Why Is Coleman Young so hated???

**Blueidone** · August-01-10, 02:54 PM

Originally Posted by Meddle

He was an arrogant, conceited, bullying thug who ran a well-oiled crime syndicate. You've heard the term 'Teflon Don' as it related to John Gotti? Young was so crooked, no investigation ever got close enough to him to arrest, let alone convict. He was probably the worst thing ever to happen to the city.

You are absolutely right, Meddle. There were several Grand Jury investigations into his crooked behavior, kickbacks, etc. But in each case, someone close to him would accept the blame and deny that CAY had anything to do with it. That person would go to jail while CAY's war chest supported his family. At that time there was a squad of US Attorney's doing nothing but investigating his wrongdoings.

**EMG** · August-01-10, 02:57 PM

I am absolutely no fan of Hizzonner, and in fact I will firmly assert he was the absolute prime catalyst for the decline of Detroit...primarily because of the fact that he destroyed both the power and the integrity of the Detroit Police force, essentially shattering law enforcement, and allowing the criminal element to take over.

But the following - while unarguably a true statement - is one that really amazes me, that so many people could make that misinterpretation - even though indeed they were:

Originally Posted by Fury13

A large portion of white Detroiters felt that the "hit 8 Mile" remarks were directed at them [[when in reality the words were meant for the criminal element). So, whites who believed that Young didn't care whether they stayed in Detroit decided to leave during the '70s and '80s..

I personally watched Coleman Young's inaugural in 1974 - and I am white and I was only TWELVE YEARS OLD at the time - and even then I had no trouble understanding that Young was telling CRIMINALS - not "white people" - to "hit the road." In fact I remember very clearly that he followed that sentence with "...and I don't care if they are black or white...."

So there was no way of possibly listening to that opening speech with an unbiased mind and making that misinterpretation.

It's just too bad for Detroit that he didn't practice what he promised, and deal with the criminals BOTH BLACK AND WHITE. THAT is the failure that lead to Detroit's downfall.

**Fury13** · August-01-10, 03:01 PM

Originally Posted by EMG

I am absolutely no fan of Hizzonner, and in fact I will firmly assert he was the absolute prime catalyst for the decline of Detroit...primarily because of the fact that he destroyed both the power and the integrity of the Detroit Police force, essentially shattering law enforcement, and allowing the criminal element to take over.

But the following - while unarguably a true statement - is one that really amazes me, that so many people could make that misinterpretation - even though indeed they were:

I personally watched Coleman Young's inaugural in 1974 - and I am white and I was only TWELVE YEARS OLD at the time - and even then I had no trouble understanding that Young was telling CRIMINALS - not "white people" - to "hit the road." In fact I remember very clearly that he followed that sentence with "...and I don't care if they are black or white...."

So there was no way of possibly listening to that opening speech with an unbiased mind and making that misinterpretation.

I agree that no one should have misinterpreted his remarks. They seem pretty clear. Yet, it happened... they were taken the wrong way. I've talked to many who were adults living in Detroit then... even today, they believe Young was telling whites to "hit 8 Mile."

**Meddle** · August-01-10, 03:04 PM

But in each case, someone close to him would accept the blame and deny that CAY had anything to do with it.

Case in point, Bill Hart.

**Meddle** · August-01-10, 03:12 PM

The comment was directed at the criminal element. To that there is no doubt. But that is one of the things that set the 'burbs against him so badly. They didn't want the city's garbage coming out there and spoiling their communities

You'll notice that none of my posts mention black or white. As far as I'm concerned that piece of crap was only concerned with two colors .... green and gold and how much of each he cold stuff into his pockets and off-shore accounts in the Caymans.

People are POd at Kwame' and rightfully so, but KK was a rank amateur at robbing the city blind compared to Coleman.

**firstandten** · August-01-10, 03:19 PM

Originally Posted by Fury13

I agree that no one should have misinterpreted his remarks. They seem pretty clear. Yet, it happened... they were taken the wrong way. I've talked to many who were adults living in Detroit then... even today, they believe Young was telling whites to "hit 8 Mile."

I did not take his statements the wrong way. What upsets folks is that he also said I don't care if you wear a superfly suit or a police uniform. During that time the police department needed a shake-up and it needed to more accurately reflect the population of Detroit at the time. Young did that. White folks didn't like it because he upset the status quo. There was a shifting in political power and population, and whites didn't like it or want to lose power. If whites had accepted what was happening they would have voted for Richard Austin in the election before CAY came into office , that way Detroit might never had to deal with CAY and whites in Detroit would have been a lot happier.

