The future of East English Village

[Servite76]

Grew up and lived in EEV on Kensington and E. Warren up until I got married and started having children. Beautiful neighborhood growing up there. Sad to say that all changed when one Sunday morning I awoke to a noise to find Mr. Crackhead who wanted my "fucking shit" standing in my kitchen. Don't tell me it was isolated and can happen anywhere. My family was sleeping 10 feet away and thank god Mr. Crackhead just took a purse off the table and jumped back out the window. This type of crime happened every day. My sister was mugged at our side door. We got the hell out and moved to Grosse Pointe Woods and I'm ready to get the hell out of here. Mr. Crackheads kids have now infested the neighborhood. Sorry if I sound so bitter, but your attitude changes when you become a victim.

[rid0617]

Just an update to advise someone posted earlier. We have been concentrating on BE to determine a possible move. Hearing more and more about EEV I took the tip of contacting the editor of the EEV newsletter. Very nice lady, very quick response and an interesting, informative newsletter.

[stonechipped]

IMO, East English Village is not safe, and should not be considered if one has other options.

Crime has been drifting over across Mack from EEV for the last couple of years, and this is a major concern in these portions of the Pointes. I can't imagine how it is on the other side of Mack, where there's basically no police force to respond to incidents.

EEV still has many very beautiful homes and nice-looking blocks, but it does not come close to meeting my minimal standards of safety and security. You may have different standards.

No police protection beware

[Eastside]

No police protection beware

This statement is totally wrong. EEV is well patrolled and police response is great. I've lived in this neighborhood for over 20-years so I'm speaking from first hand experience.

[cycledetroit]

Living in Detroit and dealing with crime come hand in hand if you ask me. Not just Detroit, but all major cities. One reason we started looking on the other side of Mack, in GPP is because every house we saw in EEV had been stripped in some sense. One house we were really interested in, was broken into 3 times over the week of us considering it. The water damage from pulling out the plumbing and replacing all the windows on the main floor was too much work for us. Also, after you pay for all the repairs to a house in EEV, you could have bought in GGP. Not one house in GPP we saw had any evidence of a break in. You can buy in GPP for under 100,000.. most houses in EEV that don't need work are all over 100,000. The taxes on the house in EEV we were looking at were going to be around 5000 a year!!! The house in GPP - 2000 a year!

[Diehard]

No police protection beware

Where did you hear this? I've always had quick and professional police response in EEV.

[7051]

Twoblocksaway,

I specifically said NEW construction [[usually in a newer city/township) and the first owner/occupant, on a non-foreclosure sale [[market value). Is the house you purchased new construction, never had an owner, not a forclosure sale[[full market value)? This type of sale value is considered "true cash value" and as such, 50% of this will generally be the new SEV.

Cycle,

How exactly did you determine that the EEV house would have a $5,000 tax bill? Was it the MLS listing? This is very inaccurate as it usually doesn't include the homestead rate if its a foreclosure and the bank has had the property awhile, it usually doesn't include the NEZ, and it may include old water bills and late fees. The most accurate way to determine future tax is to spend the $2.00 per search and go to the city's website and look at taxable value, SEV, etc.[[it shows 2 years, thus one can see if there is a downward trend as is the case now). This will also show you the current and past year's tax bill and any fees[[water, late fees, interest).

Then use the homestead, NEZ tax rate of 51 mills X the SEV as the SEV will be your new taxable value.This will be your tax bill in the upcoming year. Further reductions in future bills are possible by appealing your SEV based on comparable sales in the months of Oct 1-Dec 31 in the previous year before the assessment[[properties as close to Dec 31 should be used when appealing as this is "tax day" and the assessor has used a 2 year sales study which runs March to March of  the 2 years previousthe assessment year).Therefore, the assessors comps/sales data is behind by 6 months to 2 years and 6 months. 2010 assessment received next March, one should use sales values from comp properties that sold Oct1-Dec 31 2009 as the assessor is using sales data from March 2007 to March 2009 to justify his assessment.

http://www.michiganpropertytax.com/l....com/links.htm


I have found that in the Univ. Dist., the MLS listing is showing 6k-11k for prop taxes.Further research has show that homestead, NEZ and latefees/water bills, and actual SEV numbers from the city website have brought them down to 3,500 to 6,000. Several new buyer tax appeals that I have seen have brought these bills down to 2,500 to 5,000.

[DetJules]

Greetings all - if you don't recognize the name...it's because I haven't posted in years - was on again/off again in the very early days of this forum. Saw this entry on EEV, where I live - so talk about hitting home - I had to get back in the game!

