Can Greektown be saved?

[Zacha341]

Bottom line for me: when the crime trajectory in that concentrated area is resolved I'll consider returning. There have been shootings again over the last few days. Riverwalk as well.....

https://www.wxyz.com/news/multiple-s...wntown-detroit

https://www.fox2detroit.com/news/det...reektown-store

[Lowell]

Greektown long benefited from have Police HQ the next block over at 1300 Beaubien which kept the area flooded with cops on and off duty. I credited that with it remaining vibrant during the ghost town years of downtown--the only part of downtown that was back then. The HQ has been moved away for a long time, of course. [Slight side track... anybody know what is happening with 1300?]

[401don]

Greektown long benefited from have Police HQ the next block over at 1300 Beaubien which kept the area flooded with cops on and off duty. I credited that with it remaining vibrant during the ghost town years of downtown--the only part of downtown that was back then. The HQ has been moved away for a long time, of course. [Slight side track... anybody know what is happening with 1300?]

Gilbert bought it and announced plans to redevelop it 5 yrs. ago. I would check back in 5 more. It's an excellent point about the loss of the hq though.

[K-slice]

Greektown long benefited from have Police HQ the next block over at 1300 Beaubien which kept the area flooded with cops on and off duty. I credited that with it remaining vibrant during the ghost town years of downtown--the only part of downtown that was back then. The HQ has been moved away for a long time, of course. [Slight side track... anybody know what is happening with 1300?]

The courts will be vacating that area shortly for new digs in Poletown, after which the fail jail and all other gilbert owned blocks [[there are many) in the area will get a vision laid out for them.

The police presence may have helped in the 90s and 2000's, but it sure doesn't help anymore... Those blocks swarm with cops and this stuff still happens.

I used to frequent the Baltimore, Well, Old Shillelagh, and others back in 2015- 2018 as I lived right around there and things were never this bad. The crowd has noticeably changed in that area.

[ABetterDetroit]

The courts will be vacating that area shortly for new digs in Poletown, after which the fail jail and all other gilbert owned blocks [[there are many) in the area will get a vision laid out for them.

The police presence may have helped in the 90s and 2000's, but it sure doesn't help anymore... Those blocks swarm with cops and this stuff still happens.

I used to frequent the Baltimore, Well, Old Shillelagh, and others back in 2015- 2018 as I lived right around there and things were never this bad. The crowd has noticeably changed in that area.

Fair enough. The mayor has earmarked $ for community policing in this budget. I’m all for it, it helps. What ideas do you think would help? It wasn’t my idea to pour as many $400 Glocks as possible all over our society for the last few decades but the fact is that’s what happened and it Is What It Is. Not a damn thing can be done about that. What else besides a boat load of high def cameras and good police work backed up by courts that enforce penalties will help? This topic is on a few threads here and probably worthy of its own thread but unfortunately that will attract out of town racists to the thread like maggots to rotting chicken in the summertime. I have witnessed guns getting pulled, falling out of pants on the ground and heard the distant gunfire just like you have. What’s to be done?

[Rocket]

What’s to be done?

Could you describe who specifically is causing it the problem? Any common denominators in your experience?

I used to be there 1-2 x weekly in the late 80's, early 90's. And there were fights then. Leaving the Old Shillelagh we'd sometimes have to fight our way to the car.

I only go down there for business now, and never after 3, so I don't have any idea who's causing the trouble.

[Henry Whalley]

I used to be there 1-2 x weekly in the late 80's, early 90's. And there were fights then. Leaving the Old Shillelagh we'd sometimes have to fight our way to the car.

I only go down there for business now, and never after 3, so I don't have any idea who's causing the trouble.

Probably the kids and grandkids of those you encountered 25-30 years ago.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

Could you describe who specifically is causing it the problem? Any common denominators in your experience?

I used to be there 1-2 x weekly in the late 80's, early 90's. And there were fights then. Leaving the Old Shillelagh we'd sometimes have to fight our way to the car.

