Will Sam Riddle walk?

[Thames]

I think that this woman simply decided that Sam Riddle was not being judged by his peers and simply could not in good conscience find Riddle guilty, despite the evidence. For her to literally separate herself from the rest of the jurors during deliberations, shows that she was not going to vote their way. It is unfortunate that signs of her rebellious nature was not evident before the jury went into deliberations. One of the alternates could have replaced her. Good thing a hung jury usually means that there will be another trial.

Why do you think that?

[R8RBOB]

I'm not racist, I'm not an idealist either, I'm a realist.

Juror's are human beings with flaws.

If the Fed's wanted the facts to guide the case as far as possible, untainted by racism, then the best chance to obtain a conviction had a simple formula:.

1. Try and get as many blacks on the jury as possible
2. Have an all-black prosecution team.

Thats simply realism, not racism, not idealism.

C'mon Johnny and admit it. You have a Black problem. You want to blame Black for the reasons why bad things happen.

While you you coming up with your Black conspiracy ideas, it must have slipped your mind that some of those bad Black guys from Detroit that are locked in prisons such as Jackson were sent there by jurors with Blacks.

[daddeeo]

Looks like Sam just can't stay on the right side of the road. He gets spotted with Mary Waters in Birmingham and you know he'll be in deep do do for that.
For being such a smart guy, he sure does stupid things.
What a dummy.

[tmarste]

I am Black. And I would have listened objectively, observed the details of the case and made my decision accordingly. Please do not make generalizations about all Black people. This woman's behavior is not a reflection of all Black people. Not all Black people think and do the same things. Just like all other races, there are good and bad. If I was the lone Black juror, Riddle would be on his way to sentencing.

[gnome]

Since I don't know anyone who was on the jury, and can only comment on the press accounts; I don't think the feds ever answered my question on how someone who is not a public servant can be convicted of public bribery.

Now, Sam may be slimmy, he may have duped the entire universe into thinking he could deliver votes, but he has never held public office. Doesn't have a vote, never did.

Based on the evidence in the papers, I would have deadlocked the jury.

[bartock]

Since I don't know anyone who was on the jury, and can only comment on the press accounts; I don't think the feds ever answered my question on how someone who is not a public servant can be convicted of public bribery.

Now, Sam may be slimmy, he may have duped the entire universe into thinking he could deliver votes, but he has never held public office. Doesn't have a vote, never did.

Based on the evidence in the papers, I would have deadlocked the jury.

I think this is Fieger's theory also. Let's see if he represents Sam in the re-try.

Not to simplify things, but I doubt the hung juror was thinking like this, based on reports. I think it is entirely possible that she was misinformed, racially biased, and a bitch. There are misinformed, racially biased bitches [[and assholes, fellas) in the World, and this one slipped through voir dire to get onto a jury. It happens sometimes, but more often than not those who are lying and "anxious" to get on a jury stick out and are dismissed. Again, she slipped through. Last time I checked, the feds were running 95% conviction rates, including the Eastern District of Michigan, which is 21% black. They are not worried about re-trying him.

I am as far from an apologist as you'll find. I just don't think the issue runs as deep as it's been portrayed. I understand WHY it's happening, I just don't agree with it. Sorry about the language.

[jefferson78]

What everyone needs to start doing is put on those glasses where everyone is the same color. Let's judge people by their character and take color out of the equation.
The after effects of what this person did is most likely the opposite of what she intended. In my opinion, she just set race relations back another 25 years. By looking only at the fact that Riddle was black and imposing her personal [[racist?) views on the rest of the jury was racism at the highest level. It was a slap in the face to the legal system and to the rest of the jurors, prosecutors, etc. that took their jobs seriously.
I've served on juries twice and I can say from personal experience that the deliberating part of jury duty is the most difficult and can get highly emotional. If you have one or more jurors that choose to be obstinate or just won't listen to reason, it can make for a highly charged atmosphere and eventually ruins it for all involved.
If I were a black person, I would be highly pissed at what this person did. It's a slap in the face to all that is right. This is not how you make a point, if you have one to make. I'm not sure what her point was. Regardless of where she is from, what she did was wrong and now, as a result of her actions, race relations have taken a huge step backward, plus a cash-strapped area has to incur more unnecessary costs, and as much as we'd like to put this sad chapter behind us, it will linger and fester for some time. This man was undoubtebly guilty and needed to pay for the crimes he commited. No one should be happy at this outcome. He will pay, but now, thanks to this woman, it will only delay the inevitable.
Shame on her and I hope that one day she realizes what damage she has done. Rosa Parks she is not.