I've been a resident for 12 years - bought when I was 28...so do the math - no wait, don't! No one can speak for an entire neighborhood, we can just hand out glimpses of what life is like in our particular corner. I for one, adore my corner - not perfect, but I don't believe perfect exists.

Is crime worse in this recession? yes, I feel it is....but that's because it affected me for the first time in 12 years last spring - garage break-in. But come to talking to some neighbors...I apparently missed the news that 7 years ago we went through a rash of garage thefts...we just didn't do a good job communicating. I probably would have taken the time to better secure that side door! It always feels worse when it affects us personally. But the positive...

Police - never seen better response or more direct presence in all my years here as I have in 2009. We had a BIG issue with the residents of a house nearby. 3 raids, they're gone now, thanks to DPD.

Neighborhood association - never been stronger. They have the neighborhood mapped out. Empty house? they know who owns it, who takes care of it, or doesn't take care of it. Head to one of our monthly meetings - the participation makes me proud to be a resident, proud to be fighting for the survival of a truly diverse community.

Never seen so many empty homes in the neighborhood, but when I discuss this with friends at work [[all my coworkers live in the suburbs) instead of 'why don't you just get out of that place' I get 'Our neighborhood too!'.

p.s. I saw a post that seemed to imply that it was shame to have to add motion lights, alarm system etc.. True - and there was a time when folks thought it was a shame to have to lock the doors.... unfortunately this is SOP in Detroit and the burbs. This should have been done upon moving in along with adding glass block to the basement windows.

It really is true - if Detroit falls, so do our suburbs. If I can't live and play in the city of Detroit - I'm not moving to our burbs. I'm leaving Michigan.

[stinkbug]

Greetings all - if you don't recognize the name...it's because I haven't posted in years - was on again/off again in the very early days of this forum. Saw this entry on EEV, where I live - so talk about hitting home - I had to get back in the game!

I've been a resident for 12 years - bought when I was 28...so do the math - no wait, don't! No one can speak for an entire neighborhood, we can just hand out glimpses of what life is like in our particular corner. I for one, adore my corner - not perfect, but I don't believe perfect exists.

Is crime worse in this recession? yes, I feel it is....but that's because it affected me for the first time in 12 years last spring - garage break-in. But come to talking to some neighbors...I apparently missed the news that 7 years ago we went through a rash of garage thefts...we just didn't do a good job communicating. I probably would have taken the time to better secure that side door! It always feels worse when it affects us personally. But the positive...

Police - never seen better response or more direct presence in all my years here as I have in 2009. We had a BIG issue with the residents of a house nearby. 3 raids, they're gone now, thanks to DPD.

Neighborhood association - never been stronger. They have the neighborhood mapped out. Empty house? they know who owns it, who takes care of it, or doesn't take care of it. Head to one of our monthly meetings - the participation makes me proud to be a resident, proud to be fighting for the survival of a truly diverse community.

Never seen so many empty homes in the neighborhood, but when I discuss this with friends at work [[all my coworkers live in the suburbs) instead of 'why don't you just get out of that place' I get 'Our neighborhood too!'.

p.s. I saw a post that seemed to imply that it was shame to have to add motion lights, alarm system etc.. True - and there was a time when folks thought it was a shame to have to lock the doors.... unfortunately this is SOP in Detroit and the burbs. This should have been done upon moving in along with adding glass block to the basement windows.

It really is true - if Detroit falls, so do our suburbs. If I can't live and play in the city of Detroit - I'm not moving to our burbs. I'm leaving Michigan.

Great, informative post. I completely agree with the last line.

[softailrider]

This statement is totally wrong. EEV is well patrolled and police response is great. I've lived in this neighborhood for over 20-years so I'm speaking from first hand experience.

If police response is so great, then why are the vacant houses in the area mostly stripped? I'm sure residents of the area called for police when scrappers were present. There's vacant houses in every city, yet the only stripped ones I see are in the COD. Is police respone great except for calls regarding people scrapping vacant houses ? Very rare to see a stripped house in the northern suburbs.

[Eastside]

If police response is so great, then why are the vacant houses in the area mostly stripped? I'm sure residents of the area called for police when scrappers were present. There's vacant houses in every city, yet the only stripped ones I see are in the COD. Is police respone great except for calls regarding people scrapping vacant houses ? Very rare to see a stripped house in the northern suburbs.

I don't know the answer to your question about the "houses in the area mostly stripped". Plus, what does "mostly stripped" mean? The few empty homes I've been in were in remarkably good shape, plumbing, furnaces, A/C units in place, oak fireplace mantels still there, original windows and doors in place. I've seen plaster damage and warped floors due to the cold perhaps.

