Hardin

[Detroitej72]

Authorizing the use of force by nongovernmental entities, when that is the prime tool and authority of a government is a usurpation of the trust that free individuals/citizens have in their government. If this boundary is breached, then the faith of the constitution is likewise breached.

Yes!

There is hope for you after all!

[elganned]

As a believer in strict interpretation of the Constitution, point out where it says they can't.

If that had been the framers' intent, they would have spelled it out. They didn't. End of list.

You may now assume the "I'm a Constitutional illiterate" pose.

As an aside, what possible credibility can you expect as an Objectivist when you advocate for the federal government to interfere in how municipalities run their respective jurisdictions?

Or are you secretly hoping we'll set up a National Police Force to assume those duties across the country? Talk about a closet socialist...

[ccbatson]

Bigger picture...without this principle, the constitution is worthless. Obama wants to render it so, but we the people do not.

[elganned]

You can't have it both ways, Cc--either you are a 'strict interpretation' advocate, or you're not. "Bigger picture" and "underlying principles" don't cut it...unless you're a progressive.

Are you?

[elganned]

Bigger picture...without this principle, the constitution is worthless. Obama wants to render it so, but we the people do not.

A thought just occurred to me; if "we the people" wanted to make it explicit that government can never contract out the fulfillment of it's Sacred Duties [[as defined by you), then the solution is simple: Get an ammendment together to that effect, and pass it around for ratification. If the grassroots support for your interpretation is as overwhelming as you seem to think, it should pass in record time.

BTW, I don't know what you possilby think Obama has to do with the events in Hardin, but kudoes on a valiant attempt to divert the discussion onto a sidetrack, again. Obama delenda est!

[Sstashmoo]

Their logo is caricature of our nation's symbol, the eagle with two demonic looking heads on it. Each with a different crown under one crown.

This country thanks to no real leadership in 50 years has went completely batshit crazy. I think this country died too at Dealy plaza. It seems it has been nothing but scandal, deceit and underhandedness ever since.

[elganned]

Their logo is actually a variation on the coat of arms of some Eastern European country--Serbia, or Croatia, or someplace like that. The double-headed eagle was a symbol in use in Eastern Europe and Russia long before the US adopted the eagle as a national symbol.

I'm still waiting for "someone" to explain to me where in the Constitution it prohibits governments from hiring private police forces. [[I'm not in favor of it, but I don't believe it's illegal.)

[Sstashmoo]

Quote: "I'm still waiting for "someone" to explain to me where in the Constitution it prohibits governments"

Do you need to read something in the constitution to take one? Some things are just pretty obvious. Following your logic, the Constitution would weigh 50 pounds.

Our government or any state or local government should not be hiring private law enforcement organizations. Private companies with authority over the people. Very dangerous precedent.

[elganned]

"Obvious" is not the standard. "Constitutional" is the standard.
If it's not prohibited, it's allowed. End of list.

What do you care how much the Constituion weighs? Afraid somebody's going to ask you to carry it around?

[Gannon]

Sstash,

I am with you on that one...Dealey Plaza indeed.


We can trace MOST of our nation's problems through the Walker/Bush family tree all the way back to the mid-1800s.

Even Lincoln and McKinley's assassinations can be linked to them...but there is NO question that GHW Bush was behind Kennedy's killing.


But I've never heard it put so succinctly, thanks!


Cheers,
John

[elganned]

Yeah, probably the executions of Marie Antoinnette and Louis XVI can be laid on their doorstep, too. [[Whatever you're smoking, Gannon, I want some...)

[Gannon]

Not from my research, but the stuff in the 1800s is spot-on.


They are war-mongers to the extreme, financing and supplying war machines on BOTH sides of many conflicts...for the past 160 years, only four generations or so. Apple doesn't fall far from the tree.


And yes, they have some implication in many presidential murders...


...no matter what you choose to imbibe or not.


Prescott goes back to the foundation of what many of the Conspiracy Buffs consider the foundations of the shadow government that JFK started to reveal a month before his head was blown off.