[R8RBOB]

What everyone needs to start doing is put on those glasses where everyone is the same color. Let's judge people by their character and take color out of the equation.
The after effects of what this person did is most likely the opposite of what she intended. In my opinion, she just set race relations back another 25 years. By looking only at the fact that Riddle was black and imposing her personal [[racist?) views on the rest of the jury was racism at the highest level. It was a slap in the face to the legal system and to the rest of the jurors, prosecutors, etc. that took their jobs seriously.
I've served on juries twice and I can say from personal experience that the deliberating part of jury duty is the most difficult and can get highly emotional. If you have one or more jurors that choose to be obstinate or just won't listen to reason, it can make for a highly charged atmosphere and eventually ruins it for all involved.
If I were a black person, I would be highly pissed at what this person did. It's a slap in the face to all that is right. This is not how you make a point, if you have one to make. I'm not sure what her point was. Regardless of where she is from, what she did was wrong and now, as a result of her actions, race relations have taken a huge step backward, plus a cash-strapped area has to incur more unnecessary costs, and as much as we'd like to put this sad chapter behind us, it will linger and fester for some time. This man was undoubtebly guilty and needed to pay for the crimes he commited. No one should be happy at this outcome. He will pay, but now, thanks to this woman, it will only delay the inevitable.
Shame on her and I hope that one day she realizes what damage she has done. Rosa Parks she is not.

Set back race relations 25 years!!! Aren't you laying the hyperbole a bit thick there? To state that race relations would take a serious hit because one Black juror decided to display her ignorance is over the top. I could understand your line of thought if 12 jurors acquitted Riddle but it was only a mistrial. He will be tried again and maybe the outcome will be different.

[sumas]

Juries are funny things. Keep getting called to jury duty and kicked up my heels,was bored for a day and sometimes two. Finally lied, no never been a victim etc, etc and got on a jury. I was the hold out. Two black men, the so called victim had a witness, an older black man who called the "victim" by a pet name. I did not believe that the witness was credible.

All that said, I believe Riddle is guilty. He is lucky I wasn't on that jury

I live in Detroit, we don't want evil to prey in our neighborhoods. Black or white we can try cases based on facts

[jefferson78]

OK, maybe 25 years is a stretch. But when I read the message boards and listen to the callers on the radio, regarding this event, I can't help but be surprised at the amount of anger and vitriol this woman has set forth. It was, to say the least alarming. I know that this man will pay for his misdeeds, but did we have to be shown that racism is alive and well? Can't we get past that and start the healing? What she did was put fuel on the fire, it was not necessary.
I don't need to be reminded of what has happened in the past, I prefer to look to the future and have some confidence that everyone can somehow be colorblind and work on fixing everything else that is broken. I'm sorry if you feel that I am exaggerating.

[Hermod]

Will Riddle walk? YES due to RACE CARDS! That proves that rich folks and politicians can't go jail but poor and middle income families do.

That is American justice system GUILTY UNTIL PROVEN INNOCENT! for the White collar crimes.

INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY for the petty crimes.

Do you have these turned around??


The following is not germane to this case, but is in generic response to Danny:

One of the problems with dealing with white collar crimes in court is that the charge often ends up being "conspiracy" or "interfering with an investigation" or "lying to investigators". These are often terms that individual jurors may have trouble wrapping their minds around, especially when the lawyers for the defense finish muddying the waters during testimony and arguments.

Since we don't have literacy qualifications for jurors, many who are seated may well be functionally illiterate and incapable of grasping white collar crime concepts unlike common crime where assault, robbery, burglary, rape, and murder are understood by most sentient persons.