I only go down there for business now, and never after 3, so I don't have any idea who's causing the trouble.

The young generation are causing the trouble. [[15-mid 30's) Seems to me they're comitting crimes like it's a badge of honor, and they don't give a shit if they're caught or not. They have no problem doing a stint in jail.

[stasu1213]

There had been the s a me rash of violence in Chicago and other major cities this past weekend. It's not just a Detroit Greektown issue. It's an America issue. When protesters were burning and looting across the country after the death of George Floyd in 2020 Detroit was one of very few major cities that were able to prevent the burning and looting from occurring here. A few looters wannabeees were probably disappointed that they didn't get a free pair of Nikes ir Steph Curry sneakers from Under Armour that they had their sites on. I am beginning to wonder if there was orchestrated plans for young people just to cause chaos in the downtown areas of cities across the country. Ten years ago there were Flash Mobs wreaking havoc in cities across the country almost simultaneously

[Former_Detroiter]

[QUOTE=stasu1213;633378]There had been the s a me rash of violence in Chicago and other major cities this past weekend. It's not just a Detroit Greektown issue. It's an America issue. When protesters were burning and looting across the country after the death of George Floyd in 2020 Detroit was one of very few major cities that were able to prevent the burning and looting from occurring here. A few looters wannabeees were probably disappointed that they didn't get a free pair of Nikes ir Steph Curry sneakers from Under Armour that they had their sites on. I am beginning to wonder if there was orchestrated plans for young people just to cause chaos in the downtown areas of cities across the country. Ten years ago there were Flash Mobs wreaking havoc in cities across the country almost simultaneously[/Q

True enough crime is global, however, the question is "Can Greektown Be Saved?"

[Zacha341]

^ Probably not, so long as the narrative/ justification of privilege and entitlement continues to be pushed, here as it is elsewhere.

Thankfully, we've not gone full-out releasing tons of lawbreakers ultra fast - totally looking the other way at 'approved' crime and theft.

[stasu1213]

[QUOTE=Former_Detroiter;633380]

There had been the s a me rash of violence in Chicago and other major cities this past weekend. It's not just a Detroit Greektown issue. It's an America issue. When protesters were burning and looting across the country after the death of George Floyd in 2020 Detroit was one of very few major cities that were able to prevent the burning and looting from occurring here. A few looters wannabeees were probably disappointed that they didn't get a free pair of Nikes ir Steph Curry sneakers from Under Armour that they had their sites on. I am beginning to wonder if there was orchestrated plans for young people just to cause chaos in the downtown areas of cities across the country. Ten years ago there were Flash Mobs wreaking havoc in cities across the country almost simultaneously[/Q

True enough crime is global, however, the question is "Can Greektown Be Saved?"

The question should be Why are the unruly crowd gather at Greektown and no other parts of downtown or midtown? Not that I am encouraging them to. The activists would protest if police show a heavy handed approach to stopping the crime that occurred in Greektown. However, at the same time young people had been running a muck at that spot. Yes it can be saved by returning it back to being a Greektown with Greek restaurants and venues and not changing it into a hipster town with venues that attract the wild. Greektown and the Riverwalk are the two most tourist attracted utilized areas downtown with the acception of Campus Martuis. Some would blame Buffalo Wild Wings and not blame the other restaurants and bars in the same area. Some would blame the lack of jobs and rec centers for the youths to keep them off the streets. There is an outdoor skating rink and basketball courts at Campus Martius for the young people to enjoy themselves. It is sad that these young thugs set out to cause havoc downtown while the rest of the city have isolated incidents of violent crimes.

[softailrider]

Is Greektown going to return to the family friendly area that it once was in the 60's and 70's? Probably not. I didn't think it was particularly safe walking around there starting around the mid-80's. Or, maybe it started to feel unsafe around mid-90's or so. I don't remember, It's been a while. Well before the casino came in.

