The Detroit Riverfront

[Gistok]

Rivertown and Greektown were both defuncted for the same reason. That was my point. And to reiterate, Greektown is an absurd name for what exists on Monroe St. these days. Just as Midtown is a ridiculous name for the Cass Corridor. And yes, I responded to an old post rather than starting a new one on the same topic.

OK, I wasn't sure if you knew it was that old... I've seen people restart old forum arguments where not only were the original posts were so old, but the original posters were no longer on DYES to argue with.

But I do disagree with you on Midtown and Cass Corridor. Midtown is a much larger segment of central Detroit than Cass Corridor ever was. Cass Corridor was always just the section along Cass Avenue. Whereas Midtown includes sections of the city that were never part of the Cass Corridor... such as the Cultural Center, Medical Center, WSU, and Brush Park.

Cass Corridor had a bad reputation, drugs, crime and decay... so I'm glad that it was rebranded, and today the area is broken up into Midtown Cass Park [[Ilitchville) and Midtown North Cass, although those names are not often referred to.

[cleanmotorway]

Yeah I don't understand when people get offended at the Midtown label. It's not replacing Cass Corridor. It's a larger area that happens to also encompass CC. I don't think it's even fair to say it's a rebranding.

What else are we supposed to call the large area between Downtown and New Center? It's literally the middle of town, Midtown.

[Henry Whalley]

OK, you and Gistok make good points and I see why Midtown is apropos.

But it is written that the former Greektown forever shall be dubbed Trojantown or Tragictown. [[It's a seldom-noted fact that Agamemnon, rather than a cuckold, was a real estate developer, don, or taikun. And The Trojan Women would be no less tragic had the true story been told.)

[Gistok]

^ Ohhhhhhh-kay.... whatever name floats your boat... But I wouldn't count on either name to stick....

The city "relabeled" the Harmony Park area as the new Paradise Valley... but that name won't stick either.

[K-slice]

Greentown was too small and too centrally located to stay a true ethnic neighborhood. It's tough to maintain a small, ethnic trick neighborhood when corporate interests want to demolish them for skyscrapers.

[Gistok]

Greentown was too small and too centrally located to stay a true ethnic neighborhood. It's tough to maintain a small, ethnic trick neighborhood when corporate interests want to demolish them for skyscrapers.

Most of the older Greektown commercial buildings are Victorian, and are on the National Register of Historic Places. They're probably the last strip of 19th century buildings in Detroit, some going back to the 1850s. They're not going anywhere.

[cleanmotorway]

Merchants row on Woodward is actually lined with I think mostly 19th century buildings or very near 19th century.

I think Greektown needs more residential development again to feel more like an actual place and not just a gimmick tourist trap.

[Gistok]

Merchants row on Woodward is actually lined with I think mostly 19th century buildings or very near 19th century.

I think Greektown needs more residential development again to feel more like an actual place and not just a gimmick tourist trap.

Actually with the exception of the building housing the John Varvatos Store [[1895, originally Schwankovsky Temple of Music Building), all of the older buildings along Woodward [[with the exception of those between the Vinton and First National Buildings) are early 20th century.

I would like to see the old Police HQ, behind Greektown, turned into residential use. Also, would be nice if the Greektown buildings themselves had residential above the 1st floor... but that would mean only the north side of Monroe St. The South side old buildings are all part of Greektown Casino complex.

[cleanmotorway]

There's definitely a bit more than that. The Elliott building for example was built in 1894. I have not taken the time to look up every single building there though.

[Gistok]

There's definitely a bit more than that. The Elliott building for example was built in 1894. I have not taken the time to look up every single building there though.

Don't spend your time... we already know that there are a few surviving buildings along Woodward that date to the 19th century. None are going anywhere.

[cleanmotorway]

Just did some more quick searching. There's also the Frank & Seder Building built in 1881 and the The Pepper Building was built in 1898.

So there is a lot more than you originally thought.

[Henry Whalley]

Greentown was too small and too centrally located to stay a true ethnic neighborhood. It's tough to maintain a small, ethnic trick neighborhood when corporate interests want to demolish them for skyscrapers.

IMHO, it could and should have remained a true ethnic pocket. It was only a few blocks -- I wouldn't call it a neighborhood.

Archer's cluelessness might be forgiven because he wasn't a native Detroiter. But the other mayors were locals ranging from clowns at best to kleptocrats at worst.

As for myself, a walk through Trojantown leaves me in tears.

[Lowell]

Cass Corridor had a bad reputation, drugs, crime and decay... so I'm glad that it was rebranded....