Some years back, in Virginia, jurors were called for a sixty day period. You generally had to come in about a third of the days for the period and if not paneled to sit, could go home. The lawyers must talk with each other, because by the end of the period, the only ones paneled were either functionally illiterate or, in one case, telling the judge she was in recovery from a nervous breakdown [[the lawyers loved her, she got paneled in virtually every case).

[sumas]

Jeff, sweet thought, trying hard in my own right to eliminate those concepts. I live in a city that is mostly black. An all black jury would have hung him from a tree. Sick of the race card myself.

Startling, I know but Detroit wants it's city back. Do not want frauds, charlatans and criminals with violent background here. We believe in the rebirth. You might be surprised at our image of what Detroit should look like in the near future!

[gnome]

All we know is what was in the press, according to those reports the holdout juror walked into the deliberation with her mind made up, with a chip on her shoulder. Let's say that was true, that she was mad as a wet cat from the get-go. Where did that anger come from?

Maybe she came in there with the whole Shrine, Malik Shabazz mindest. That she lied during voir dire about having her mind made up. We may never know.

But maybe she spent the last few weeks hearing smack from her fellow jurors. About their drives into the city, about how crappy Detroit looks, how many buildings are falling down, how Coleman had ruined the city, etc. Maybe all the smack talk happened during lunch, during smoke breaks, during those times when the jurors were left to their own devices.

Maybe she heard from the other jurors how they used to live in Detroit and how they were chased out by crime and how their old neighborhoods became ghettos. How nice it was in the olden days before '67. On and on for weeks at a time.

Then comes deliberations and the holdout is facing all those people who have running down the City and by inference all black folk. How would you react if you'd be faced with a phlanx of "others"?

[pffft]

But gnome --
This is a woman who lives in Auburn Hills, remember...

[Kevgoblue]

Since I don't know anyone who was on the jury, and can only comment on the press accounts; I don't think the feds ever answered my question on how someone who is not a public servant can be convicted of public bribery.

Now, Sam may be slimmy, he may have duped the entire universe into thinking he could deliver votes, but he has never held public office. Doesn't have a vote, never did.

Based on the evidence in the papers, I would have deadlocked the jury.

Agreed.
And to add insult to injury I heard Sam was facing a minimum of 8 yrs, based on the charges. Seems incredibly injust when you take that into account that Rosenthall got 9 months for his role in the bribery case.

If justice appeared to be being dished out equally, I'd say let Sam hang. But based on what I've heard I can understand why that juror might have held out. It does appear that Sam is being held disproportionately responsible.

Everyone is saying the juror was acting just based on race, but I've not heard anyone address the disparity of the treatment of the two defendants. And they happen to be of different races.

[lafayette]

Pffft, I understand the point you're trying to make to gnome by saying she lives in Auburn Hills. But I think what gnome was saying is Angela Woods could have been pissed off hearing those possible comments from the white jurors because they imply black people created those problems, not Detroit residents, per se. When they talk trash about Detroit, they're dissing black people by implication, but saying it was caused by "Detroiters." Safer code, in their minds, for those awful black people who did that to what used to be a wonderful city.

[firstandten]

Agreed.
And to add insult to injury I heard Sam was facing a minimum of 8 yrs, based on the charges. Seems incredibly injust when you take that into account that Rosenthall got 9 months for his role in the bribery case.

If justice appeared to be being dished out equally, I'd say let Sam hang. But based on what I've heard I can understand why that juror might have held out. It does appear that Sam is being held disproportionately responsible.

Everyone is saying the juror was acting just based on race, but I've not heard anyone address the disparity of the treatment of the two defendants. And they happen to be of different races.

Kevgoblue the things you say are correct, Sam was probably being held disproportionately responsible, but that was because he refused to roll over and the others did. Its not the lady's responsiblity to make that call however. Her charge was to judge the case based on the facts. She didn't do that. She did not do her duty. It seemed like she just shut down, didn't even give any factual reasons why she hung the jury. If she had done that , I would have been ok with it.

The solution in my opinion would have been to have more blacks on the jury, she may have been more open to reason and she wouldn't need to play the "them vs me" game, as a matter of fact that game would not have worked.