[stasu1213]

[QUOTE=Former_Detroiter;633380]

There had been the s a me rash of violence in Chicago and other major cities this past weekend. It's not just a Detroit Greektown issue. It's an America issue. When protesters were burning and looting across the country after the death of George Floyd in 2020 Detroit was one of very few major cities that were able to prevent the burning and looting from occurring here. A few looters wannabeees were probably disappointed that they didn't get a free pair of Nikes ir Steph Curry sneakers from Under Armour that they had their sites on. I am beginning to wonder if there was orchestrated plans for young people just to cause chaos in the downtown areas of cities across the country. Ten years ago there were Flash Mobs wreaking havoc in cities across the country almost simultaneously[/Q

True enough crime is global, however, the question is "Can Greektown Be Saved?"

Greektown can be saved by getting rid of businesses that attract the younger crowd or shutting down businesses in the downtown area around 7pm. Have events such as the outdoor skating rink and basketball courts somewhere in the city but out of the downtown area. Return Greektown to the way it was 50 plus years ago. The young people and trouble makers would get bored and find some other place to hang out

[EGrant]

The city of Detroit is not going to tell businesses to leave or shut them down at 7PM.

[canuck]

Wasn’t there a character in Homer’s Odyssey [[not the Honda) that was named "Robocop"?


I wonder what Plato would have thought of the distressed youth of today.
I mean it’s not their fault they were fed a steady diet of N…...s and B……s in their lyrical glossary. It started a generation ago, at least, and we the boomers contributed largely to that demise.

[K-slice]

[QUOTE=stasu1213;633382]

Yes it can be saved by returning it back to being a Greektown with Greek restaurants and venues and not changing it into a hipster town with venues that attract the wild.

It's not the hipsters out there causing issues lol. Glocks don't accessorize well with flannel shirts, giant beards, and expensive coffee.

[ABetterDetroit]

Greektown can be saved by getting rid of businesses that attract the younger crowd or shutting down businesses in the downtown area around 7pm. Have events such as the outdoor skating rink and basketball courts somewhere in the city but out of the downtown area. Return Greektown to the way it was 50 plus years ago. The young people and trouble makers would get bored and find some other place to hang out

Well, It is a proposed solution. End capitalism in Greektown and have government create something else. Always fails spectacularly but a proposed solution nevertheless.

[softailrider]

You just can't go there on a Friday or Saturday after dark with your wife, girlfriend, S.O. or kids. It's too rowdy. Used to be able go there anytime day or night. It was one of the safest areas of the city. The mantra used to be the shop owners and restaurant workers kept it that way, but that was a while ago.

[Danny]

The city of Detroit is not going to tell businesses to leave or shut them down at 7PM.

However the City of Detroit is going to tell those riff-raff kids to go home before 7PM or else either your child or the parent[[s) will go to jail. They still have school tomorrow and truancy is not an option.

[Atticus]

One of the best things they could do is close Monroe St to all vehicular traffic between Brush & St Antoine.

Yes, the issue is primarily young folk causing trouble. But closing off those two blocks to vehicles means no cruising and kids showing off their car. It forces them to pay to park and somewhere, and walk in. That extra level of effort might be enough to shrink “the party” some, which in turn makes the area less enticing to those who want to create trouble.

[stasu1213]

Well, It is a proposed solution. End capitalism in Greektown and have government create something else. Always fails spectacularly but a proposed solution nevertheless.

Not ending capitalism but returning Greektown back to its original Greek destination saving one or two pubs that were there for number of years.

