I was wondering how the Detroit Newspapers were doing...here's the answer

**ndavies** · November-03-09, 05:51 PM

Originally Posted by Diehard

How are any of them supposed to survive if everyone wants them for free?

The same way TV news survives. Paid for by advertising.

**Bobl** · November-03-09, 08:19 PM

The writing has been on the wall for years now. Daily newspapers, as we knew them, are becoming extinct. My fear is that local coverage will take the largest hit, with little available online to replace it.

A note to Detroit Dailies: A friend signed up at an "introductory rate" during a promotion at the Jazz Festival last September. She was later billed for August and September. Not a good way to encourage new subscribers!

**oldredfordette** · November-03-09, 09:01 PM

The e-edition is exactly like the print edition. The only difference is the media.

**Diehard** · November-04-09, 02:37 PM

Originally Posted by ndavies

The same way TV news survives. Paid for by advertising.

Isn't TV news traditionally a loss for the networks? From what I've read, they make their advertising money during high-rated shows like "American Idol" and sports events. [[If anyone in the biz is reading this and can provide more info, please chime in.) I'm sure most would agree that a half-hour local TV newscast - in which much of the content is borrowed from the print media anyway - is a sorry substitute for a daily newspaper.
I'm not saying it's not feasible to get by solely on advertising. Metro Times does it, weekly, without home delivery and with some low standards for their ads. But you probably wouldn't be seeing much Pulitzer material if the dailies tried the Metro Times route.

**ndavies** · November-04-09, 03:23 PM

Originally Posted by Diehard

Isn't TV news traditionally a loss for the networks? From what I've read, they make their advertising money during high-rated shows like "American Idol" and sports events. [[If anyone in the biz is reading this and can provide more info, please chime in.) I'm sure most would agree that a half-hour local TV newscast - in which much of the content is borrowed from the print media anyway - is a sorry substitute for a daily newspaper.
I'm not saying it's not feasible to get by solely on advertising. Metro Times does it, weekly, without home delivery and with some low standards for their ads. But you probably wouldn't be seeing much Pulitzer material if the dailies tried the Metro Times route.

That may have been true for the 1 hour of national news on the OTR networks. However, We wouldn't have had a huge increase in the number of cable news stations if you couldn't make money from advertising during the news. CNN, FOX, MSNBC, Blomberg.... all seem to be surviving nicely.

Local news must be a money maker for some of the local stations, Otherwise they all would have dumped their newscasts long ago. They are either cheaper to produce than reruns or make more profit per $ spent.

**ggores** · November-04-09, 03:36 PM

Originally Posted by Bobl

A friend signed up at an "introductory rate" during a promotion at the Jazz Festival last September. She was later billed for August and September. Not a good way to encourage new subscribers!

Did she pay that bill? I would hope so.

**buildingsofdetroit** · November-04-09, 03:46 PM

Friend of mine was just hired as the copy desk chief for the Detroit Daily News startup that is apparently closer to fruition [[if they're hiring). Wonder what this means to the Freep and Detroit News - if anything.

**oldredfordette** · November-04-09, 07:03 PM

They have dropped their daily home delivery idea, so I think there will be no impact. Also, they're unable to pay anybody right away. You might tell your friend that.

**Jimaz** · November-04-09, 07:19 PM

Is it "Detroit Daily News" or "Detroit Daily Press"? By Mark and Gary Stern?

**Servite76** · November-04-09, 07:47 PM

Originally Posted by buildingsofdetroit

Friend of mine was just hired as the copy desk chief for the Detroit Daily News startup that is apparently closer to fruition [[if they're hiring). Wonder what this means to the Freep and Detroit News - if anything.

Means nothing. The cost of newsprint alone could put this paper out of commision in 1 month. If that doesn't do it, paying Mailer, Pressmen and Driver wages will.

**Diehard** · November-04-09, 11:43 PM

Originally Posted by Servite76

Means nothing. The cost of newsprint alone could put this paper out of commision in 1 month. If that doesn't do it, paying Mailer, Pressmen and Driver wages will.

Not necessarily - if they're contracting out for printing and delivery instead of hiring those people themselves. I highly doubt they're building their own printing plant and buying a bunch of delivery trucks.

