Fisher Body Plant 21 renovation plan announced

[stasu1213]

I don't have confidence in the renovation of the Fisher 21 project. I would not be surprised if the developers pull out.

[gratiotfaced]

Well work has already started, and the developers just won a gap financing grant that only gets awarded to projects close to being fully funded. The developers say they have "99%" of the financing in order already.

https://www.freep.com/story/money/bu...g/72173567007/

Anything can happen and I understand the skepticism here, but so far everything looks and sounds pretty good.

[stasu1213]

Well work has already started, and the developers just won a gap financing grant that only gets awarded to projects close to being fully funded. The developers say they have "99%" of the financing in order already.

https://www.freep.com/story/money/bu...g/72173567007/

Anything can happen and I understand the skepticism here, but so far everything looks and sounds pretty good.

I am thinking of tge firmer Packard Plant. How many developers had plans for it that fell through?

[Henry Whalley]

I don't have confidence in the renovation of the Fisher 21 project. I would not be surprised if the developers pull out.

I wouldn't be surprised if it's a Superfund Cleanup candidate, too.

[gratiotfaced]

I am thinking of tge firmer Packard Plant.

They're both historic automotive plants, so I understand why you'd think that, but that's where the similarities end.

Packard Plant never had a development progress to CBO meetings, never secured enough financing to win a gap grant, never started site prep and demolition work, and was located miles away from any other revitalization project. Heck, I don't think they even bothered to hire architects or put out renderings, which is kind of the bare minimum to launch a development.

[softailrider]

The first time I heard about this, I didn't think it was ever going to get completed, I still feel the same way. It just seems too ambitious of a project.

[KnnNike]

The first time I heard about this, I didn't think it was ever going to get completed, I still feel the same way. It just seems too ambitious of a project.

Any particular reason why, or are you just generally down on development in Detroit?

As has already been thoroughly explained, the developers have all the financing in place. Unless we see another COVID pandemic and another 50% jump in materials cost, this project is happening.

[Hypestyles]

looks better than it did. I hope the momentum continues.

[softailrider]

Any particular reason why, or are you just generally down on development in Detroit?

As has already been thoroughly explained, the developers have all the financing in place. Unless we see another COVID pandemic and another 50% jump in materials cost, this project is happening.

Just because this project is "happening" sure doesn't mean it's going to happen to completion. After all the water goes under the bridge, let's remember to talk.

[stasu1213]

Just because this project is "happening" sure doesn't mean it's going to happen to completion. After all the water goes under the bridge, let's remember to talk.

I agree. This developers have to to deal with environmental hurdles to jump over in the first two phases of this development being that it is a former plant. It is going to take much longer to develop this site than it had taken Ford the renovate the train station

[gratiotfaced]

The environmental hurdles were already factored into the cost of the project, and the developers got the cleanup costs covered by tax breaks.

https://www.bridgedetroit.com/detroi...er-body-plant/

The EPA also cleared the site for residential development.

[Burnsie]

I agree. This developers have to to deal with environmental hurdles to jump over in the first two phases of this development being that it is a former plant. It is going to take much longer to develop this site than it had taken Ford the renovate the train station

Not really, since Ford bought the station in June 2018, and it will open in June 2024, 6 years.

[Richard]

I am thinking of tge firmer Packard Plant. How many developers had plans for it that fell through?

You cannot really base it on Packard plant,it was never really a developable project as it stood because of title issues and the cities vow to never allow it to be developed.

[KnnNike]

I agree. This developers have to to deal with environmental hurdles to jump over in the first two phases of this development being that it is a former plant. It is going to take much longer to develop this site than it had taken Ford the renovate the train station

Highly doubtful. For one, it's not a massively larger property than MCS. But more importantly, MCS was about using artisanal methods to restore an architectural gem, spare no expense. Like, literally months spent on restoring/recreating individual plaster medallions, moldings, etc. Not to mention pumping all the water out of the basement and subbasement.

Fisher 21 has none of that. Once you clear out all the junk - which is largely done - then it's just a matter of stabilizing a few parts of the structure, and it's a straightforward loft conversion. Like the thousands that have been done in NYC, Chicago, etc. There are no architecturally significant details to painstakingly restore.

[Lowell]

Just because this project is "happening" sure doesn't mean it's going to happen to completion. After all the water goes under the bridge, let's remember to talk.

