Houston-whittier Hayes area.

[Buy American]

Chatham was at Hayes/Houston Whittier as well as on Woodland and Kelly. The Hayes store was known as #2, and the original Chatham was on Kelly and Washtenaw.

There was a Chatham at 8 and Gratiot as well. I don't remember the one on Hayes or the one on Woodland and Kelly, maybe before my time.

[Gistok]

Yes the original Chathams store was on Kelley Rd. in Harper Woods. And Chatham #2 was over on Hayes at Houston/-Whittier. Chatham #7 was on 8 Mile & Gratiot [[next to Shoppers Fair)... and Chatham #8 was on Morang at Kelley.

IIRC, the name Chathams came from Chatham Village, an early name for part of Harper Woods. The chain was founded and owned by the Weisberg family [[4 brothers) until sometime in the 1980s, when a new owner sucked the profits out of it and ran the chain into the ground....

[Rochelle St.]

The Chatham I was referring to was the one at Hayes and Mayfield across from the Guardian Angels school.
The one at 8 Mile and Gratiot was in East Detroit. [[Eastpointe.)
Anyone else remember a nice lady named Olga who worked at the Hayes store?
Me and my sister do.

[Maof]

Yes the original Chathams store was on Kelley Rd. in Harper Woods. And Chatham #2 was over on Hayes at Houston/-Whittier. Chatham #7 was on 8 Mile & Gratiot [[next to Shoppers Fair)... and Chatham #8 was on Morang at Kelley.

IIRC, the name Chathams came from Chatham Village, an early name for part of Harper Woods. The chain was founded and owned by the Weisberg family [[4 brothers) until sometime in the 1980s, when a new owner sucked the profits out of it and ran the chain into the ground....

Not sure if this is true but the guys at my local Krogers [[who are former Chatham employees) told me that Chatham was bought out by the Kroger chain.

[Wingnatic]

It was indeed bought out by Kroger's
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chatham_[[grocer)

There is still an old Chatham's distribution building standing off of 10 mile Rd. E.of Mound Rd. directly across from a Banquet Center

[EMG]

Welcome, Rochelle St. I grew up with my grandparents on Nottingham between Morang and Britain [[near Kavan's) and my parents, who both worked, lived in Whitehill between Grayton and Britain, so I remember a LOT about the Whittier/Hayes/Kelly area. Of course, having grown up east of Kelly, I always thought of Rochelle as being an extension of Yorkshire!

Where do I begin? Well, I was in that area from the 60s through 80s, so let's start right with the Civic Center. I remember Grinnell's right on the corner - in fact I even took piano lessons there for a year [[1974, when I was 12).

Since I grew up in a Catholic home and my grandparents continued the tradition of abstaining from meat on Friday even long after the "official rules" got relaxed, Milroy's fish and chips were a Friday staple for us, my grandfather regularly braving that line at lunch time just about every Friday. Sometimes as an alternative we had meatless potato and/or cheese pierogis from Kowalksi's [[mentioned below) as an alternative.

Throughout my early childhood years my grandmother would go shopping at the Civic Center and bring me along. Let's see, they had Winkelman's, Sanders, Kresge's, Robelle's [[? I think that was the name of the small dress shop in that area) and then the green Cunningham's store at the corner. Of course Sanders was my favorite. My parents would often take me there for the 2 p.m. to 4 p.m. half-price Happy Hour Hot Fudge Sundae specials. I'd almost always have mine with butter pecan ice cream. My grandfather also made Sanders a regular staple of his grocery shopping, often buying yellow layer cakes and Awrey coffee cake products. And then there was Kowalski's lunchmeat deli across the street where they would slice meats to order. I remember I used to like to go in there with my grandfather and smell the unique smell of that store. One sure can't experience that smell at the WalMart SuperCenter Deli Corner! Of course now I'm a health nut who wouldn't be caught dead [[pardon the pun) eating lunch meat anymore!!!! My grandfather also frequently bought the Polish "angel wings" pastries from there, as well as the above-mentioned pierogies. You just can't get quality take-out Polish food like that these days any more.

