Is Downtown at Risk of Going Backwards?

[renf]

Are there any rumors of a delay in the building of a new campus for U of
M at the site of the failed jail? The finances of higher education may be
unended by the continuing decline in the number of college age individuals and the pandemic which may popularize on line education.

[Satiricalivory]

Nope, no delays yet. If you read the Freep article in the Monroe Block thread they reached out to Related about the UofM campus and they confirmed that it is still planned to break ground in 2021.

Additionally, the planned $300 million University of Michigan "Innovation Center" along Gratiot, at the former site of the "failed" Wayne County jail project, remains on pace for construction start in 2021, according to a spokesman for its lead developer The Related Cos.

https://www.freep.com/story/money/business/2020/08/22/detroit-office-market-covid-gilbert-buildings/3385465001/

[Lowell]

I see the biggest threat to downtowns' declining being the pandemic-driven work-at-home movement. Companies have discovered the productivity is slightly higher, workers have discovered that costs, lost time and hassles of commuting and dressing up are lower.

Yes, I know there are drawbacks to each but I think every company has to be looking at their commercial office space expense line and thinking, hmm, maybe we don't need to keep paying this. The commercial real estate market is currently in a state of panic as a result.

I don't think this is as much a threat to downtown Detroit as a lot of its recent growth has been residential. There is still huge demand to live amid the action of big league sports, cultural and entertainment venues, casinos [for better or worse], the river, urban life, etc. Some of that demand is likely to soften as downtown workers now working at home, and who may have thought about moving down, may have second thoughts.

But is the big in-person worksite model going continue after we're all vaccinated and hugging again, or not?

[JonWylie]

I see the biggest threat to downtowns' declining being the pandemic-driven work-at-home movement. Companies have discovered the productivity is slightly higher, workers have discovered that costs, lost time and hassles of commuting and dressing up are lower.

Yes, I know there are drawbacks to each but I think every company has to be looking at their commercial office space expense line and thinking, hmm, maybe we don't need to keep paying this. The commercial real estate market is currently in a state of panic as a result.

I don't think this is as much a threat to downtown Detroit as a lot of its recent growth has been residential. There is still huge demand to live amid the action of big league sports, cultural and entertainment venues, casinos [for better or worse], the river, urban life, etc. Some of that demand is likely to soften as downtown workers now working at home, and who may have thought about moving down, may have second thoughts.

But is the big in-person worksite model going continue after we're all vaccinated and hugging again, or not?

I would really need to see a source for the claim that Companies have seen an increase in productivity because everything I hear from people in various fields is that their ability to work effectively has been hampered by full time WFH.

[DeLemur]

I would really need to see a source for the claim that Companies have seen an increase in productivity because everything I hear from people in various fields is that their ability to work effectively has been hampered by full time WFH.

Was thinking the same thing. Anecdotal evidence seems to be the opposite. If so, it would help a back to office effort. I can't imagine universal remote work is here to stay. But what do I know? Heard there are people with jet packs flying at 3K feet now. Didn't expect that.

[EGrant]

I would really need to see a source for the claim that Companies have seen an increase in productivity because everything I hear from people in various fields is that their ability to work effectively has been hampered by full time WFH.

It's not just productivity, but the mental toll that working in isolation, only communicating via screens can take on people. I can foresee companies being more open to flexible WFH schedules, like 3 days in the office and 2 at home, but I am not convinced that offices are dead.

[Seven&wyo]

It's not just productivity, but the mental toll that working in isolation, only communicating via screens can take on people. I can foresee companies being more open to flexible WFH schedules, like 3 days in the office and 2 at home, but I am not convinced that offices are dead.

Also, for me, I absolutely hate zoom meetings.

[Sehv313]

As someone who frequents downtown Detroit on the weekends and stays until after dark, I want to see if anyone else has felt substantially less safe this summer than at any point in the recent past.

It's actually a lot safer than it use to be in 2005-2009, I remember police would wait and stay put until murders happen and then come investigate after, in the heart of Downtown! But for long as I can remember the weekends after 11PM have always been dangerous. It's a lot safer than last few decades.

[Sehv313]

Look, I'm a huge Detroit lover - but anybody that doesn't realize Detroit is going to be be hurt by everything going on is ignorant.

As a lifelong inner-city Detroiter, you can call me ignorant. Rowdy Detroit weekends can never compare to the destruction the Mortgage Companies and Banks have already done to our city's financial state and public school educational resources.

[DeLemur]

As a lifelong inner-city Detroiter, you can call me ignorant. Rowdy Detroit weekends can never compare to the destruction the Mortgage Companies and Banks have already done to our city's financial state and public school educational resources.

Woa that's a loaded comment! Neighborhood death is not part of this discussion Downtown is way safer. I remember back in 02' almost getting robbed on the way to the bar and the bouncer just laughed at my story. Couldn't of cared less. Now there is all sorts of Bedrock security, all sorts of cameras [[no thanks), and a clean environment and infastructure downtown. Can't say any of that increased safety is due to Police presence, but the horses they trot out are nice.

Hopefully people know when to separate loud partying with dangerous [[driving vehicles on sidewalks or fighting) behavior. There is a big difference.

[Zacha341]

Hola DL, not sure what you mean about the air flight comment. I am working heavily remote now - will I be boarding an aircraft soon?

Heard there are people with jet packs flying at 3K feet now.

[DeLemur]

Hola DL, not sure what you mean about the air flight comment. I am working heavily remote now - will I be boarding an aircraft soon?

