Voter Fraud in Detroit?

[bust]

this shifts the burden of proof from Trump to Detroit election officials, who should be proving that their handling of the election was 100% clean.

In other words, you think Detroit is guilty unless they prove themselves innocent. Because Kwame.
Haven't certain people borne that unjust burden for far too long? You know the ones. A lot live in Detroit.

[Wesley Mouch]

In other words, you think Detroit is guilty unless they prove themselves innocent. Because Kwame.
Haven't certain people borne that unjust burden for far too long? You know the ones. A lot live in Detroit.

No.

I've no interest in establishing guilt. I think our only concern here should be elections that are beyond reproach. And that requires the powers that we in Detroit [[Dems) to make a positive case that this was done 100% right -- not a negative case like 'you have no evidence of widespread fraud'.

Because Kwame is really relevant. He was an Irish politician [[Kilpatrick after all)... think MacNamara or Dailey. He was CONVICTED of mail fraud. His wikipedia page lists more crimes than Al Capone. YES, that he was recently elected Mayor makes transparency all the more important.

But we aren't getting transparency. We're getting 'move along, nothing to see here', and 'but you aren't clean either'.

btw, I see some Republicans who don't seem so interested in chasing vote fraud. And I suspect everyone is pretty dirty. This isn't about winners and losers in the moment. Biden should be elected by the EC. And we should not stop investigating fraud until we have a system that everyone agrees is bullet-proof.

[bust]

Sorry dude, it doesn't work that way.
We live in the United States of America.

[Richard]

Its a red flag when certain media sources makes a declaration of a winner before the completion and certification of an election while declaring,no fraud move along.

What is even more interesting is the exact same issues that are being brought up were well known during the primaries,but some cities choose not to address them before the election,if they had this would have never been an issue.

So if they took the stance of,we know there is going to be a level of fraud but it will be acceptable because it will not change the outcome then we are admitting that all votes that do not matter.

A group in Detroit is suing the Trump administration for practicing it’s right to contest,the same right that every politician in the country has at every level.

That is where we are at,I want my rights protected and you can only practice yours if I agree with it.

Where was all this outrage when everybody knew full well there was issues during the primaries but did nothing to fix them,or was it felt that they could use those issues to their benefit or exploit them.

Why get mad about disenfranchised voting when some are doing everything in their power to make sure it remains a part of the system?

[JonWylie]

Its a red flag when certain media sources makes a declaration of a winner before the completion and certification of an election while declaring,no fraud move along.

So every election?

[Richard]

So every election?

Yes,because the exact same process,outside of the electoral vote with the presidential aspect,is used every time we vote.

If we never question and take everything we are told at face value,we do not deserve the rights we have.

So the argument could be made that we did not go through this with the results of the 2016 election,maybe not at the start but we did spend four years and millions of dollars trying to overturn the results,and further devide the country.

So which is the better way,get it done and over with or spend another 4 years of drama and millions of dollars.

As it stands now,the taxpayer has not been paying for checking the process,but they sure covered the cost over the last four years.

The left had 4 years of having their day in court,they were able to do that because they had that right,no matter how silly and pointless some thought it was.

Lets be honest history proves to us that one way some gain power they will test it to the limits and even abuse it,we the people are that stopgap to keep them in check.

It does not matter if I prefer one candidate over the other,our first duty as citizens is protecting the system that was laid out for us and offers us those same protections.

When we start choosing what protections we have a personal interest in to protect then we are all screwed right along with the rest of the country.

Of course there are some out their whose only goal in life is to remove those rights and their voice will always be vocal.

Anybody that says if Trump had been declared a winner at the night of the election without certification results,cities would not be burning today would be lying to themselves, so there is incentive in the interest of the country to move along.

As much as we like to,it would be a bigger disservice to the country as a whole to just ignore the process.

But gut instinct also tells me if people think the next 4 years is going to be all of the sudden we are singing kumbyya and all of the sudden there will be peace and tranquillity across the land?

That bridge is not even in the planning stage yet,only the faces will change.

[Pat001]

People under age 35 are probably too young to remember that twenty years ago in the 2000 election, Al Gore did not concede to George W. bush for 36 days - until December 13.

[Zacha341]

^^^ Yep. Long forgotten...

[drjeff]

People under age 35 are probably too young to remember that twenty years ago in the 2000 election, Al Gore did not concede to George W. bush for 36 days - until December 13.

Until Florida was decided nobody had 270 electoral votes in 2000. There was nothing to concede. Biden has 306 electoral votes and this election was not close. 2016 was far, far closer and you didn't have Clinton acting like a little bitch about losing. She conceded right away and the transition began immediately.

[Richard]

But yet she did not have a problem with telling Biden he should never concede,so I guess one needs to consider the source when using that as an example.

But that goes back to,do as I say and not as I do.

[Pat001]

Until Florida was decided nobody had 270 electoral votes in 2000. There was nothing to concede. Biden has 306 electoral votes and this election was not close. 2016 was far, far closer and you didn't have Clinton acting like a little bitch about losing. She conceded right away and the transition began immediately.

After Hillary lost, she hatched the Russian collusion hoax which Robert Mueller investigated for two years and found nothing. That makes her a major bitch.

[JonWylie]

After Hillary lost, she hatched the Russian collusion hoax which Robert Mueller investigated for two years and found nothing. That makes her a major bitch.

wow that's not an accurate recount of history at all. Also, try to stay on topic with regards to the claims of fraudulent voting by Americans and large scale fraud to the tune of tens of thousands of votes.

[Wesley Mouch]

wow that's not an accurate recount of history at all. Also, try to stay on topic with regards to the claims of fraudulent voting by Americans and large scale fraud to the tune of tens of thousands of votes.