I also remember Pape's very well. That was sort of a home furnishings/lamps/knickknacks shop right across Houston Whittier from Cunninghams. My grandmother LOVED that place, and it was just about her home away from home any time we went around that area. A lot of the time I'd hang around in Cunningham's while she shopped at Papes. I remember Pape's eventually closing down in about 1980, when it was replaced by a bike shop.

I do remember the Standard Federal over there, and in fact in 1981 opened my first checking account there.

Thanks to the person who mentioned the little Fotomat shop - I had forgotten about that but that brought back an instant mental picture. My parents would ALWAYS go there to have their film developed.

I remember when there was a traffic triangle as you came to Kelly from westbound Whittier...and also in the early 80's when the traffic triangle was eliminated and the landscaping was added in front of what at that time, not sure if it's still there, was Manufacturer's/Comerica Bank.

I also remember, I believe west of Hayes on Houston Whittier, the "Norge Village" laundromat where sometimes my mother would take stuff to be cleaned.

I remember Bonnie-Lo - sort of a quasi-supermarket - my grandparents and I would shop there quite often too. This was back in the days before Barnes and Nobel and Border's, and I used to like to go to Bonnie-Lo so I could browse the book rack while my grandparents shopped.

Now let's see if I can stir up a few more memories of other places which you and others may remember from further east along Whittier. The Denby Bowling alley - to which my mom took me many times, and I still remember bowling for the first time at the age of probably 8 or 9 and racking up the impressive first game grand total score of - 50.

The little strip mall between Laing and Duchess - containing Dino's Pizza [[which we often had as takeout) and Lawson's Market [[where my parents would sometimes go to grab a quick staple grocery item). Across the street from Denby Bowling was and may be still is a do-it-yourself car wash. And oh yes, a strip of businesses between Payton and Riad, especially Whittier Jewelry. There was another place right next to that that got sold off to a successive number of freak cult groups - I seem to remember Eckankar or something like that as one of them.

Between Laing and Whitehill was Jason's Bakery - another favorite of my parents - and the Sunoco Gas Station. On the south side of Whittier at Whitehill was The Laundromat, and then, i believe, a church. I remember Alvin C. Percy Jewelry between Laing and Wayburn - in fact I still to this day have and wear a tiger-eye ring that I got from that store in 1977. I can still visualize Mr. Percy's face.

Moving further east towards Rossiter, we had The Fruit Stand - another place my parents shopped for fruit and vegetable staples [[my gosh, when I think of all the different places we used to have to go to go shopping!!!!! And just last night I went to Walmart's and got everything I needed for a week in only 30 minutes!!! The difference is the quality of the produce wasn't even comparable).

Then on the other side of Whittier was the fire station, Engine Co. 58. East from that was Perini's Restaurant. Then at the corner of Nottingham was the Minute Drug Store. On the north side of Whittier between Nottingham and Somerset was a shoemaker shop [[these days most younger people probably wouldn't even have a concept of what that was) - where we would often take old shoes to be repaired and resoled.

At Balfour was the Union 76 station. Then moving further east was Dominican High School, and finally the I-94 service drive, beyond which was St. Matthew's Catholic Church.

And this concludes our tour of Whittier from Hayes to Harper.

[EMG]

The Chatham I was referring to was the one at Hayes and Mayfield across from the Guardian Angels school.
The one at 8 Mile and Gratiot was in East Detroit. [[Eastpointe.)
Anyone else remember a nice lady named Olga who worked at the Hayes store?
Me and my sister do.

I don't remember Olga or the East Detroit store [[what I remember of 8 and Gratiot was Shopper's Fair which later became KMart).

But my grandfather did sometimes do the grocery shopping at that Guardian Angels area Chatham's. Most of the time, though, we'd go to the one on Morang and Kelly as it was slightly closer to our house. The church next to the Morang Chathams [[was it Salem's????) was also where I went to vote for the first time in 1980.

[jcole]

Here's the listing of Chatham's in our general area circa 1980.

