Arts, Beats & Eats is moving to Royal Oak

[DetroitScooter]

I'll avoid the rant, but we are considering NOT going to AE&B because of this, mostly to send a message that potential constitutional topics like this need to be addressed in the courts and not on a city's legal tab. As I understand, the city council folded because they didn't want to jeopardize the entire event being called off due to a legal threat.

The hubbub reminds me of the recent "pot warehouse" unanimous decision, made no doubt to "protect" the neighborhoods and children from the evils of Mary Jane". I'll tell you what, there is more pot in and around Royal Oak than there probably has ever been, and it's all unregulated, untaxed trade, easily accessible to people of any age. Thank God that the evil weed isn't available to those who medically require it via a complex and regulated professional supply system.

[jackie5275]

Personally I think this is a lot about nothing....I would imagine that you may not even see anyone carrying. What about all the youths that are carrying illegal under their shirts? I am guessing nothing will happen. Every day you encounter someone who is carrying, and are not aware of it.
Go have some fun, and ignore the all the "chicken littles" who claim that it will be like the Ok Coral.

I wonder what will be said if something does happen.

[DC48080]

Personally I think this is a lot about nothing....I would imagine that you may not even see anyone carrying. What about all the youths that are carrying illegal under their shirts? I am guessing nothing will happen. Every day you encounter someone who is carrying, and are not aware of it.
Go have some fun, and ignore the all the "chicken littles" who claim that it will be like the Ok Coral.

You are absolutely correct. I am much more concerned about the thug who is carrying a firearm illegally under his shirt than I am about a trained law-abiding citizen who is carrying.

Just who do these people think is the bigger threat here? People say that there shouldn't be guns at a "family event". That may be true, but the criminals don't follow the same logic with their illegal weapons.

Remember, they don't just hand out CCW permits for the asking. You have to take classes and learn when you can and cannot use a weapon in order to get a permit.

[JJD]

Remember, they don't just hand out CCW permits for the asking. You have to take classes and learn when you can and cannot use a weapon in order to get a permit.

I know alot of people who have taken the CCW class and gotten permits. Anyone ever meet someone who failed that class? To assume that getting the permit makes you a responsible, intelligent, and emotionally as well as mentally stable person is a joke.

Crazy people are dangerous. Crazy people with guns are very dangerous.

I will not be attending AB&E because of the debate, not its end result. I fear that an irrational person from whichever side lost [[in this case the gun control side) will try to incite gun violence to prove their point. I would feel the same if the other side won the argument.

[Danny]

Arts, Beats and Eats, more like Arts, Beats, Eats and FIREARMS!

The Royal Oak City Council had approved the ordinance to have people carry licensed firearms at the festival. That will put fear into to most families, kids, friends and individuals. Therefore I'M NOT GOING!


WORD FROM THE STREET PROPHET!

Becuase guns don't kill people, people do.

Neda, I miss you so.

[Danny]

By the way, The Royal Oak City Council had to make to risky decision that would effect their political and financial careers. Vote yes to have people carry licensed firearms at the Arts, Beats and Eats or Vote no to have the NRA with their super LAWyers to take them to highest supreme court in the United States. Plus it's going to cost the Royal Oak taxpayers lots and lots of money.

[Johnlodge]

I know alot of people who have taken the CCW class and gotten permits. Anyone ever meet someone who failed that class? To assume that getting the permit makes you a responsible, intelligent, and emotionally as well as mentally stable person is a joke.

I love that "but you have to take a class!" argument.

You couldn't learn to make a Web site in an 8 hour class, but somehow it transforms you into a responsible and competent person in control of their emotions and to be trusted with a firearm.

[guito13]

I love that "but you have to take a class!" argument.

You couldn't learn to make a Web site in an 8 hour class, but somehow it transforms you into a responsible and competent person in control of their emotions and to be trusted with a firearm.

There is also the background check component. Once you take your "class" you have to go to the county, turn in passport quality photos of yourself, get yourself fingerprinted, then wait 3-4 months or so while they do a background check on you. Then you get your CPL.

I would rather be in a situation where there were armed good people than where there are not.

[oldredfordette]

It's times like this that I begin to seriously investigate retiring to another country. Americans are so stupid, so frightened of their shadow, that they have to carry guns to a friggin arts festival. Lord have mercy. There is no fixing that kind of stupid.

