Poor Little Rich, Arabic-American, Old Mogul

**One Shot** · May-02-10, 06:17 PM

Arrogance and entitlement is the attitude of a few arabs. Thats besides the point here. This is simply a pissing match now and he will try to buy the right people to get his bridge. Unfortunately money really can buy anything. I just hope this isn't one of the instances.

Retroit · May-02-10, 06:27 PM

How about if the government let Maroun build a new bridge as long as it is in the location that the DRIC was planning to build their bridge? Would this satisfy everyone?

**KOMPOST** · May-02-10, 06:39 PM

Originally Posted by Retroit

How about if the government let Maroun build a new bridge as long as it is in the location that the DRIC was planning to build their bridge? Would this satisfy everyone?

No. For too many reasons to list. One being the Bridge Co. fully anticipates taking full advantage of traffic being forced through their new duty free/gas station super complex. You know, the one they took over a city street to build when the contract with MDOT clearly stated they were to build ramps to keep trucks off surface roads instead?

**R8RBOB** · May-02-10, 08:19 PM

Originally Posted by Retroit

How about if the government let Maroun build a new bridge as long as it is in the location that the DRIC was planning to build their bridge? Would this satisfy everyone?

It would not work for Moroun because Manuel wants one-way bridges. [[hence the second span) Building in Delray would a lose for him because he would have to keep the bridges two-way because of the distance between them. Add in a new duty-free, gas station, infrastructure for the second bridge in Delray and you could see why Moroun is hopping mad.

Retroit · May-02-10, 09:00 PM

Originally Posted by R8RBOB

It would not work for Moroun because Manuel wants one-way bridges. [[hence the second span)

Are you sure about that? I could have sworn I read that the New Ambassador Bridge was going to be a complete replacement of the current one and that the current one would only be used by Bridge Company vehicles and for emergencies.

I believe the New bridge would be 6 lanes, 3 each way.

**R8RBOB** · May-02-10, 09:57 PM

Thanks for the correction. [[Cali living, I suppose) Now I can see why the Canadian gov't, the southwest communities and the state is against his bridge. Everyone is saying that we need another crossing making it three crossing between Canada and the US in the Detroit area. What Moroun is proposing to have a bridge and a spare. To force everyone onto his new bridge and have his old bridge as a backup.

DetroitDad · May-02-10, 10:12 PM

Originally Posted by R8RBOB

Thanks for the correction. [[Cali living, I suppose) Now I can see why the Canadian gov't, the southwest communities and the state is against his bridge. Everyone is saying that we need another crossing making it three crossing between Canada and the US in the Detroit area. What Moroun is proposing to have a bridge and a spare. To force everyone onto his new bridge and have his old bridge as a backup.

One also has to wonder if his idea is even feasible. It doesn't seem like a good idea to have a dual crossing from a security standpoint.

**detroitsgwenivere** · May-02-10, 11:17 PM

A few fun facts regarding Delray [[to emphasize Dad's post).

According to 2006 Census Tract Estimates:
Delray has one of the largest percentages of non high-school grads in the state. It also had the largest percentage of homes worth less than 20k in the state, before the market collapse. Over 60% of it's residents live below the poverty line.

In 1930, Delray had 23,000 residents. In 1999, after 2 massive freeway projects and the expansion of the water treatment plant, the number was down to 6,000. Now it's at about 2,700 residents in 3 sq miles.

According to citydata.com, 66.2% of the homes were built before 1940 [[and they aren't the historically designated kind). There is a high rate of homeownership, but it's generally by the elderly and people who were left the homes by deceased parents. Well over 50% of the residents are people of color.

http://www.city-data.com/neighborhoo...etroit-MI.html for lots more intricate demography.

State Rep Rashida Tlaib has been all over this DRIC thing from the start, and holds many town halls and coffee talks with residents from all over Southwest Detroit. She is well known for representing the interests of her constituency, especially the poor and low-income communities. If there is any real backlash from the Delray residents, I believe we are sure to hear about it soon enough.

**kraig** · May-03-10, 07:27 AM

Originally Posted by DetroitDad

The problem with Delray is it is heavily polluted already, and like the Uniroyal site, no one wants to foot the bill. This has basically meant the current land owners are stuck unable to sell, with polluted land. As I understand [[I am not connected with either side, I just have been paying attention on here and in the news) the new bridge would offer them some compensation for land owners who have been stuck with polluted land. I agree that attention and meetings should be held in Delray to make sure this plays out fairly on their behalf.

It is unfortunate what Delray has become, but the popular consensus has been leaning towards the fact that not all of Detroit can go back in time to what it was, and needs to be downsized. We have homes in Delray that have been basically turned into militia type fortifications to keep out crime, with people who have no way out. Before defending the nice people down river, I would suggest maybe going down there yourself, and hearing what those individuals have to say, as well as seeing the way things are for yourself, and then come back and offer solutions. I think it's noble that you are taking a stand for the neighborhoods of Delray and wish they could be saved, but you really might want to look into what you are defending.

Which pretty much puts Delray into the same category as Mexicantown and Corktown. Which would make one think that the same adding to the pollution argument that applies to the Ambassador Bridge should apply to the DRIC as well. There appears to be a double standard at work here.