I do know when I have called the Detroit Police on scrappers they have arrived within minutes.

I can't comment on stripped houses in the norther suburbs. I don't live there.

[pkbroch]

As far " boarded houses, run down houses" Detroit is not alone. Look at the streets of Birmingham south of Maple off Adams and look at foreclosed rentals being torn down for black mold. See Boarded houses with vandalizm at 9 & 10 mile near Inkster and Middlebelt.

Hazel Park, Madison Heights, and even Bloomfield, with A/C compressors taken and cracked swimming pools full of garbage and filthy water.

We are all in this mess together, and taking swipes at one area just because it's in Detroit is counterproductive.

This forum is turning into a bash Detroit forum. No wonder so many of the original posters are being turned off and not posting.

[Diehard]

If police response is so great, then why are the vacant houses in the area mostly stripped? I'm sure residents of the area called for police when scrappers were present. There's vacant houses in every city, yet the only stripped ones I see are in the COD. Is police respone great except for calls regarding people scrapping vacant houses ? Very rare to see a stripped house in the northern suburbs.

Northern suburbs? Like what, Lake Orion?
Are you comparing a dense, urban 100-year-old neighborhood to places that were cornfields 5-10 years ago and making the smug observation that fewer vacant houses have been vandalized out in the cornfields? Wow.
For what it's worth, I know of EEV residents who have confronted would-be scrappers in person and told them to get the hell out of the neighborhood.

[pkbroch]

Northern suburbs? Like what, Lake Orion?
Are you comparing a dense, urban 100-year-old neighborhood to places that were cornfields 5-10 years ago and making the smug observation that fewer vacant houses have been vandalized out in the cornfields? Wow.
For what it's worth, I know of EEV residents who have confronted would-be scrappers in person and told them to get the hell out of the neighborhood.

I think they mean Beaver Island in winter. No scrapped houses there. Or they could mean Alpena, but I guess not because some cottages got vandalized this fall.

Or maybe they are just typing without facts, very common on this thread.

[softailrider]

I think they mean Beaver Island in winter. No scrapped houses there. Or they could mean Alpena, but I guess not because some cottages got vandalized this fall.

Or maybe they are just typing without facts, very common on this thread.

Your last sentence didn't resonate very well with me. Due to the nature of my job I see a lot of vacant properties in different cities. I would venture to say there are very few people on this board who know the neighborhoods in the COD as well as I do. Unfortunately, I see more abandoned and vacant houses in a month then you'll see in a lifetime.

[ridgeabilly]

Those of us familiar with the Belva Davis story in EEV are aware of the negative role that our bailed out financial institutions are playing in communities across the nation. The fact that the banks are refusing to modify mortgages is leading to the downward spiral in property values.

http://www.candgnews.com/Homepage-Ar...re-protest.asp

[Diehard]

Your last sentence didn't resonate very well with me. Due to the nature of my job I see a lot of vacant properties in different cities. I would venture to say there are very few people on this board who know the neighborhoods in the COD as well as I do. Unfortunately, I see more abandoned and vacant houses in a month then you'll see in a lifetime.

Yes, there are thousands and thousands of vacant and stripped houses in the city. Everyone knows that. There's been a perfect storm of economic collapse and housing fraud that undid what progress was being made after decades of abandonment and neglect.
EEV has less blight than the rest of the city, but more than some new McMansion subdivision on 23 Mile. That goes without saying. It also has sidewalks, bus service, beautiful architecture and interesting, caring neighbors - which you might not get out in the northern suburbs. They're different places.
Personally, I'd rather walk past a few boarded-up houses to the Cadieux Cafe than have to make a 15-minute left turn on Hall Road to get to a TGI Friday's, but that's just me.

[softailrider]

Northern suburbs? Like what, Lake Orion?
Are you comparing a dense, urban 100-year-old neighborhood to places that were cornfields 5-10 years ago and making the smug observation that fewer vacant houses have been vandalized out in the cornfields? Wow.
For what it's worth, I know of EEV residents who have confronted would-be scrappers in person and told them to get the hell out of the neighborhood.

Didn't mean to come off as smug, not sure why you would write that. I'm calling it like it is, there's foreclosed houses in every city. It's something that has permeated just about every area. I only see scrapped and vandalized house in Detroit. Just across Eight Mile Road, In Southfield there is a slew of foreclosed homes, the ones I've seen are all very much intact. a real good assumption as to why they're intact would be quick police response when a neighbor picks up a phone and calls 911. Not trying to bash the city at all , not trying to put a smiley face on the situation either. I LOVE those 1920's brick houses in the COD. It makes me sick when I walk into a beautiful ceramic tile bathroom torn apart for five dollars worth of copper water line.