[Johnlodge]

There is also the background check component. Once you take your "class" you have to go to the county, turn in passport quality photos of yourself, get yourself fingerprinted, then wait 3-4 months or so while they do a background check on you. Then you get your CPL.

I would rather be in a situation where there were armed good people than where there are not.

Right – let me put an addendum to my statement. If you are a responsible, law-abiding gun owner, you were probably a responsible, law-abiding citizen beforehand. I am just laughing at the people who reference the "training" as though they had to go through the police academy to get a CCW.

[Detroitnerd]

So, let me get this straight.

Quite a few of the people who attend ABE are the same ones who decry Detroit as like the "Wild West."

The festival used to be in Pontiac, which also has a similarly rough reputation.

But once they move it to Royal Joke, everybody's gotta ammo up?

I don't get it.

[guito13]

Right – let me put an addendum to my statement. If you are a responsible, law-abiding gun owner, you were probably a responsible, law-abiding citizen beforehand. I am just laughing at the people who reference the "training" as though they had to go through the police academy to get a CCW.

Fair enough. The class was a bit of a joke for people who already shoot/handle guns but I did learn a lot about the laws and it was worth it to me. I have been around guns since i was a kid. I was always taught to respect them and always have. I teach my kids the same thing now. I dont have my CPL [[yet) but when I do I will carry in certain situations but I hope that I never have to use my pistol to defend myself/family/others. I would say that 99.99999% of registered CPL holders feel the same way. The same cannot be said for the illegal carriers of weapos.

[Bobl]

Much ado about nothing. A bunch of yahoos, pushing their agenda.
We'll be enjoying the better music, vibe, and Detroit River view at the Jazz Festival.

[daddeeo]

It's going to be Arts, Eats and Freaks this year in Royal Oak.
With the gun controversy, this is one disaster waiting to happen.
Fitting how the zoo will only be a half mile from the action on Washington St.
Ever since Patti Smith left town, the place has sold out to bars and restaurants.
The lofts and condo developers have wrecked any sense of what the town was.

[Danny]

According to the source from WDIV channel 4 text poll on the FIREARMS at the Arts, Beats and Eats:

63% of the people said that they will NOT attend the event.

37% of the people will go the event.

Looks the majority has spoken I will NOT go the Arts, Beats and Eats for my safety concerns.

WORD FROM THE STREET PROPHET

The Streets Royal JOKE is packing heat just like the BLOODS and the CRIPS from Compton to South Central Los Angeles.


Neda, I miss you so.

[JJD]

I know of a guy [[friend of friend) who was hospitalized for a mental disorder in the past, yet had no issue getting a CCW/CPL. I reiterate that the class / background check in no way insure that 99.99999% of licensed carrier are responsible or intelligent. I believe many are, but they are not the ones I am concerned with.

[jt1]

You are absolutely correct. I am much more concerned about the thug who is carrying a firearm illegally under his shirt than I am about a trained law-abiding citizen who is carrying.

Just who do these people think is the bigger threat here? People say that there shouldn't be guns at a "family event". That may be true, but the criminals don't follow the same logic with their illegal weapons.

Remember, they don't just hand out CCW permits for the asking. You have to take classes and learn when you can and cannot use a weapon in order to get a permit.

So why is it so important to some that they be allowed to carry weapons that are not concealed. I'm not a fan of guns but if people want to carry a CCW that is fine. Why the need to insist on being able to have your gun exposed for all to see.

Personally, I hope any idiot that feels the need to carry an exposed weapon is stopped by the cops and required to show their permits.

Gun zealots are going overboard on the need to let everyone know that they are cowards with little penises as opposed to just keeping their legal weapon concealed.

[DetroitPole]

I never understand how some people even consider Detroit to be anything other than a large collection of suburban-style neighborhoods. Front yard, back yard and house in-between. That is not an urban environment. Detroit does have a small handful of areas that have the same urban style housing density that Chicago or New York has ... places like the southern end of Palmer Park, a block or two on the Indian Village fringe, near Wayne State and downtown ... maybe a one or two others ... but look at Rosedale Park, the Airport Sub, Berry sub, Indian Village, Green Acres, Sherwood Forrest ... all single family homes with a couple of duplexes here and there. Just like Grosse Pointe Park, Birmingham, RO and Trenton.

