Share ideas for the MCS property!

[K-slice]

People must be smarter than me, I couldn't find a way through the fence this spring..
I think it's great that someones doing something for the station, and that the owner's actually footing the bill for supplies. A rejuvenated, or at least secure, MCS is a plus for the whole community, so I don't see anything wrong with volunteering to fix er' up.

[cman710]

Thank you for your constructive ideas.

As far as I know those steel bars are in place but obviously are not
doing the trick, so either bricking that area up at the end of
the concourse or adding thicker bars would definitely do the
trick.

Also if you haven't seen my earlier posts, a new fence and security cameras will be going up before the end of the year.

It is interesting that the steel bars are not working. As you mention, some other method will then need to be pursued, whether brick or something else. As I had mentioned, I think the best idea would be to do a methodical assessment of the different ways to get into the building, identify each one, and then come up with an action plan for securing it. The new fence should help [[hopefully it will be higher to make it more difficult to climb over), but so long as other methods of access remain accessible, it will not help much. Also, will the security cameras be installed inside the building or outside? I would think that if the cameras were installed inside some main areas and watched, that it could provide a deterrent to people entering, especially if there was a quick response when someone was spotted inside the building.

[EastSider]

Would it be inappropriate to suggest that one or two floors be set up as a youth hostel in the renovated MCS?

[Lonyo exit]

In some respects they already are.

[mcsdetroitfriend]

It is interesting that the steel bars are not working. As you mention, some other method will then need to be pursued, whether brick or something else. As I had mentioned, I think the best idea would be to do a methodical assessment of the different ways to get into the building, identify each one, and then come up with an action plan for securing it. The new fence should help [[hopefully it will be higher to make it more difficult to climb over), but so long as other methods of access remain accessible, it will not help much. Also, will the security cameras be installed inside the building or outside? I would think that if the cameras were installed inside some main areas and watched, that it could provide a deterrent to people entering, especially if there was a quick response when someone was spotted inside the building.

The steel bars apparently are too far spaced for skinny kids, or it has been broken, I have no idea I haven't been there since July during the ill advised volunteer project, and i didn't do much exploring unfortunately.

As for a youth hostel who knows that'd be nice, though definitely not in it's current state, making it uninhabited would be nice, like the CPA building across the park, nobody's been in it since it closed save the owner so far as I've been told by people in the area.

[cman710]

Unfortunately, just about any kind of barrier can be overcome so long as there are people willing to try do so. Some kind of steel door with a major security system would be required, I would think, or at least thicker steel bars.

The best way to secure the building would be to do a lot of work on it simultaneously [[e.g., clean the outside face, build a new fence, secure the entranceways), and then to have some sort of regular or semi-regular security presence. Unfortunately, right now, that does not seem in the cards.

To the poster above who was concerned about parking if the building were ever to be renovated, that situation would be pretty easily remedied. First, Maroun/the ABC owns the Roosevelt Warehouse, and could level the building for a parking lot, or possibly garage, if the footprint is large enough. Second, a large parking lot could be built directly behind the building, where the old tracks currently are and the sheds used to be. There could be security issues relating to the active train tracks, but you could certainly fit many, many cars back there. Finally, if there were ever demand for additional parking, it could be easily be provided on the site of what are now many vacant properties nearby [[e.g., CPA building, the hotel, etc.).

[Gsgeorge]

Ashton & John, you know my ideas already. Please try to find an "ornamental" fence, while maintaining its purpose. Powerwash the facade. Replace all windows with temporary or permanent substitutes. Clean the grounds and possibly replace broken ashphalt or concrete, or remove it entirely and revert it to grass or landscaping.

[wolverine]

mcsdetroitfriend. Just for future reference, my ideas about this whole project are this:

The idea is great.
The approach is terrible.

I'm a huge fan of what they did over in Buffalo, but I just don't see this whole process as anything close to being responsible. But I am willing to offer helpful suggestions from here on out.

If to be spent on the building as you say, I would definitely not invest at the moment in any physical aesthetic improvements.

Do Not purchase and install any temporary substitutes for the windows. If you expect it to hold up for a year and do the purpose of keeping rain out, you can't even come close to affording it. Covering just 1 floor of windows on the north elevation will entirely blow your budget, that's even getting cheap 1/4" plexiglas + hardware at discount.

Do not invest in landscaping unless you have someone volunteering to take care of it.

Do not even think of repairing/removing sidewalks, curbs, and asphalt. You can't just "rip it up" There's drains and other conduit beneath that cannot be touched unless there was some serious undertaking [[like an actual renovation). There's also high costs to have it removed.

Now....

DO invest in sealing up the property. People are still getting in. Gate the front entrance, Nothing Ornamental!! Purchase something utilitarian that can take some abuse that it will surely endure. No openings should be accessible.

I don't think any of this money if to be spent on that station building itself should be used for aesthetic improvements. That's a waste. It should be spent to prevent further damage from unauthorized entry that will essentially render all the work done so far a waste.