**mwilbert** · August-01-10, 03:51 PM

What would have been better is if the Free Press hadn't endorsed Mogk, and Ravitz had made it to the final election, where [[in my opinion) he would have beaten Young. Obviously Detroit would have had a black mayor sometime soon thereafter, but I think the transition would have been smoother--the fact that Young was running against Nichols and STRESS wasn't ideal.

Young had a confrontational style which rubbed many people the wrong way, but frankly I think the main reason some people don't like him is that he wasn't a very successful mayor. The city was collapsing around him and he didn't have any useful response to it, and in his later terms he didn't even seem to be trying. It is very similar to why people don't like Gov. Granholm.

**Fury13** · August-01-10, 03:53 PM

Originally Posted by Meddle

The comment was directed at the criminal element. To that there is no doubt. But that is one of the things that set the 'burbs against him so badly. They didn't want the city's garbage coming out there and spoiling their communities.

True, that was the other side of the coin regarding those comments. Suburban whites thought CAY was urging criminals to pillage the then-mostly-white suburbs.

As far as Young being a crook, I think that CAY simply felt he was putting the political spoils system and cronyism to use, as had many white mayors before him. He probably felt like it was "his turn" at personally benefiting from being in power.

I can understand how he came to be so well liked by blacks... African-Americans finally had access to the workings of city government under Young. They felt like they finally had a voice.

**firstandten** · August-01-10, 03:59 PM

Originally Posted by mwilbert

Young had a confrontational style which rubbed many people the wrong way.

He learned it from his mentor Orville Hubbard he figured if it worked for him it can work for me

**Detroit Stylin** · August-01-10, 04:02 PM

I am absolutely no fan of Hizzonner, and in fact I will firmly assert he was the absolute prime catalyst for the decline of Detroit...primarily because of the fact that he destroyed both the power and the integrity of the Detroit Police force, essentially shattering law enforcement, and allowing the criminal element to take over.

But the following - while unarguably a true statement - is one that really amazes me, that so many people could make that misinterpretation - even though indeed they were:

Soooooooo....by diversifying the police department he somehow destroyed the integrity of it? And then the criminal element...who were they? would things have been better had he kept smart in tact to keep the criminal element at bay? Good damn job they were doing I see....

Buy American · August-01-10, 04:04 PM

Originally Posted by Fury13

As far as Young being a crook, I think that CAY simply felt he was putting the political spoils system and cronyism to use, as had many white mayors before him. He probably felt like it was "his turn" at personally benefiting from being in power.

I can understand how he came to be so well liked by blacks... African-Americans finally had access to the workings of city government under Young. They felt like they finally had a voice.

Are you speaking of the citizens of Detroit or the administration, or both?

**dtowncitylover** · August-01-10, 04:31 PM

I always told that Poletown was CAY's doing. It was his big counter-attack to the white population.

I was taught that racism had to include thought [[prejudice) and action [[discrimination). So we all have prejudice, but that doesn't make us full racists, and when we act upon our prejudice then we complete full-on racism.

So Young was prejudice against white people [[and rightly so, but two wrong don't make it right) for segregating the black population, so he wanted to get back, and gave General Motors the Poletown neighborhood, one of the last white neighborhoods of the city, to build the now infamous plant. So there we have it, Coleman A. Young, the Racist.

lilpup · August-01-10, 04:40 PM

Originally Posted by Fury13

I agree that no one should have misinterpreted his remarks. They seem pretty clear. Yet, it happened... they were taken the wrong way. I've talked to many who were adults living in Detroit then... even today, they believe Young was telling whites to "hit 8 Mile."

Huh, I've never heard it interpreted that way, but rather as a major catalyst in escalating the city v suburb tensions - he was telling the criminal element to hit the suburbs, particularly the northern suburbs.

**Detroit Stylin** · August-01-10, 04:44 PM

Originally Posted by lilpup

Huh, I've never heard it interpreted that way, but rather as a major catalyst in escalating the city v suburb tensions - he was telling the criminal element to hit the suburbs, particularly the northern suburbs.

Karl used to make reference to that all the time....you know how victimized he was...

**oldredfordette** · August-01-10, 04:58 PM

I think it's very funny that many of the same people who call Obama a racist are chiming in calling Young one.

The police force of the early 70's needed fixing.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · August-01-10, 06:01 PM

Originally Posted by oldredfordette

I think it's very funny that many of the same people who call Obama a racist are chiming in calling Young one.