**SWMAP** · May-03-10, 09:07 AM

Re: Matty being a "birther" now: he hides his Canadian ties.

MANUEL [[MATTY) MAROUN
Family History
Led by Maroun’s grandfather, the poor family relocated from Quebec City to River Canard next to the historic St. Joseph’s Roman Catholic Church. They later moved to Comber where they operated a grocery store.
They moved to Huron Church Rd., Windsor, across from Assumption Church but the father was forced to sell the home in 1924 to make room for the Ambassador Bridge that would span from Windsor to Detroit. The family chose to move to Detroit after the house was expropriated.
Matty was born later in 1927. While growing up he remained in close contact with his father’s brothers and sisters on Aylmer street, his grandfather’s brother Sarcus Maroun and uncle Joe Maroun. Matty’s mother side [[the Peter’s) owned a grocery store on Niagara street and Parent avenue.
Maroun is married to Nora, owns three homes in Gross Pointe, Florida, and Tobermory [[Ontario).

**fastcarsandfreedom** · May-03-10, 10:05 AM

I thought Maroun had deep ties on both sides of the river. I guess it's okay for him to be a hyphenated American with hidden Canadian ties, but not okay for others [[like the Governor).

**kraig** · May-03-10, 10:20 AM

Originally Posted by fastcarsandfreedom

I thought Maroun had deep ties on both sides of the river. I guess it's okay for him to be a hyphenated American with hidden Canadian ties, but not okay for others [[like the Governor).

We're going to need a roadmap to keep track of all of the double standards. LOL

**kraig** · May-03-10, 10:29 AM

Originally Posted by detroitsgwenivere

A few fun facts regarding Delray [[to emphasize Dad's post).

According to 2006 Census Tract Estimates:
Delray has one of the largest percentages of non high-school grads in the state. It also had the largest percentage of homes worth less than 20k in the state, before the market collapse. Over 60% of it's residents live below the poverty line.

In 1930, Delray had 23,000 residents. In 1999, after 2 massive freeway projects and the expansion of the water treatment plant, the number was down to 6,000. Now it's at about 2,700 residents in 3 sq miles.

According to citydata.com, 66.2% of the homes were built before 1940 [[and they aren't the historically designated kind). There is a high rate of homeownership, but it's generally by the elderly and people who were left the homes by deceased parents. Well over 50% of the residents are people of color.

http://www.city-data.com/neighborhoo...etroit-MI.html for lots more intricate demography.

State Rep Rashida Tlaib has been all over this DRIC thing from the start, and holds many town halls and coffee talks with residents from all over Southwest Detroit. She is well known for representing the interests of her constituency, especially the poor and low-income communities. If there is any real backlash from the Delray residents, I believe we are sure to hear about it soon enough.

Tlaib has gone as far as weeping in Lansing over the DRIC receiving funding [[ask around, I'm not making this up). Any chance that she would be impartial about the DRIC is long gone.

By the time the residents of Delray realize that they're being taken advantage of, which will come in the form of extremely low offers, it will be too late.

I would urge that everyone look back at Graimark, the Poletown Plant and Paradise Valley/BlackBottom, just to name a few, to realize that condemnation in Detroit truly gives the residents the short end of the stick.

Bearinabox · May-03-10, 10:41 AM

Originally Posted by kraig

Which pretty much puts Delray into the same category as Mexicantown and Corktown. Which would make one think that the same adding to the pollution argument that applies to the Ambassador Bridge should apply to the DRIC as well. There appears to be a double standard at work here.

Are you suggesting that the air quality in Delray could conceivably get worse? With all the other noxious crap floating around in the air down there, you could run every truck in the world through there twice a day and I doubt anybody would notice.

**kraig** · May-03-10, 10:57 AM

Originally Posted by Bearinabox

Are you suggesting that the air quality in Delray could conceivably get worse? With all the other noxious crap floating around in the air down there, you could run every truck in the world through there twice a day and I doubt anybody would notice.

Are you suggesting that the air quality can't get worse?

One of the opinions by those opposing the expansion of the Ambassador Bridge has been that the additional traffic will bring extra pollution. By your own posting, you're stating that the air quality in Delray is bad. Which makes adding to that with the additional traffic just as bad for Delray as it is for Mexicantown/Corktown. If it's not wanted for one part of town. Why should it be acceptable for another? Again, double standards.

Bearinabox · May-03-10, 11:12 AM

Originally Posted by kraig

Are you suggesting that the air quality can't get worse?

One of the opinions by those opposing the expansion of the Ambassador Bridge has been that the additional traffic will bring extra pollution. By your own posting, you're stating that the air quality in Delray is bad. Which makes adding to that with the additional traffic just as bad for Delray as it is for Mexicantown/Corktown. If it's not wanted for one part of town. Why should it be acceptable for another? Again, double standards.

I'm saying that air quality in Delray has been so bad for so long that it's already driven most everybody out, whereas Mexicantown is a relatively viable area that could empty out if the air got significantly worse. Delray has been the dumping ground for noxious industry in Detroit for generations; blocking this one project for air quality reasons makes no sense unless we're actually going to clean up the neighborhood, and realistically, we just aren't.