[mcsdetroitfriend]

mcsdetroitfriend. Just for future reference, my ideas about this whole project are this:

The idea is great.
The approach is terrible.

I'm a huge fan of what they did over in Buffalo, but I just don't see this whole process as anything close to being responsible. But I am willing to offer helpful suggestions from here on out.

If to be spent on the building as you say, I would definitely not invest at the moment in any physical aesthetic improvements.

Do Not purchase and install any temporary substitutes for the windows. If you expect it to hold up for a year and do the purpose of keeping rain out, you can't even come close to affording it. Covering just 1 floor of windows on the north elevation will entirely blow your budget, that's even getting cheap 1/4" plexiglas + hardware at discount.

Do not invest in landscaping unless you have someone volunteering to take care of it.

Do not even think of repairing/removing sidewalks, curbs, and asphalt. You can't just "rip it up" There's drains and other conduit beneath that cannot be touched unless there was some serious undertaking [[like an actual renovation). There's also high costs to have it removed.

Now....

DO invest in sealing up the property. People are still getting in. Gate the front entrance, Nothing Ornamental!! Purchase something utilitarian that can take some abuse that it will surely endure. No openings should be accessible.

I don't think any of this money if to be spent on that station building itself should be used for aesthetic improvements. That's a waste. It should be spent to prevent further damage from unauthorized entry that will essentially render all the work done so far a waste.

I'll mention it for like the fifth time, the bridge company is having a 10 foot tall wrought iron fence [[last i heard it was that material) it will be similar to what they have outside the White House [[this is what I've been told, things could change) but it will be a lot harder to get into the building from the front, the old tools of cutting through fence won't work unless you come with a sawzall, or a generator.

The big thing to make this all work is getting the city on board with their property, and getting the interior sealed better, maybe combination brick steel approach like mentioned earlier.

As far as windows go I've heard people talk about removing them altogether until things get going because they're aesthetically undesirable broken than if they weren't there all together. So the cost on MCSPS Inc. should only be for smaller projects, everything else big [[windows, renovation, digging up concrete) will go to the Bridge Co.

The landscaping - if any is done - will be maintained by the bridge company, they throughout the summer have come in daily and watered the plants in front of the building that were planted by Mrs. Maroun and the Summer in the City group [[which should have been the only thing they did). I was by the building the other day and the flowers and vegetation look great, so obviously they are being maintained.

On a side note about the digging up concrete, I have in my possession a street layout from the 1980's which details pipes that extend to and from the building, coal chutes, tunnels, and other odds and ends, and I'm sure the city has further updated maps and plans to help with any digging up that would occur. I would not want to be behind a backhoe when a pipe bursts, no thanks!

[wolverine]

Then I honestly don't know what ideas to offer up then. If the bridge company does this and that then why bother? Your efforts only pay off until they actually do their part first.

From what you are saying, at least we can trust the landscaping is getting taken care of. I'd say go all out on that, but here's the thing.... Why don't they go all the way and just begin a full renovation? If they are investing in a very expensive fence, this tells me MCS is not going to see any real renovation work soon. How long will you all continue to prop up this property under his ownership?

You mentioned that the building is still open to some extent because the city hasn't done their part. It doesn't matter. If there is a bridge company side of the property, and a city side of the property then seal the respective property you have control over.

You said

The big thing to make this all work is getting the city on board with their property

So does this mean the bridge company has no intention of sealing up the back of the property themselves, but relying on the city? If I have intruders enter my building from the back alley, we simply lock the door on our property. Easy. I only bring this up because the things you say start to conflict. Maybe you will say "the bridge company will fix this" but:

1. I don't believe they will.
2. You make ambiguous and conflicting statements on the intentions for future work.

So at this point, good luck. But I really believe the ultimate fate of this building will not be the result of all the volunteer work. I actually hope I am proven wrong on this.

[mcsdetroitfriend]

. But I really believe the ultimate fate of this building will not be the result of all the volunteer work. I actually hope I am proven wrong on this.

No volunteers, the only volunteers are the three guys on MCSPS Inc, making phone calls and get professionals to come and do their thing.

Right now I'm only speculating, the Bridge company will better seal their edge of the property, but it'd also be nice to stop it at the source. What if someone is entering your apartment that you dont want there? You can't go to the front door and change the lock on your own.

Getting the city on board would be great because it really stops people twice. Also if the bridge co. wants to use the excuse "because of national security" they'd really have a case here, because those tracks are definitely part of international commerce and if someone really wanted to, they could do severe damage under there.

[Lowell]

The first thing that needs to be done, as others above mention, is to protect the structure against further damage from the elements and scavengers. Otherwise a point of no return will be reached and restoration will be financially beyond reach. That is very unglamorous work but must be done before any cosmetic sandblasting or landscaping.

Look at Jerald Mitchell's long efforts to preserve the Ford Picquette Plant; the sandblasting came only after long years of hidden and expensive efforts to stablilized the structure. Protect, defend then restore.