Certainly the Russia Hoax is off-topic, mostly. But you don't still believe that one, do you? We are all being misled by the Facebook, Twitter, Google, NYT, WaPo mob on Russia it seems, which is clearly a baseless hoax if there ever was one.

But more on topic, if something fishy happened in this election, its gonna be in how mail-in ballots were handled, and mostly in Detroit, Milwaukee, Atlanta, and Philadelphia [[but not Cleveland it seems).

I'm still waiting to hear anyone defend Detroit's election with facts and not bluster.

[Dumpling]

This is an ancient thread started right after the 2016 election
when Jill Stein and the Green Party requested and paid for
a recount:

https://www.detroityes.com/mb/showth...g-in-the-Green

I did make a small donation for that effort as noted in that thread.

Many of the links to sources don't work now, four years later. But
one does [[from my post #29):

https://www.politicususa.com/2012/04...detroit-2.html

It lays out how, during Mayor Bing's tenure, with the specter
of Emergency Management around the corner, funds were
cut deeply for the City of Detroit's 2012 Presidential Election.
Temporary workers replaced longtime department employees.

Of course, any article referencing "gubernatorial puppets" is
slanted. But think about that budget cut for a moment. It's
as though the day after you were admitted to the hospital for
heart surgery, your skilled care team came to you and said that
the hospital administration has decided to replace them with
medical students and nurse's aides because they could be
paid half as much.

The ball is in your court now, to defend defunding, or to defend
the slow rebuilding of the the Department of Elections, which
still heavily relies on temporary workers. The funds allocated
to the Department of Elections have gone up in recent years.

[Maof]

Michigan certifies Biden's win.....as they should.

https://apnews.com/article/michigan-...f9be449c6fe31d

[JonWylie]

Certainly the Russia Hoax is off-topic, mostly. But you don't still believe that one, do you? We are all being misled by the Facebook, Twitter, Google, NYT, WaPo mob on Russia it seems, which is clearly a baseless hoax if there ever was one.

But more on topic, if something fishy happened in this election, its gonna be in how mail-in ballots were handled, and mostly in Detroit, Milwaukee, Atlanta, and Philadelphia [[but not Cleveland it seems).

I'm still waiting to hear anyone defend Detroit's election with facts and not bluster.

Until someone proves fraud, it's not on anyone to defend Detroit's election.

[DetroiterOnTheWestCoast]

Michigan certifies Biden's win.....as they should.

https://apnews.com/article/michigan-...f9be449c6fe31d

Finally. I’m tired of Michigan being in the news for fascist militias and now the let’s-destroy-our-democracy GOP. It’s truly sad how far we’ve been dragged down towards a Banana Republic. And not the store. Bigly Sad what happened to the GOP, of which I was once a member.

[Wesley Mouch]

Until someone proves fraud, it's not on anyone to defend Detroit's election.

I expect and believe better of Detroit's Election staff. And I believe its necessary for Detroit to defend their handling of the election.

Detroit has a choice. Stonewall and cowardly scream there's no proof... or ... take a brave stand an open yourself up and explain why you're confident in these results.

One choice will build trust. The other tears down.

[Gistok]

On CNN this morning....

"The world was waiting on Lansing. Biden's new diplomats can start their tenure next year by explaining to the world scene of American democracy live-streamed from Michigan's capital on Monday -- a normally technical state government meeting strangely give huge national importance. technical state government meeting strangely given huge national importance."

[EastsideAl]

Haven't certain people borne that unjust burden for far too long? You know the ones. A lot live in Detroit.

And Philadelphia, Atlanta, the north side of Milwaukee, etc. The Republicans' playbook of spreading factually unsupported accusations and baseless insinuations about these places and the people who live and vote there is destructive and disgusting.

[EastsideAl]

Michigan certifies Biden's win.....as they should.

https://apnews.com/article/michigan-...f9be449c6fe31d

Good. Time for them to shut up and move on and give this ridiculous topic a rest now.

[Zacha341]

^^^ Yep! Forward and onward to see what the new admin has in mind socially, politically, and fiscally. I'll be watching and judging that no less.

[Wesley Mouch]

And Philadelphia, Atlanta, the north side of Milwaukee, etc. The Republicans' playbook of spreading factually unsupported accusations and baseless insinuations about these places and the people who live and vote there is destructive and disgusting.

The accusations certainly aren't 'baseless'. They may be wrong, but they aren't baseless.

I see different things destructive and disgusting.

-Late counting of ballots after it was clear Trump was ahead.
-Widespread unsolicited mail-in voting
-Documented attempts to prevent election monitoring
-Social media interference in the election for one side
-Disappearing of any negative stories about Biden and vote fraud

I guess I should go softer on you. You probably just aren't seeing the same things I am due to the disgusting and destructive media that tilts your way.

We are all being played here by the elites. And they won. A real establishment candidate won over a radical outsiders. And the left celebrates, not knowing that they've been fooled by some slick Washington insiders who will not be tossing much meat to the real progressives. Biden's cabinet picks speak volumes.

[Henry Whalley]

Biden's cabinet picks speak volumes.

On this Thanksgiving I'm grateful that 75 million voters chose competent government over ideology and reality-show divisiveness.

Hopefully, Georgia will choose two more of the same in January.

[oladub]

On this Thanksgiving I'm grateful that 75 million voters chose competent government over ideology and reality-show divisiveness.

Hopefully, Georgia will choose two more of the same in January.

Based on Biden's comments and cabinet picks, we already know enough to realize that Biden voters, intentionally or otherwise, voted for a corporatist regime bent on replacing American workers with cheaper foreign labor at home and maybe abroad. That will probably be the most important result for Detroit residents based on dubious election results.