Oh I was just being humble about what I know and don't by giving an example of something I learned yesterday that shocked me. Apparently jet packs are now a thing and in Nevada multiple pilots saw a guy in one near the airport. The report said they are growing in use. Was on ABC news.

[MrChrome]

It's actually a lot safer than it use to be in 2005-2009, I remember police would wait and stay put until murders happen and then come investigate after, in the heart of Downtown! But for long as I can remember the weekends after 11PM have always been dangerous. It's a lot safer than last few decades.

Thanks for this perspective. I'd forgotten about how much better it's gotten over the past 8-9 years.

[KnnNike]

Hola DL, not sure what you mean about the air flight comment. I am working heavily remote now - will I be boarding an aircraft soon?

https://www.foxla.com/news/fbi-inves...-planes-at-lax

[Sehv313]

Woa that's a loaded comment! Neighborhood death is not part of this discussion Downtown is way safer.

Neighborhood death is somewhat a part of this discussion. The few Detroit residents who commit these shootings and crimes Downtown come from these neighborhoods that were effected by the city's lack of jobs, educational funding, and housing issues.

If I am Downtown and people from areas who I have problems with are downtown as well, things can get ugly very quickly.

Majority of the shooting victims/suspects Downtown over this past year alone were Detroit residents, I know because I live here.

[KnnNike]

Neighborhood death is somewhat a part of this discussion. The few Detroit residents who commit these shootings and crimes Downtown come from these neighborhoods that were effected by the city's lack of jobs, educational funding, and housing issues.

If I am Downtown and people from areas who I have problems with are downtown as well, things can get ugly very quickly.

Majority of the shooting victims/suspects Downtown over this past year alone were Detroit residents, I know because I live here.

It's an awfully broad statement in itself to say that downtown shootings are only committed by non-Downtown residents. This is likely the case in many situations, but it perpetuates an 'us vs. them' mentality that really needs to be resolved for long-term stability.

[Seven&wyo]

It's an awfully broad statement in itself to say that downtown shootings are only committed by non-Downtown residents. This is likely the case in many situations, but it perpetuates an 'us vs. them' mentality that really needs to be resolved for long-term stability.

Oh you really did just move here

[KnnNike]

Oh you really did just move here

I've been here for two years...how long do I need to be here to have my opinions matter?

[DeLemur]

I've been here for two years...how long do I need to be here to have my opinions matter?

Don't listen to him, your comment was very reasonable and its sentiment worthy of adherence for Detroit progress.

[Seven&wyo]

I've been here for two years...how long do I need to be here to have my opinions matter?

Oh no no I meant it as joke. When you said it "perpetuates an us vs. then mentality" I was under the impression that you had just moved here and that the us vs them is a constant talking point around here. As I'm sure it is other places, but Christ there's a lot here

[KnnNike]

Oh no no I meant it as joke. When you said it "perpetuates an us vs. then mentality" I was under the impression that you had just moved here and that the us vs them is a constant talking point around here. As I'm sure it is other places, but Christ there's a lot here

Got it...yeah, context on forums sucks.

I meant 'us' as in "downtown residents" vs 'them" as in "non-downtown residents", with the implication that the downtown residents are mostly newer, wealthier transplants.

I'm in the wealthier, new transplant, downtown group, and I try my hardest to be cognizant of my privilege. But, christ, one day last year I was riding a DDOT bus [[yes, I ride the bus), and an African American guy gets on an immediately starts telling me that white people like me are the reason this city is so divided. Like, I'm just trying to sit there and mind my own business, ya know.

So the frustration definitely boils over sometimes. But short of just not living here, it's just something you put up with.

[Seven&wyo]

Got it...yeah, context on forums sucks.

I meant 'us' as in "downtown residents" vs 'them" as in "non-downtown residents", with the implication that the downtown residents are mostly newer, wealthier transplants.

I'm in the wealthier, new transplant, downtown group, and I try my hardest to be cognizant of my privilege. But, christ, one day last year I was riding a DDOT bus [[yes, I ride the bus), and an African American guy gets on an immediately starts telling me that white people like me are the reason this city is so divided. Like, I'm just trying to sit there and mind my own business, ya know.

So the frustration definitely boils over sometimes. But short of just not living here, it's just something you put up with.

Oh yeah I've been there multiple times.

[Lowell]

Got it...yeah, context on forums sucks.

I meant 'us' as in "downtown residents" vs 'them" as in "non-downtown residents", with the implication that the downtown residents are mostly newer, wealthier transplants.

I'm in the wealthier, new transplant, downtown group, and I try my hardest to be cognizant of my privilege. But, christ, one day last year I was riding a DDOT bus [[yes, I ride the bus), and an African American guy gets on an immediately starts telling me that white people like me are the reason this city is so divided. Like, I'm just trying to sit there and mind my own business, ya know.

So the frustration definitely boils over sometimes. But short of just not living here, it's just something you put up with.

You have a great disposition, patience and ability to see the big picture. Detroit needs more people like you. So does America.

[Sehv313]

It's an awfully broad statement in itself to say that downtown shootings are only committed by non-Downtown residents.

Where did I say anything about non-Detroit residents? Did you read what I said or just skim through it?

[Wesley Mouch]

School of choice does not seem to me, like the way to solve the problems. Nobody is going to move to Detroit just to send their kids 10 miles away to a different high school. Regardless of the issues, the investment needs to be in the school system and in competent leaders and teachers.

An increase in funding will only ensure DPS does not hire competent leaders. Competent leaders might turn off the very successful patronage and corruption machines.