I know this is kind of a "If god can do anything, why is there pain and suffering in the world" question but why do you personally think Mr. Moroun, with his vast wealth, lets this architectural work of art decay and remain a public safety hazard when he is totally capable of restoring it?

[Burnsie]

MCSdetroitfriend, the city doesn't own the RR tracks around the depot. They're owned by Canadian Pacific Railway.

[mcsdetroitfriend]

I know this is kind of a "If god can do anything, why is there pain and suffering in the world" question but why do you personally think Mr. Moroun, with his vast wealth, lets this architectural work of art decay and remain a public safety hazard when he is totally capable of restoring it?

Well one he didn't let it get to the ugly windowless point it's in now, that was done by the previous two owners, he just hasn't done anything to correct it. And as to why he hasn't just up and done something with it. Well the phrase "if you build it they will come" doesn't hold up in this economy. So if someone company would come up and say "We want to work out of this building!" then Maroun would set the wheels in motion. Right now it's just about making it look a little bit nicer while securing it at the same time.

The tracks are owned by the railway, but the city owns the property underneath the railway, which was first reported by the Free Press back in late April.

[tahleel]

Someone needs to fall and get injured and then sue Matty. Boarding up the building is a helluva lot cheaper than a lawsuit.

-Tahleel

[Burnsie]

Sure, a lot of windows were broken by the time Moroun bought it, but he's let a hell of a lot more get broken since. Just because there has been no buyer lined up for the place doesn't justify his not properly securing the building in the 15 years he's owned it. He can afford it. It's called being a responsible property owner.

[casscorridor]

1. Cleaning up the graffiti off the exterior. There is huge lettering across these columns that read "T R O Y" for example, which is a disgrace to Detroit... probably put there by some immature kids from Troy who think Detroit is a joke and that you can just shit on the city, and deface it's grand landmarks.

2. Replacing the windows. Almost all the windows are broken, and it makes the building look like it is ready to fall over, even though it could stand for another hundred years abandoned, easily. This might be costly, so fundraising beyond $10,000 is essential.

3. Secure and prepare building for redevelopment. Even if there is no development plan, securing the building from further damage and preparing it for redevelopment is essential. It will make the building more attractive to developers, including government...which I think is the most likely canidate. This isn't renovating the building, rather taking steps that would have been neccesary anyway, and doing them now. Perhaps the station section [[not the tower) could be targeted as a priority for restoring.

4. Lobby for government use. The station and tower could be used as both a hub for future public transit [[absolutely essential for redevelopment of the ANY part of the city) and for government offices. Consolidate all transportation agencies here, make it a base for other government agencies as well.

Finally, USE THE THE STATION AS A TRAIN STATION

[mcsdetroitfriend]

1. Cleaning up the graffiti off the exterior. There is huge lettering across these columns that read "T R O Y" for example, which is a disgrace to Detroit... probably put there by some immature kids from Troy who think Detroit is a joke and that you can just shit on the city, and deface it's grand landmarks.

2. Replacing the windows. Almost all the windows are broken, and it makes the building look like it is ready to fall over, even though it could stand for another hundred years abandoned, easily. This might be costly, so fundraising beyond $10,000 is essential.

3. Secure and prepare building for redevelopment. Even if there is no development plan, securing the building from further damage and preparing it for redevelopment is essential. It will make the building more attractive to developers, including government...which I think is the most likely canidate. This isn't renovating the building, rather taking steps that would have been neccesary anyway, and doing them now. Perhaps the station section [[not the tower) could be targeted as a priority for restoring.

4. Lobby for government use. The station and tower could be used as both a hub for future public transit [[absolutely essential for redevelopment of the ANY part of the city) and for government offices. Consolidate all transportation agencies here, make it a base for other government agencies as well.

Finally, USE THE THE STATION AS A TRAIN STATION

Hey cass TROY is gone! Check it out!
Attachment 3403

As for the rest those are all great and valid ideas, the 10k is just a starting thing for small projects until an anchor tenant can be found, most likely it will go to some form of security for the building, but nothing is final just yet

[Jared9903]

I completely agree, fix that loading bay, even if you have to argue with the city, it's worth the time. No sense in cleaning the building if it's only a step through a wide-open loading bay to go and screw it up again.

[mcsdetroitfriend]

I completely agree, fix that loading bay, even if you have to argue with the city, it's worth the time. No sense in cleaning the building if it's only a step through a wide-open loading bay to go and screw it up again.

Couldn't have said it better myself, i went youtube searching and found several videos that can definitely be used as evidence for support when MCSPS Inc goes to the city

[Jared9903]

Couldn't have said it better myself, i went youtube searching and found several videos that can definitely be used as evidence for support when MCSPS Inc goes to the city

I, too, took a [somewhat bumpy] video of the loading bays that shows the one wide-open bay. I took it through the window of the car as I was going under the bridge. If you would like it for your files, I can send it to you, and I can get YouTube videos downloaded and email them to you if you would like. Anything to help out...