That to me was the problem in the case, there were not enough black jurors so the one that you did get had the mistaken notion that it was her responsibility to make sure Sam wasn't getting railroaded.

[lafayette]

Does it matter whether it's federal court or not regarding who in Wayne County is called for jury duty, or is it the same list as for non-federal cases? I would think that because the case was tried in U.S. District Court Eastern District, which covers the entire right half of the state of Michigan, that the right half of the state of Michigan is where the jury pool is drawn from? I know one juror was from Chesterfield Twp., one from Ann Arbor, one from Lake Orion and one from Auburn Hills. That's only metro Detroit and little beyond. Do we know if the fact that only 22 percent of the eastern half of the state of Michigan is black that that's why they only ended up with one black juror [[and that wouldn't really explain such a low number for black jurors, either)?

[Buy American]

Quote: ""I don't play the race card, but what I saw on the steps of the federal building was a white riot," Riddle said of the jurors who went public after the mistrial."

Oh Sam, you do play the race card.

http://fwix.com/grandrapids/share/95...rial_on_monday

[Ravine]

Well, it seems as though Sam's fall from grace-- which, short fall that it is, should have little appreciable concussive effect on the concrete and will probably not cause even so much as a serious bruise-- has entered a new phase, as the former so-called "political consultant" [[see: "bag man") has embraced a new persona, that of "on-line panhandler."

http://www.freep.com/article/2010022...-Web-for-funds

[daddeeo]

It will be interesting to see how many dopes contribute
to his legal fund. His court appointed lawyers did a pretty good job.
He'll need another hope and prayer to get off next time.

[stasu1213]

Sam Riddle has to pay for his own danm legal funds. He had better pawn some of that cheap jewelry he was given from Zeidmans. I am tired of these former leaders and consultants panhandeling for money from the poor residents. Sam's not so big anymore. Is he going to pay for my legal fees if ever I need a lawyer?

[erikd]

Since I don't know anyone who was on the jury, and can only comment on the press accounts; I don't think the feds ever answered my question on how someone who is not a public servant can be convicted of public bribery.

Now, Sam may be slimmy, he may have duped the entire universe into thinking he could deliver votes, but he has never held public office. Doesn't have a vote, never did.

Based on the evidence in the papers, I would have deadlocked the jury.

Gnome,

You must be joking.

If a public official partners with a bagman in a bribery scheme, they are both guilty of public bribery. Soliciting the bribes and accepting payment for the bribes makes the bagman just as guilty as the public official.

It is no different than a middle-man gun runner setting up a deal to sell AK47s from the Russian Mafia to a street gang in LA. The middle-man never even saw a gun, but he set up the deal, and took payment for it. That makes him guilty of smuggling illegal guns.

[Mkap]

It appears there is racial profiling from all sides. It's human nature to stick with your own. Why do you think we have Mexican, China, Little Italy, Cork... towns? We are comfortable with our own culture. But the demography does change. It eventually becomes the melting pot this nation truly is. At times it just takes waaaay too long.

People need to get past it and get to the heart of the matter. Guilty or not, that is the question. We all know right from wrong in our own minds. When we quit lying to ourselves, we will all be better off. Righteousness is, only as it applies to us. Moral conviction comes from within. Nowhere else.

"If", Ms. Woods justified her behavior through race, so be it. She has to live with her own convictions, and the heat that goes with it. The truth is, in most cases, the guilty are convicted.

[pontiac4ever]

I grew up with her in Pontiac, she later moved to Auburn Hills with her husband. She lives down the street from my mother. She and her husband are hard working people raising a family. She isn't getting paid from Sam. Knowing Angie i doubt she even paid attention to this case, or even knew who Riddle was, until she was called to be on the jury. Stop with the wild accusations because it's all bullshit. She's not an angry black woman who's trying to get even with "The Man". She doesn't have a chip on her shoulder from perceived slights of the past. She and her husband worked hard to move from Pontiac to a middle class, racially mixed neighborhood in Auburn Hills. Even if she did come in there with her mind made up that he was being not guilty. There were other jurors who came in there with their minds made up that he was guilty before they deliberated. So either way you look at it the mistrial was correct.