Store # Location Store Managers
#2 12421 Hayes & Houston Whittier [[Kelly) Detroit Jim Galloway - John Grimaldi
#3 24900 Kelly Rd & 10 Mile Rd - East Detriot Ron Diegel - Bob Holzen
#5 19700 Kelly Rd & Woodland - Harper Woods Pete Bommarito - Larry Fournier
#7 20900 Gratiot & 8 Mile Rd. - East Detroit Joe Fabera - Demetrio Franco
#8 12511 Morang & Kelly - Detroit Mike LaDuke - Steve Katsaros
#9 23245 Mack & 9 Mile Rd. - St Clair Shores Mike Summers - Rich Kolakowski
#10 9731 Harper & Gratiot - Detroit Marion Parker - Bill Sanders
#11 35641 S. Gratiot & 15 Mile Rd. - Clinton Twp. Jim Ellis - Jerry Bonior
#12 28804 Gratiot & 12 Mile Rd. - Roseville Dave White - John D'Agostin
#47 32 Market St. & Gratiot - Mt. Clemens Rich Dreyer - Chuck Smith
#51 14350 E. 9 Mile Rd & Weller - Warren Jerry Jahimiak - Ross Torrento

You find all of them listed at this link:
http://www.connellcreationsunlimited...tores1980.html

[EMG]

Thanks - I've seen that link before, probably on this forum or its predecessor.

I did also see mention on that link of my all time favorite - the "Chatham Plus" at Van Dyke and Chicago in Warren. At the time I'd never been to a Meijer's or a Walmart Supercenter [[there certainly weren't WalMarts in Michigan, and if Meijers was even around back then it was a place my family just didn't go to) - so when that Chatham Plus opened it was my first experience with a store of that type ever - and I remember thinking how cool it was to have a donut/coffee stand AND a cafeteria AND a garden center AND a clothing store all in the same building with a grocery store. Now, of course, I would just take all that for granted!

[Gistok]

It was indeed bought out by Kroger's
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chatham_[[grocer)

There is still an old Chatham's distribution building standing off of 10 mile Rd. E.of Mound Rd. directly across from a Banquet Center

Wiki mentions that Kroger bought a lot of the Chatham stores AFTER the chain went out of business.

I believe that at the very bottom of the page in the Chatham link that jcole provided... it mentions "Nu-Trax".... which IIRC was the name of the company that bought Chathams and drove them out of business.

[EMG]

Looking at your list some of those names look familiar. Hayes/Houston John Grimaldi - wasn't/isn't there some sort of Grimaldi store somewhere in the east side suburbs? It seems familiar - right up there with Bomaritto or Salvagio's.

And was Jerry Bonior related to the former congressman Bonior?

[313WX]

Here's the listing of Chatham's in our general area circa 1980.


You find all of them listed at this link:
http://www.connellcreationsunlimited...tores1980.html

I know for a fact most of these locations were purchased by A&P [[Farmer Jacks) or Metro Foodland and not Kroger.

The Gratiot & 12 Mile location [[most likely where the Wal-MArt is now) was a Farmer Jacks back in the 90s. Then of course the location on 8 Mile & Gratiot was also a Farmer Jack for a while [[until the early 2000s). Finally the location on Harper & Gratiot was also a Farmer Jacks.

And if I peg this right, the Kelly/Woodland location is now Vegas Food Center. 9 Mile/Weller is a Shopper's Market. Kelly/10 Mile is a Thrift Store [[Value World).

[jehmsu]

I lived on Wayburn near Yorkshire and went briefly to Anthony Wayne Elementary [[Wayburn and Courville) until we moved in 1960. Friday night dinners at Milroy's, shopping at Pape's Gift Store at Houston-Whittier and Hayes and watching the building of the new A&P kitty-corner across the street. The new Guardian Angels church was built around the same time. Movies at the Civic, touring the fire station at Whittier and Lakepointe with my class, Perini's for dinner when we'd really "live it up".

Most of the buildings are still there but the neighborhood's really a shell of what it used to be. Great place to live as a kid though.

[EMG]

Most of the buildings are still there but the neighborhood's really a shell of what it used to be. Great place to live as a kid though.

Sadly, that just about sums up the City of Detroit.