The police force of the early 70's needed fixing.

Totally agree. Those big corn-fed white cops reeked havoc against young black males, something had to be done. I was approaching my teen years when STRESS was intimidating and coercing young blacks just for walking down the street. "Where you goin Boy"??? The Police dept was damn near lily white, and they got away with some vile _hit back then. So I don't blame CAY one bit for recruiting more blacks for the force. Flip the script, and see how it feels to be _ucked with just because.

**313WX** · August-01-10, 06:19 PM

Originally Posted by MickeyMac

It seems nobody has anything good to say about him, and he is blamed for the decline of the motor city. What did he do to bring down the city????

I'm honestly not sure, especially since the folks who hate him are as equally responsible for bringing down the city with their "I'm taking my ball home" mentality [[L. Brooks Patterson & Jim Fouts are the poster kids of it).

He did the best for Detroit with what he had available.

lilpup · August-01-10, 06:37 PM

He only worked for the first term or two. After that he just quit on the job while the city, especially city government, just slid.

**Jimaz** · August-01-10, 07:46 PM

Originally Posted by lilpup

Huh, I've never heard it interpreted that way, but rather as a major catalyst in escalating the city v suburb tensions - he was telling the criminal element to hit the suburbs, particularly the northern suburbs.

From Wikipedia's Coleman Young article:

I issue a warning to all those pushers, to all rip-off artists, to all muggers: It’s time to leave Detroit; hit Eight Mile Road! And I don’t give a damn if they are black or white, or if they wear Superfly suits or blue uniforms with silver badges. Hit the road.

I interpret that to mean he simply wanted troublemakers of all kinds to leave the city. I suspect he used the "Eight Mile Road" term only because that is the most clearly defined city border. Would he really have cared to redirect troublemakers away from western suburbs? What benefit would there have been to him to spare them?

Sincerely.

lilpup · August-01-10, 07:53 PM

Originally Posted by Jimaz

From Wikipedia's Coleman Young article:I interpret that to mean he simply wanted troublemakers of all kinds to leave the city. I suspect he used the "Eight Mile Road" term only because that is the most clearly defined city border. Would he really have cared to redirect troublemakers away from western suburbs? What benefit would there have been to him to spare them?

Sincerely.

He might not have intended it that way but that's the way it was received. It would have been far, far better had he said something like he was going to catch the criminals and put them away instead of just chasing them out of the city.

**Jimaz** · August-01-10, 08:07 PM

Originally Posted by lilpup

He might not have intended it that way but that's the way it was received. It would have been far, far better had he said something like he was going to catch the criminals and put them away instead of just chasing them out of the city.

Okay. I understand. Yes, that would have been a better choice of words.

**showstoppa** · August-01-10, 08:41 PM

as a person born in 1977. I knew of Coleman Young in his later years. The thing I always gathered from studying history, and reading this forum is that he was a great mayor for his first 2 terms, and after that everything just went to hell !

**R8RBOB** · August-01-10, 09:38 PM

Originally Posted by showstoppa

as a person born in 1977. I knew of Coleman Young in his later years. The thing I always gathered from studying history, and reading this forum is that he was a great mayor for his first 2 terms, and after that everything just went to hell !

Agreed. Young stayed in office too long but what was available to him? If his two terms were considered a success he could have ran for governor in 82 but there was no way Michigan was going to elect a Black governor. The Senate was off-limits. No way he was going to knock off Riegle or Levin so the only recourse Mayor Young had was mayor which is why he stayed too long in the job.

**firstandten** · August-01-10, 09:43 PM

Originally Posted by R8RBOB

Agreed. Young stayed in office too long but what was available to him? If his two terms were considered a success he could have ran for governor in 82 but there was no way Michigan was going to elect a Black governor. The Senate was off-limits. No way he was going to knock off Riegle or Levin so the only recourse Mayor Young had was mayor which is why he stayed too long in the job.

Yes, and also he had stated various times that he had the job he wanted and had no desire politically for a job other than mayor

**Meddle** · August-01-10, 10:38 PM

Originally Posted by showstoppa

as a person born in 1977. I knew of Coleman Young in his later years. The thing I always gathered from studying history, and reading this forum is that he was a great mayor for his first 2 terms, and after that everything just went to hell !

History can be slanted by the writer.

Posts on this forum are the opinion of the poster.

Coleman was NEVER a great mayor. He was never even a good, or mediocre mayor. He was a bully and a thug.