[stasu1213]

Chicago experienced a "Teen takeover" weekend last weekend. Detroit intelligence probably had gotten wind of it and to the best of the police ability stopped it before it really gotten out of hand here. Notice the two places that chaos had happened last weekend. Greektown and The Riverwalk. Two places where people of all races, beliefs, and cultures had congregated to enjoy the warm temperatures. Chicago had stopped anyone under a certain age from entering an area without adults with them. The teens tried crashing the events also causing trouble in the rest of downtown.
What can be done to minimize crime in Greektown? Increase Intel and police presence in the area. The next time the Illitches, Gilbert, or any billionaire want tax breaks to build something council should negotiate that the billionaires give more money to hire police and have the rookies walking the beat downtown and the most experienced cops could patrol the neighborhoods with a few rookies in cars with them

[royce]

Could you describe who specifically is causing it the problem? Any common denominators in your experience?

I used to be there 1-2 x weekly in the late 80's, early 90's. And there were fights then. Leaving the Old Shillelagh we'd sometimes have to fight our way to the car.

I only go down there for business now, and never after 3, so I don't have any idea who's causing the trouble.

It's the young people 15-30 hanging out after 10 pm. Rarely is there an incident that takes place in Greektown before 10 pm. The young folks hang out in Greektown because they are familiar with it. So they gather where they can be seen, are comfortable, and where it's not expensive to get something to eat. That's Greektown.

I pointed out earlier in this thread that Buffalo Wild Wings is the focal point. Five Guys, which reopened a few months ago is the other. There is a third place but it's not on Monroe but is considered a part of Greektown and that's the basement restaurant on Brush, south of Lafayette, that has the video games. These places are where they hang out.

The big change is that the violence has escalated from fist fights to gun fights. A few years back in Greektown there were a number of incidents where multiple black males were jumping on one or two black males. Now it's escalated to gun fights.

What's new too is "social media." With social media being a big influence on young people, the word gets out that everyone is going to be at a certain place at a certain time. Someone reads that and says, "Hey, I've got a beef with so and so and they might be down there. I better bring my gun."

As I wrote earlier in this thread, I still go to Greektown, but I go early. I might stay until 9 pm, but after that I'm going home or to another part of downtown. The part where the youth don't hang out. Follow my advice and you'll be fine.

BTW, does anyone know specifically what happened on the RiverWalk? I either heard there were five people shot or there were five shootings last weekend. The local media has been focusing on the security guard shooting in Greektown. I haven't heard of any details in the other shootings. If you have a link I would appreciate it. Thanks.

[stasu1213]

It's the young people 15-30 hanging out after 10 pm. Rarely is there an incident that takes place in Greektown before 10 pm. The young folks hang out in Greektown because they are familiar with it. So they gather where they can be seen, are comfortable, and where it's not expensive to get something to eat. That's Greektown.

I pointed out earlier in this thread that Buffalo Wild Wings is the focal point. Five Guys, which reopened a few months ago is the other. There is a third place but it's not on Monroe but is considered a part of Greektown and that's the basement restaurant on Brush, south of Lafayette, that has the video games. These places are where they hang out.

The big change is that the violence has escalated from fist fights to gun fights. A few years back in Greektown there were a number of incidents where multiple black males were jumping on one or two black males. Now it's escalated to gun fights.

What's new too is "social media." With social media being a big influence on young people, the word gets out that everyone is going to be at a certain place at a certain time. Someone reads that and says, "Hey, I've got a beef with so and so and they might be down there. I better bring my gun."

As I wrote earlier in this thread, I still go to Greektown, but I go early. I might stay until 9 pm, but after that I'm going home or to another part of downtown. The part where the youth don't hang out. Follow my advice and you'll be fine.

BTW, does anyone know specifically what happened on the RiverWalk? I either heard there were five people shot or there were five shootings last weekend. The local media has been focusing on the security guard shooting in Greektown. I haven't heard of any details in the other shootings. If you have a link I would appreciate it. Thanks.

I don't think that the two national chain restaurants [[Buffalo Wild Wing , Five Guys) are the only two places that these reens meet the start chaos. They also meet at Midway and the burger place next to Buffalo Wild Wings. Let's not start a movement to close national chain restaurants blaming them for the trouble in Greektown