[royce]

Never wanted to start a thread about the following, but did you know that Houston-Whittier is really the continuation of Six Mile/McNichols and not Seymour. Given that fact and the fact that most of the mile road streets are commercial streets, Houston-Whittier should have been a commercial street from Gratiot to Hayes as well. You have to make long walks to the store if you live along that stretch of Houston-Whittier, unless you live a block from Gratiot or Hayes. Poor urban design, putting all those houses on that stretch of the street.

[Hermod]

The problem is that the area is the place where the "township and section" system of land survey established by the US in the late 18th century interfaced with the "ribbon farm" platting of the French colonials. You have the north-south and east-west orientation of the streets meeting the streets laid out perpendicular to and parallel to the lake and river shorelines. Hayes is a section line road and Kelly is the boundary road for ribbon farms.

[EMG]

Never wanted to start a thread about the following, but did you know that Houston-Whittier is really the continuation of Six Mile/McNichols and not Seymour. Given that fact and the fact that most of the mile road streets are commercial streets, Houston-Whittier should have been a commercial street from Gratiot to Hayes as well. You have to make long walks to the store if you live along that stretch of Houston-Whittier, unless you live a block from Gratiot or Hayes. Poor urban design, putting all those houses on that stretch of the street.

Hm...geographically I'd have to disagree with that; cross Gratiot on 6 mile and you do head directly into Seymour, not Houston- Houston is at least a quarter to a half mile south. I think going strictly by lattitude coordinates the east-of-Kelly section of MORANG would be closer to being an extension of 6 mile than Houston Whittier [[which at Gratiot lines up with Westphalia). Actually when I lived in the area [[Nottingham a few houses north of Britain) I always considered Britain itself to be equal to "Six Mile" at least just in my own mind because it lined up most closely with Seymour - of course I conveniently put out of mind little details like the fact that Seymour ran at an angle southeast from the true Six Mile line thanks to the jog just west of Gratiot.

But, true, it is the issue mentioned by Hermod that is responsible for the lack of continuity.

Where I live here in Scottsdale just east of Phoenix, AZ, things are a little different. There are hardly any streets that run at angles - everything is perfectly north-south and east-west [[except for scattered subdivisions with curved streets sort of like the Lingemann/Chapoton area of St. Clair Shores, but that's a different topic!!). No Groesbecks or Gratiots or Grand Rivers - although we do have one sort of oddball street, Frank Lloyd Wright - that takes a northwest to southeast curve thanks to a water canal. And our street address numbers - especially on east-west streets, are perfectly aligned with numbered north-south streets and avenues, so that if you have a house's number you know EXACTLY what two cross streets it is in between. Our north-south numbering, while not as easy to immediately mentally interpret into cross streets like the east-west numbering, is nonetheless consistent. And unlike Detroit, street names don't change as much. Not very much of this Six Mile is Really McNichols is Really Seymour or Wattles is Really 17 Mile or Vernier is Eight Mile is Base Line Unless Eight Mile is Really Old Eight Mile Which Runs North of Vernier which is Still the Real Eight Mile Because it has All The Traffic And Old Eight Mile Just happens To Run along A County Line But Turn Into A Residential Street That No One Wants You To Drive Down. Nope, here, whether you're in Scottsdale Or Phoenix or Glendale, the first street north of Thunderbird is ALWAYS Ludlow and the next street north of that is ALWAYS Friess and when you see one you know what the next one is going to be and you also know roughly where you are in the overall scheme of things.

What IS different down here is that even though the streets have the same names at the same lattitudes, they don't go through. We have mountains and subdivisions and other obstacles, so you can't just take any sidestreet and take it on a residential tour through the entire city or even a lengthy part of the city like you might be able to on, say, Lappin or Nottingham. You'll wind up in curving, no-outlet, or even gated communities and have to go a mile or two out of your way to trek back and find the next part of the road you can drive on! For all the things I like about Arizona, there are definitely times when I'm out riding my bike that I miss the waffle-iron-grid pattern typical of eastside Detroit and its east side suburbs where you could take just about any street anywhere and stay on that same street for miles and/or have any of an endless number of combinations to take to get through any neighborhood. Here, you can't go more than about a half mile AT THE MOST on any sidestreet without having to get out onto the equivalent of a "mile" or at least "half-mile" road and then backtrack. But it sure does cut down on traffic through residential neighborhoods - and that is probably the idea behind the "madness."