[eastdetroit48224]

The houses in the suburbs do not get as stripped as much as those in the older neighborhoods for a few simple reasons:

The pipes in newer homes are typically PVC- can hear ones "last Movement" rushing down the PVC Drains between the walls. No market for PVC yet.

Drywall vs. Wet Plaster with sculptured details

Foam based crown moldings vs. Solid wood moldings and details.

The windows are cheap Anderson or no name windows- We have beautiful beveled leaded glass windows, Stained Glass windows with craftsman details, Solid wood lined rooms, many architectural details that are being taken to build the McMansions in the burbs. Fluted columns that were built by people that cared and not machines or "Wood Like" materials.

Enjoy your plastic, Faux details, Pulte Track homes that look alike and simulated lives in the burbs.

[Det_ard]

The houses in the suburbs do not get as stripped as much as those in the older neighborhoods for a few simple reasons:

One and only one reason: neighbors will call and the police will respond immediately. Period.

The pipes in newer homes are typically PVC- can hear ones "last Movement" rushing down the PVC Drains between the walls. No market for PVC yet.

In newer homes the DWV pipes are PVC vs. cast iron but the money is in the copper supply pipes. Copper was used extensively in the city and suburbs for water supply lines for the last 50 years.

Drywall vs. Wet Plaster with sculptured details

Foam based crown moldings vs. Solid wood moldings and details.

The windows are cheap Anderson or no name windows- We have beautiful beveled leaded glass windows, Stained Glass windows with craftsman details, Solid wood lined rooms, many architectural details that are being taken to build the McMansions in the burbs. Fluted columns that were built by people that cared and not machines or "Wood Like" materials.

True for some city homes but not for others. True for some suburban homes and not for others.

What about central A/C units which contain a lot of copper [[probably more common in the suburbs)? What about copper wiring which is in every house everywhere? What about furnaces which get stolen frequently?

Enjoy your plastic, Faux details, Pulte Track homes that look alike and simulated lives in the burbs.

There are vacaant GP homes with all the architectural details you describe but these homes aren't touched because scrappers know they will be caught and jailed if they pull this shit in the 'burbs. That's the bottom line.

[loralei]

det_ard,
Don't forget that many people strip their own homes before they leave and let the bank foreclose. I know of more than one home where the homeowner removed their entire kitchen just before they walked away. They still had ownership at the time but apparently were "packing" their things... People take furnaces they recently put in, whatever. It happens all over the place, not just in the city. It is what it is.
Also, I was the chairperson for our private security patrol for 5 years. I can tell you from experience that we do get police response and that it has been better in the last few years than it was when I started. I'm ok with your view that police response is not what it needs to be in the city, but please don't roll EEV into that. We have worked hard to form good relationships with DPD and the community police department. We are being served well.
And yes, I love my neighborhood. So do most of the residents, and perhaps that's what sets us apart in some ways. We try to remain positive even though we may be in the minority at times and we work to make change, however small, for the better. If that ideal appeals to someone, we want them to consider EEV because that truly is what we are about. Houses are important, but only one part of the equation for a successful and appealing neighborhood.

[sumas]

Even with the foreclosure crisis residents here in EEV have every confidence in our rebound. Having been here for 44 years, I have seen the swing of ups and downs and we always come back.

There are currently several extreme bargains but buyers shy at the tax rates, I wish real estate agents would stress NEZ [[tax abatement program). This is a great place to live.

Recently a friend in a different area of Detroit asked us to babysit his new car while he was on vacation. He felt our area was "safe" and so it proved.

[7051]

Unfortunately, those numbers are not good. Those rates are given as the number of "1 out of X". Example 1 out 5.34 homes in 48224 are in foreclosure. 1 out of 34.44 in in 48230 are in foreclosure. Etc., etc. The 48224 includes many other neighborhoods so it really doesn't tell us specifics about EEV, whose is probably somewhere between 48230's and the 48224's rates.

[Eastside]

Unfortunately, those numbers are not good. Those rates are given as the number of "1 out of X". Example 1 out 5.34 homes in 48224 are in foreclosure. 1 out of 34.44 in in 48230 are in foreclosure. Etc., etc. The 48224 includes many other neighborhoods so it really doesn't tell us specifics about EEV, whose is probably somewhere between 48230's and the 48224's rates.

Understood, but I'm comparing zip code areas to other zip code areas knowing that 48224 is not exclusive to EEV and incorporates other surrounding neighborhoods.

[MikeM]

Overall, EEV and the surrounding neighborhoods are doing quite well.

That seems significantly worse than most of the other zip codes you've posted.