Old timers on this forum are familiar with "Skipper's Rule" that runs, "No Detroit project is truly completed until it has tenants". That from the days when we were continually snake-bitten by grand plans that went nowhere, ala Lee Plaza, ala Packard Plant. So healthy skepticism is understandable.

[stasu1213]

Highly doubtful. For one, it's not a massively larger property than MCS. But more importantly, MCS was about using artisanal methods to restore an architectural gem, spare no expense. Like, literally months spent on restoring/recreating individual plaster medallions, moldings, etc. Not to mention pumping all the water out of the basement and subbasement.

Fisher 21 has none of that. Once you clear out all the junk - which is largely done - then it's just a matter of stabilizing a few parts of the structure, and it's a straightforward loft conversion. Like the thousands that have been done in NYC, Chicago, etc. There are no architecturally significant details to painstakingly restore.

The Fisher Plant is probably unlike the building's being renovated in Chicago and New York. This is a former factory that probably has hazardous chemicals still underneath the foundation of it put there while the chassis were being assembled there. The renovation of this building will take more than window dressing. Do the developers have the financing for that task? Many former factories were renovated to be stores, Art Galleries, etc. Not to be places of residencies.

[stasu1213]

Not really, since Ford bought the station in June 2018, and it will open in June 2024, 6 years.

The train station wasn't a former automobile factory where hazardous materials could be poured underneath the ground.

[gratiotfaced]

The Fisher Plant is probably unlike the building's being renovated in Chicago and New York. This is a former factory that probably has hazardous chemicals still underneath the foundation of it put there while the chassis were being assembled there. The renovation of this building will take more than window dressing. Do the developers have the financing for that task? Many former factories were renovated to be stores, Art Galleries, etc. Not to be places of residencies.

It would be helpful if you read the articles I provided earlier. The developers did an environmental assessment, and the $31M in estimated remediation costs were covered by the city via tax breaks. Developers also said they had 99% of the financing package together, which is why they won a gap grant.

[softailrider]

Highly doubtful. For one, it's not a massively larger property than MCS. But more importantly, MCS was about using artisanal methods to restore an architectural gem, spare no expense. Like, literally months spent on restoring/recreating individual plaster medallions, moldings, etc. Not to mention pumping all the water out of the basement and subbasement.

Fisher 21 has none of that. Once you clear out all the junk - which is largely done - then it's just a matter of stabilizing a few parts of the structure, and it's a straightforward loft conversion. Like the thousands that have been done in NYC, Chicago, etc. There are no architecturally significant details to painstakingly restore.

The train station project had Ford Motor Company money and brains behind it. There was never a question it was going to get completed.

[stasu1213]

It would be helpful if you read the articles I provided earlier. The developers did an environmental assessment, and the $31M in estimated remediation costs were covered by the city via tax breaks. Developers also said they had 99% of the financing package together, which is why they won a gap grant.

Getting funding together and actually cleaning up environmental waste on the site are different

[Richard]

The train station project had Ford Motor Company money and brains behind it. There was never a question it was going to get completed.

As long as itÂ’s not a vehicle they should be okay

I wonder if they are going to rent out space to those extended warranty guys,it would be convenient.

[Gistok]

I wonder if they are going to rent out space to those extended warranty guys, it would be convenient.

They could buy up the 5 story CPA Building across Michigan Ave for those folks...

[Zacha341]

Yes, 'location-location' as the statement goes!

AMC and Lee Plaza buildings too far away from other relevant development. Same can be said/ argued about Packard.

I'd imagine that the close-to-Midtown location had a lot to do with the selection. Easier to get investors' money if you're closer to a "happening" location.

[Zacha341]

Good points. Hope this goes thru!

Packard Plant never had a development progress to CBO meetings, never secured enough financing to win a gap grant, never started site prep and demolition work, and was located miles away from any other revitalization project. Heck, I don't think they even bothered to hire architects or put out renderings, which is kind of the bare minimum to launch a development.

[Zacha341]

Yes, that factor does seem to emerge doesn't it? I sure hope this project goes forth. For real!

Old timers on this forum are familiar with "Skipper's Rule" that runs, "No Detroit project is truly completed until it has tenants". That from the days when we were continually snake-bitten by grand plans that went nowhere, ala Lee Plaza, ala Packard Plant. So healthy skepticism is understandable.