Not to mention what has now come to light about Cass's slave-holding / pro slavery past. I still think Midtown is a boring choice however.

[Gistok]

Just did some more quick searching. There's also the Frank & Seder Building built in 1881 and the The Pepper Building was built in 1898.

So there is a lot more than you originally thought.

No I knew there were more... I've been a member of Preservation Detroit for 20+ years and do downtown tours... I was just too busy to look it up...

The greatest loss in recent years to the Woodward Ave. streetscape [[besides the loss of the Monroe block) was the B. Siegel cast iron building of 1884... which was destroyed by fire in 1990...

[cleanmotorway]

Oh yeah, that was a beauty. Big shame.

[Henry Whalley]

Another good point. Cass was a scoundrel. I think Cass Avenue should be renamed Henry Whalley Way [[yust yoking) but seriously there are very few street names in Detroit that have been vetted for ethics. Rosa Parks Blvd., Martin Luther King, [[Augustus B.) Woodward, are bona fide.

P.S. Cassius Marcellus Clay was a hero larger than life and, though from Kentucky, a street in every city should bear his name. The story of his life is inspired and inspiring:

https://archive.org/details/lifeofcassiusmar00inclay

[royce]

Well to stir up a very cold pot that's been sitting on the stove for awhile, let me ask a question about the residential development, Orleans Landing. How is it doing? I drive by it from time so time and see that a number of residential units are occupied. However, I was wondering what were they thinking when they added the ground floor retail? What kind of retail were they looking for because the space is so small? Also, there seems to be an over abundance of support beams in those spaces and low ceilings that very few businesses, in my opinion, could take advantage of that space. Any thoughts?

[night-timer]

Wipe out ugly Hart Plaza and put in the three casinos there, along the river, either side of the Renaissance Center. It would be walking distance to Greektown along Jefferson and nearby to Cobo Hall or whatever it's called these days. The riverfront has really come along, but it could be better. Even Canadians will be attracted and can come through the tunnel onto Jefferson Avenue.

[401don]

Wipe out ugly Hart Plaza and put in the three casinos there, along the river, either side of the Renaissance Center. It would be walking distance to Greektown along Jefferson and nearby to Cobo Hall or whatever it's called these days. The riverfront has really come along, but it could be better. Even Canadians will be attracted and can come through the tunnel onto Jefferson Avenue.

Lack of sleep?

[jmcf1949]

It’s mind numbing to me that a major city with a major waterway, doesn’t use this resource to generate much revenue. What a waste.

[stasu1213]

It’s mind numbing to me that a major city with a major waterway, doesn’t use this resource to generate much revenue. What a waste.

The idea of using the Detroit river is a means of revenue was touted a few years back when the Port authority building was built but Detroit's ass backward politics had gotten in the way

[rbdetsport]

The idea of using the Detroit river is a means of revenue was touted a few years back when the Port authority building was built but Detroit's ass backward politics had gotten in the way

Should have built that ‘Freedom’ Gondola! Hahah

[KnnNike]

Wipe out ugly Hart Plaza and put in the three casinos there, along the river, either side of the Renaissance Center. It would be walking distance to Greektown along Jefferson and nearby to Cobo Hall or whatever it's called these days. The riverfront has really come along, but it could be better. Even Canadians will be attracted and can come through the tunnel onto Jefferson Avenue.

They'll be fine driving an extra 3 minutes to one of the existing casinos. The last things we need are a) more gawdy, neon-lit faux architecture, b) a greater reliance on casino revenue in the city, and c) more automobile-dependent entertainment.

Casinos do not encourage activity within a city; they are designed to keep people inside them as long as possible. I'd rather see these all built in some far-flung area of town.

[bust]

Wipe out ugly Hart Plaza and put in the three casinos there...

Casinos? Huh, really? Who thinks this is the answer? They're part of the problem.

Whose money will they drain? You think Canadians'?? They have their own casinos-- without a wait at the border, no hassle from customs, no need for a passport.

What could they offer? Better chances at roulette? Pick a color and you still win if it's a prime number? Canada already offers recreational marijuana, full nudity, and a younger drinking age. Not at the same time, but easy to combine.

[bust]

Should have built that ‘Freedom’ Gondola! Hahah

Wudda been much less money better wasted than tax incentives and eminent domain abuse for casinos, and the "giant sucking sound"* of local venues dying, the vitality and tax revenues they destroyed.

Not saying a gondola was a good idea. Saying gambling was much worse.

We know who were the casino investors but we don't know for sure the officials whose new wallets and purses they lined. Maybe one or two ~safe to assume.

*Ross Perot. Yo EDS! Hella maybe!