at an in house substance abuse clinic in maybe Florida or California for a few months so these guys can overcome their addictions and return to their jobs clean and sober.

Disease? BS... tell that to the person who the drunk driver killed on the way home from drinking all damn night. Calling it a disease gives them an excuse. No damn way that I'll ever feel sorry for a drunk.

**oldredfordette** · September-23-10, 08:22 PM

We pay avg. $15 co-pay on prescription drugs. Haven't had a dollar co-pay in a very long time.

Yeah, the $40 is pretty funny.

Stosh · September-23-10, 08:43 PM

Originally Posted by Magnatomicflux

There's nothing wrong with a beer or two for lunch. The guys I was refering to anyways are COMPLETELY HAMMERED or completly screwed up on coke. And it's not at lunch, it's on the job, everyday, all day. I can't tell you how many vodka and OJ's I've encountered on the plant floor. And it's so common place, that they just walk around with it in a clear plastic party cup. On top of that, they then get on their fork lift, pick up a 10,000 pound ladel of molten aluminum and drive around with it spilling it everywhere along the way. These privilaged driveres also reserve the RIGHT to run your ass down if you're in the way. I mean....if he has to jam on those brakes for sober little me, he's going to have a tidle wave of 780 degree aluminum flying at everyone within 15 feet.
So no...this is not acceptable.

Proof.
Source - my eyballs taking in my daily environment.

So you are psychic then I suppose. To presume that someone is "hammered" requires an insight within this person's brain THAT YOU DON'T HAVE.

And which of the Big 3 do you work for that this occurs at? Pray tell....

**Melocoton** · September-23-10, 09:04 PM

Thanks, Oldredfordette, for a sane and fair-minded perspective on the situation. Not that it will satisfy the anonymous internet morality brigade on here. If there weren't suckers, though, there wouldn't be journalism like this.

**Magnatomicflux** · September-23-10, 09:23 PM

Originally Posted by Stosh

So you are psychic then I suppose. To presume that someone is "hammered" requires an insight within this person's brain THAT YOU DON'T HAVE.

And which of the Big 3 do you work for that this occurs at? Pray tell....

So, I have to be psychic to know someone is hammered? What the hell are you talking about? When a guy can't even focus on me and absolutly stinks of liquor, slurs his words and pisses his pants he's not hammered? Do you know how many times I've escorted assholes like that out of a plant? I had to put on latex gloves just so I could help the fucker down the stairs while he's fighting me the whole way and his coveralls were SATURATED with piss. Why? Because he was passed out laying in it.
And it's FoMoCo, WAP, EEP, EAP, WEP, ANNEX....I've done'em all so don't try telling me this doesn't happen as much as everyone is making it out to be.

I exagerated the perscription costs but an hourly worker here can start and 24 and work up to 35 bucks with time. A SKILLED TRADE SPECIALIST can and will earn up to $40 per hour. Unless it's the weekend, then I'm pretty sure it's double time.

**pffft** · September-23-10, 09:24 PM

The union is required to represent the workers during a disciplinary meeting for something like this, that doesn't equate defending or condoning their actions.

The Chrysler v.p. of manufacturing himself said that the repercussions for these fellows is right in the UAW contract. Most union contracts today have strict provisions for workers caught impaired on the job, the contracts are very different in that way from contracts in the past.

If they keep their jobs, they'll be subject to random drug and alcohol testing ...