**Servite76** · November-05-09, 12:56 PM

Originally Posted by Diehard

Not necessarily - if they're contracting out for printing and delivery instead of hiring those people themselves. I highly doubt they're building their own printing plant and buying a bunch of delivery trucks.

The Macomb Daily will be printing the paper. All union employee's.

**Bobl** · November-05-09, 06:07 PM

Originally Posted by ggores

Did she pay that bill? I would hope so.

WHY would you hope that she paid for August delivery, which she did not order or receive?
She paid reluctantly for September only, canceled the subscription, and will never do business with them again.
Remember, it was ordered the first week of September....not August.

**ggores** · November-06-09, 08:36 AM

Originally Posted by Bobl

WHY? Remember, it was ordered the first week of September....not August.

I speak strictly from the standpoint of being a once-proud [[and now retired) Detroit Newspaper deliverer in the hood. And it's a damned dirty business, the lengths one must go through just to earn a buck or two sometimes, unfortunately, entails some rather shifty antics, such as your friend experienced [[and I've witnessed much worse! ah!). And so, unless things have changed since those old days of yore, then number one priority is, and always will be - pay that bill, call the corporate office, lodge a complaint - and then what they will do is simply cancel that subscription unless that bill becomes paid in full. Once all print editions of the local rags are complete and total history, then these problems won't exist anyhow.

**Mikeg** · November-23-09, 11:52 AM

I was wondering how the Detroit Newspapers were doing...

....here's some six month data through Sept. 30, 2009, which doesn't include the Oct. 5th single copy price increase.

"Detroit newspapers lose less circulation than other big dailies"
[[Detroit News, Oct. 27, 2009):

Circulation declines at The Detroit News and Detroit Free Press were smaller than for most other big city dailies, according to figures released Monday.

The News' decline was 5.9 percent from April 1 to Sept. 30, compared with the same period a year earlier; the Free Press' decline was 9.6 percent. The decreases brought weekday average circulation at the News to 167,849 and to 269,729 at the Free Press.

The results in Detroit were better than the average 12.9 percent decline among the nation's 50 largest papers.......

The Oakland Press of Pontiac saw a 7.3 percent gain; the Macomb Daily of Mount Clemens gained 4.9 percent.

Is this the first evidence that the Detroit newspapers' new "revenue model" might be pulling them out of their death spiral before they crater?

Maybe not, since the Audit Bureau of Circulations [[ABC) has changed their methodology of counting paid subscriptions, which is likely distorting their latest circulation numbers.

"New ABC Rules Helps Some Papers Boost Circ"
[[Editor & Publisher, Nov. 23, 2009)

While U.S. newspapers are losing subscribers at a staggering rate, a few dailies stand out because their circulation is rising. But they aren't necessarily selling more copies.

Here's why: Since April 1, new auditing rules have made it easier for newspapers to count a reader as a paying customer.

These looser standards are especially helpful to a newspaper if it sells an "electronic edition." That can include a subscriber-only Web site, such as what The Wall Street Journal has, or it can be a digital replica of a newspaper's printed product. Several dozen publications, including USA Today, sell access to these daily "e-editions" that show how the news was laid out in print.

Under the new auditing standards, if a newspaper sells a "bundled" subscription to both the print and electronic editions, the publication is often allowed to count that subscriber twice.

If not for these rules, the industry's numbers would look even worse.......

**Servite76** · November-23-09, 06:35 PM

The News/Freep put out over 50,000,000 paid advertisments last week and expect to exceed that this week. Papers aren't done yet. As the economy improves, retailers will realize that one of their only chances for survival will have to include print media, and the News/Freep are the only ones that can provide that coverage. Most of you news savy people know that papers survive and profit on ad revenue. The Oakland Press, The Macomb Daily or the new Detroit Daily News will never be able to compete with the excellence in journalism that these papers provide. As papers across the country move forward, the one key ingredient that is needed for all newspapers is finding a way of capturing the readership of those under 30.

Stosh · November-23-09, 06:51 PM

I bought the paper today, it was decent. Enough to warrant a try for a while, in my opinion. Decent writing, more or less timely articles, not overly filled with ads.

**Diehard** · November-23-09, 10:01 PM

Originally Posted by Stosh

I bought the paper today, it was decent. Enough to warrant a try for a while, in my opinion. Decent writing, more or less timely articles, not overly filled with ads.

Which paper? The Daily Press' debut edition?