Prescott's boy was Nixon. Can't enough be said about HIS fanatical obsession with secrecy and security in the Oval Office...remember those tapes? He knew how the game was played.


He waited from 1960 until 1968...from my quick casual survey, the ONLY candidate to be blown away and embarrassed, and still wait around for his promised appointment. Everyone else who lost went away and never returned. Remember those he had in his cabinet, too, a young Donald Rumsfeld...and Dick Cheney...and a few of the other Neo-Cons on their way up the ladder.

They returned too, after being totally revealed during the Watergate scandal...plumbers fix leaks. That was their euphemism for doing whatever necessary to keep their secrets.


Cheers!

[ccbatson]

No need to amend the constitution Elganned, as I just explained it is in there and/or logically follows from it.

[elganned]

But I've asked you to show me where it "is in there". So pony up.
Surely such an important requirement would have been spelled out, don't you think?

And it "only follows logically" is an ill-concealed attempt to set up following the "spirit" of the document as valid criteria--which leads us to the IRS, the Federal Reserve, and all sorts of other nasty things you disapprove of, all of which were instituted by men following what they thought was the "spirit" of the document.

Some consistency in your positions would go a long way towards reinforcing your credibility.

[Sstashmoo]

Quote: "And it "only follows logically" is an ill-concealed attempt to set up following the "spirit" of the document as valid criteria--which leads us to the IRS, the Federal Reserve, and all sorts of other nasty things you disapprove of, all of which were instituted by men following what they thought was the "spirit" of the document.""

Good point

[ccbatson]

Logic and rational thought are more bold than having it in print. Of course, not everyone in the audience will have the skills to see that.

[elganned]

Thank you for demonstrating that some who pontificate ad nauseum about those skills lack them entirely.

[Detroitej72]

Logic and rational thought are more bold than having it in print. Of course, not everyone in the audience will have the skills to see that.

Good thing we Obama as president, as he clearly sees that as a constitutional scholar.

[Lorax]

Logic and rational thought are more bold than having it in print. Of course, not everyone in the audience will have the skills to see that.

I know I don't.

But then again, I choose to gather my news and formulate my thoughts and opinions by the facts presented to me through this research. Logic and rational thought play a great role in that, but logic and rational though will not be beholden to ideological dogma such as that spewed from the fundamentalist Reich or the complacency of a paralyzed left.

[ccbatson]

You do not use facts, as most liberals, you use emotion Lorax.

[East Detroit]

ccBatson, do you expect a different answer by repeating yourself?

By the way, still waiting for your facts on Lance Armstrong.
Unless you were jumping to poorly educated conclusions and emotions or poor intuition again.

[Lorax]

Hell, I'm still waiting for facts of any kind that don't come from biased fascist right wing "noise" sources.

Batts can't find anything from any credible news sources to support his claims, since there aren't any.

He flies from pillar to post regurgitating the Levin, Malkin, Lindner, Dobson, Limbaugh, Hannity, Ingraham, Schnitt, Beck, Medved, Hedgecock, Savage, Boortz, Schlesinger, Boehner, Palin, Scarborough, O'Reilly talking points, ad nauseum.

God, after that I need a puke bucket.

[East Detroit]

Lorax, do you expect a different answer from ccBatson by repeating yourself?

[Lorax]

Lorax, do you expect a different answer from ccBatson by repeating yourself?

No, but I'm making progress. In another thread, he posted the "dictionary definition" of fascism, which he says he has posted numerous times, presumably from the same source, however, this one is actually correct.

So I highlighted the part of the definition which dovetails with what I have been saying since the beginning, which he unwittingly admitted as being the true and definitive definition.

Still waiting for the mea culpa, which I know I'll never get, but it does prove that persuasion over time, like diplomacy in the middle east stands a better chance at avoiding the nuclear option!

[East Detroit]

No, but I'm making progress.

Still waiting for the mea culpa, which I know I'll never get...

Not sure what progress is being made.

Someone with an opinion on everything, which is served up with a side dish of disdain for other humans, and an inability to admit ever being mistaken or wrong.... is not going to succumb to thinking in earnest about differing opinions.