**Gannon** · May-03-10, 11:14 AM

I had forgotten about the part of his family being uprooted BY the bridge...why doesn't he put that together with this current action from the Canadian government and show cause that they are ganging up on the family generationally?! That might prove out the allegations of institutional racism.

Oh, where is my accuser?! 3WC...I'm still waiting for you to define and explain your lame-ass name-calling. All I hear are crickets and birds chirping...

Cheers!

**Gannon** · May-03-10, 11:22 AM

[[just tryin' to help you out, Manny, don't forget me!)

**kraig** · May-03-10, 11:46 AM

Originally Posted by Bearinabox

I'm saying that air quality in Delray has been so bad for so long that it's already driven most everybody out, whereas Mexicantown is a relatively viable area that could empty out if the air got significantly worse. Delray has been the dumping ground for noxious industry in Detroit for generations; blocking this one project for air quality reasons makes no sense unless we're actually going to clean up the neighborhood, and realistically, we just aren't.

Let me get this straight. The air quality in Delray is so bad that it's driving people out. And the plan is to revitalize the area through a project that will make the air quality worse?

Oooookay. Welcome to Bizarro world.

Bearinabox · May-03-10, 11:48 AM

Originally Posted by kraig

Let me get this straight. The air quality in Delray is so bad that it's driving people out. And the plan is to revitalize the area through a project that will make the air quality worse?

Oooookay. Welcome to Bizarro world.

Who's trying to revitalize the area?

**kraig** · May-03-10, 12:02 PM

Originally Posted by Bearinabox

Who's trying to revitalize the area?

Uuuuuhhh. Read this.

http://www.partnershipborderstudy.co...MtgNotesNA.pdf

Bearinabox · May-03-10, 12:40 PM

Originally Posted by kraig

Uuuuuhhh. Read this.

http://www.partnershipborderstudy.co...MtgNotesNA.pdf

The city has been trying to industrialize Delray for the last 50-some years. I think it's a little late to be talking about "revitalizing" it as a residential neighborhood. The damage is basically done. If they want to push some community development to help out people in the path of the DRIC bridge, that's nice, but I doubt it'll do much to increase the long-term viability of the neighborhood.

**Detroitnerd** · May-03-10, 12:48 PM

All through the 1980s and 1990s and 2000s, people who lived in Delray had complained that the city seemed determined to run people out of there so that industry could expand. Complaints over the years involved everything from shoddy policing to poor garbage pickup to discontinued bus lines. If there was a city effort to turn Delray from residential to industrial, we must concede that the city has won. Even the neighborhood's hardest-bitten activists have moved on. The Marathon expansion begun a few years ago probably was the nail in the coffin for that neighborhood.

I feel for the people of Delray who've never gotten a fair shake from the city as long as I can remember. The only holdouts in Delray seem to be motorcycle clubs and the very poor. I don't even see storefront churches down there anymore.

That said, notice how nobody ever cared about Delray's residents until their complaints of environmental racism happened to neatly dovetail with a transportation company owner who opposes public competition? Mighty neat coincidence.

**kraig** · May-03-10, 01:15 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

All through the 1980s and 1990s and 2000s, people who lived in Delray had complained that the city seemed determined to run people out of there so that industry could expand. Complaints over the years involved everything from shoddy policing to poor garbage pickup to discontinued bus lines. If there was a city effort to turn Delray from residential to industrial, we must concede that the city has won. Even the neighborhood's hardest-bitten activists have moved on. The Marathon expansion begun a few years ago probably was the nail in the coffin for that neighborhood.

I feel for the people of Delray who've never gotten a fair shake from the city as long as I can remember. The only holdouts in Delray seem to be motorcycle clubs and the very poor. I don't even see storefront churches down there anymore.

That said, notice how nobody ever cared about Delray's residents until their complaints of environmental racism happened to neatly dovetail with a transportation company owner who opposes public competition? Mighty neat coincidence.

Correction, nobody else.

http://detroityes.com/mb/showthread.php?t=1069

I post out of the affection I have for Detroit. Not the animosity for MM. The fact that this thread exists shows that there are a lot of people that can't say the same.

**Detroitnerd** · May-03-10, 01:28 PM

Originally Posted by kraig

Correction, nobody else.

http://detroityes.com/mb/showthread.php?t=1069

I post out of the affection I have for Detroit. Not the animosity for MM. The fact that this thread exists shows that there are a lot of people that can't say the same.

OK, well, to qualify, no big, well-funded, high-profile public figure, not nobody else at all. You evidently wish to save Delray. And I just don't have any comforting words for you. I'll bet you could get a house on Medina Street pretty cheaply, if you like living next to heavy industry, but most people of means will not live there.

You seem sincere enough, Kraig, but what about objecting to eminent domain? Do you object to MM squatting illegally on city land?

You don't want to see neighborhoods destroyed by industry. But what about MM flouting plans to take trucks off the streets of Mexicantown?

Can I be forgiven for seeing a lack of consistency on some issues?