[royce]

EMG, if you look at a Google map of Six Mile, you will see that it slants northeast before it gets to Gratiot. If it continued in a straight line, it would line up with Houston-Whittier at Gratiot. Try it.

[Hermod]

there are definitely times when I'm out riding my bike that I miss the waffle-iron-grid pattern typical of eastside Detroit and its east side suburbs where you could take just about any street anywhere and stay on that same street for miles and/or have any of an endless number of combinations to take to get through any neighborhood.

All of the "English village" named streets [[Nottingham, Somerset, Balfour, Beaconsfield, Roxbury, etc) made a one-half block "jog" at Whittier. They did not go straight through.

[EMG]

[[To Royce: )

WOW - I stand corrected! I just did that and it was a revelation! [[I had never taken into consideration the curve at Hoover). WOW!

[EMG]

And now I just did an even MORE interesting experiment. Continuing on on that same Google Earth view, I mentally extrapolated "Six Mile" further east. If the 6 Mile / Houston "line" is extended further [[disregarding the angle to the southeast that Whittier makes at Kelly) the actual line of "6 Mile" would actually cut right through what was formerly known as the "SEVEN-Mack Center" at Mack and Moross just east of St. John Hospital!!

[Hermod]

I lived on Wayburn near Yorkshire and went briefly to Anthony Wayne Elementary [[Wayburn and Courville) until we moved in 1960.

I went to Wayne from 1944 to 1951 [[K-6). Was the Polar Bear ice cream shop still there on Wayburn and Whittier? If we had a bit of money, instead of eating lunch at school, we would walk over to Polar Bear and get a hot dog or a burger.

Do you remember Archie's Drug Store at Roxbury and Whittier? Archie ran it by himself and lived in an apartment just behind the store. Archie had a wild and unkempt look and the kids called him "Crazy Harry". They used to do all kinds of things to bedevil him and get him to chase them. They would pound on the door to his apartment at night and he would chase them down the block in his pajamas.

[EMG]

All of the "English village" named streets [[Nottingham, Somerset, Balfour, Beaconsfield, Roxbury, etc) made a one-half block "jog" at Whittier. They did not go straight through.

Well, that's true - many east side streets also made similar jogs at Morang and even at Six and/or Seven mile if you consider the west-of-Gratiot ones like Westphalia, Joann, etc.) - but relative to having to actually go a half mile out of and back into another neighborhood, for all practical purposes those little "jogs" were too inconsequential to even count.

[ja!mz]

EMG-LOL your reference to the chapaton/ lingeman area rings true. I grew up in SCS, when I was a kid someone was following me one night from from 696. I took them through those streets so I could lose them and it worked!...I then scurried back home with no one in tow...

[EMG]

I went to Wayne from 1944 to 1951 [[K-6). Was the Polar Bear ice cream shop still there on Wayburn and Whittier? If we had a bit of money, instead of eating lunch at school, we would walk over to Polar Bear and get a hot dog or a burger.

Do you remember Archie's Drug Store at Roxbury and Whittier? Archie ran it by himself and lived in an apartment just behind the store. Archie had a wild and unkempt look and the kids called him "Crazy Harry". They used to do all kinds of things to bedevil him and get him to chase them. They would pound on the door to his apartment at night and he would chase them down the block in his pajamas.

The Polar Bear shop was definitely long gone before my time; I don't ever remember seeing it even in the 60's which would have been my earliest recollection, when I was old enough to recognize and be aware of places like the fire station and the Progressive School For Little Folks. In my day, the place to go for ice cream was Baskin Robbins at Morang and McKinney, and I guess hamburgers MIGHT have been the Confectionary store at Roxbury and Morang, although I never actually went into that store so I don't even know just what was available there. I also never heard of Archie's - I would have remembered it as I would have associated it mentally with the Archie comic books of which I was a huge fan at the time. I do remember once in the '80s taking my stereo in for repair at Inter City Electronics which was on Whittier and Roxbury, and I also remember a Seven Eleven store being, I believe, between Roxbury and Lakepoint - was that the site of the former Archies?