To claim that Detroit has the kind of vast swaths of housing stock that typifies places like Chicago's Wicker Park, Rodgers Park, Boys Town, Lincoln Park ... strains credulity. I love Detroit but I ain't buying anyone's claim that the majority of its housing is urban.

That is why it is a head scratcher when dipshits spew their urban palming 101 textbook hooey that a place like RO isn't a "city" because it has lawns. Get real. One of detroit's previous claims to fame was that it had more single family houses than anywhere in America. It served as proof that the Union movement and Union wages built a solid middle class. Where a sheet metal stamper could own his own home. Raise his kids, grow some tomatoes and live in peace.

That's Detroit. That is what it promised and you see that promise in the tattered remains of those once proud neighborhoods. Neighborhoods, not superblocks like on Roosevelt Island in NYC.

Moreover to piss on RO is to piss on the dream of owning your own place and having a place to raise your kids and your tomatoes. RO or Ferndale or Birmingham didn't spring to reality in the fall of 1967. Those places where almost entirely built out by 1960, Ferndale [[ originally called UrbanRest) by 1940. And they were built using the exact same plan that Detroit used: front yard, back yard and a house in-between.

I ain't no RO fan, but for a vibrant vibe ... I'll stack RO against Greek 1/2 block any day of the week.

The reality is that ABE exists because not everyone in the world is jazz fan and not everyone loves the drama that comes with going to Detroit. Detroit takes work to love. You have to blind yourself to all of its shittyness or you leave. The garrish paint jobs on party stores, the tagging, the bums, the trash, the store signage that SCREAMS AND SCREAMS AND SCREAMS. It is obnoxious.

Go to Birmingham and all of their benches, sign posts, newspaper boxes, parking meters ... everything is painted green. Nothing clashes, it is harmonious; store signage can't be too large, can't flash, ... the result is that it is easy to chill in that town. You want to park and shop? You can park for FREE for the first two hours in one of the parking decks, same for RO. That makes life easy. In Detroit you're at the mercy of parking meter sharks and $3.00 minimums in the decks.

jeeze

And I'm constantly amazed by people who try to base Detroit's urbanity on its housing stock.

Virtually every neighborhood in Detroit is connected to a retail/commercial corridor with businesses that open directly onto the sidewalk. This is not true for virtually all the suburbs.

It is easy to overlook this because there is next-to-nothing left of these neighborhood retail corridors in terms of occupancy. You get a pretty good picture of it in Southwest Detroit though. Sorry, nothing suburban about it.

However the retail that SE Michigan seems to prefer is the hideous sprawl that is Hall Road, or one of our dozens of unsupportable malls. Also certainly it is hard to maintain a business even with inches of bulletproof glass when you get held up on a fairly regular basis.

[BagAJellyDonuts]

That the legislature failed to see a loophole when they wrote and passed a CCW law has been found and exploited. Now if any elected representative decides to make a stand against their mistake, the NRA lobby will hound them.

IMO, this will "kill" the festival. The move to Royal Oak was a mistake to begin with. Now people will have a reason to tell themselves to stay away.

[maxx]

Yes, just what are all those red-blooded gun-toters planning to do with their firearms at the festival?
Shoot any bad guys while leaving everyone else unscathed? They've been watching too many Dirty Harry movies.

[daddeeo]

Amazing how offended these people are when their constitutional rights are abused but when someone else has their rights abused they are no where to be found.
Just a bunch of hypocritical blow hards who want to show off what big men they are.

[daddeeo]

Even Brooks Patterson has chimed in on this subject against the gun toters.
He's afraid his "baby" will take a hit with a boycott.
The gun lobby say he's talking nonsense and it wouldn't be the first time.
However, when Brooks [[who is as conservative as they come) thinks
something is a bad idea you have to pay attention.

[piczka]

Arts, Beats and Heats!

[R8RBOB]

I have never been to ABE and I doubt that I will ever attend. I have seen what happens when a little bit of drink, a little bit of swagger and a little bit of ego can do when it comes to a guy and his gun and the idea of yahoos walking around with guns on their hips concerns me.

[Det_ard]

I haven't been to ABE in years, but with all the namby-pamby types claiming they'll stay away this year, it should be a pretty good time. I'm going [[sans handgun, all I own is my childhood BB rifle).