Is Downtown at Risk of Going Backwards?

**Danny** · January-14-21, 09:01 AM

The planned Campus Martius Building has been turned into a snotty drive-in movie theater.

**K-slice** · June-07-21, 08:54 AM

Reviving my thread from last year as we have a better view of the future now, however my feelings remain very mixed about the continued improvement of downtown, especially on the heels of a massive brawl in Greektown, where DPD Offers were assaulted for doing their jobs and breaking up a fight.
https://www.fox2detroit.com/news/det...reektown-brawl

I'm in the camp now where I avoid Greektown at almost all hours of the day and night, and I'm sure many others are as well. One of the areas deemed "safe to visit" for decades has become chaos.

Already this year I've seen cars packed with people hanging out every window, ATV's in the streets and on sidewalks, fights, and general disregard for civility from those walking the streets. This is all anecdotal but anyone with eyes is experiencing the same thing.

Will getting people downtown with a PURPOSE help push out those who are just there to loiter and cause trouble?

Will DPD be able to reign in those who have been emboldened to ignore their authority after the nationwide riots last summer?

Will people buy into the new Exchange development being so close to this mob scene? Orleans landing has been dealing with crime in the area for years now and according to the most recent news report it doesn't sound like things have improved.
https://www.clickondetroit.com/news/...reet-at-night/

Can we turn this around and keep downtown on the right track?

**Satiricalivory** · June-07-21, 09:10 AM

Oh god, not this alarmism stuff again. A few idiots in Greektown do not put this city off track, especially not with considering what has happened in other cities lately. Stop the concern trolling.

**Seven&wyo** · June-07-21, 09:12 AM

Originally Posted by K-slice

Reviving my thread from last year as we have a better view of the future now, however my feelings remain very mixed about the continued improvement of downtown, especially on the heels of a massive brawl in Greektown, where DPD Offers were assaulted for doing their jobs and breaking up a fight.
https://www.fox2detroit.com/news/det...reektown-brawl

I'm in the camp now where I avoid Greektown at almost all hours of the day and night, and I'm sure many others are as well. One of the areas deemed "safe to visit" for decades has become chaos.

Already this year I've seen cars packed with people hanging out every window, ATV's in the streets and on sidewalks, fights, and general disregard for civility from those walking the streets. This is all anecdotal but anyone with eyes is experiencing the same thing.

Will getting people downtown with a PURPOSE help push out those who are just there to loiter and cause trouble?

Will DPD be able to reign in those who have been emboldened to ignore their authority after the nationwide riots last summer?

Will people buy into the new Exchange development being so close to this mob scene? Orleans landing has been dealing with crime in the area for years now and according to the most recent news report it doesn't sound like things have improved.
https://www.clickondetroit.com/news/...reet-at-night/

Can we turn this around and keep downtown on the right track?

God this pointless thread again.
1. Greek town has been a shithole for awhile and I e avoided it for years. Not really out of fear I just think think it’s tacky as fuck
2. The ATV riders are annoying but that’s mostly in the neighborhoods, are a few going near downtown, sure, but once everyone comes back they’ll leave. They’re only there cause people don’t work down there right now.
3. Orleans landing mostly deals with speeders and I think the whole city is sick of those dumb fucks. I don’t know how to curb that.

I think downtown will be just fine I went down there a few days ago day and night and didn’t feel unsafe at all.

**Jason** · June-07-21, 02:27 PM

When Greektown was the "safe to visit" part of downtown it was basically the only "safe to visit" part. The handful of other attractions downtown you got in and got out. The financial district was fine but there was nothing for visitors to do. Capitol Park and Woodward were nothing but hulking abandoned buildings and sketchy loiterers, and most of the rest of downtown was just barren. When they did Campus Martius and the sports arenas the green zone got bigger but most of downtown was still better avoided. Nowadays everywhere downtown is fine and has good places to go to.

I think with Greektown what happened is that it was a family friendly restaurant oriented tourist attraction. But now that everywhere else downtown is nice too, that crowd is getting spread around, and so I think Greektown is transitioning to more of a nightlife niche, and so you're getting some of the problems that come with that.

If you went back in time and showed city leaders video footage of downtown from 2020, they'd break down crying at the improvement, and they wouldn't believe you that it actually looked worse than usual because there was a pandemic happening.

**Hypestyles** · June-07-21, 02:46 PM

part of what would help:
parking lot owners/managers being more vigorous in not allowing folks to just park and "hang out" and drink there.

**Satiricalivory** · June-07-21, 06:09 PM

Yeah Monroe is a nightlife street now like Bourbon street, and that's why you always get the riffraff over there as the sun goes down, I don't know why people are still acting surprised. It's still family friendly in the day though.

**K-slice** · June-07-21, 10:11 PM

You guys can downplay these as isolated incidents but only time will tell. This is the first weekend without early bar closings, the FIRST WEEKEND.

This wasn't two groups of people fighting each other, this is people openly attacking police officers. I remember getting in scraps when I was younger, but if the police were on the way we ran.

Hopefully this is worry for nothing, but this seems beyond the usual rowdy bar patrons. Don't forget it was only a few short months ago we were still in lockdown and there's no guarantee that people will come back if they can't feel safe.

**ABetterDetroit** · June-08-21, 09:22 AM

I am with you K-slice. Gun crimes are increasing in all cities across the country for the last couple years and Detroit doesn’t have the luxury of using that excuse like other places do. Hard work on the issue needs to be done and quickly. Detroit can not afford to be the poster child of violent urban crime like it used to in America. It is far to expensive. A disaster for human life and also terrible for business. One can be optimistic about the future but denying reality doesn’t solve very real problems.

**Satiricalivory** · June-08-21, 12:25 PM

Other cities have been a riot zone for a year. I think we're good.

Some of you are clearly divorced from reality though and just wanna troll. You wont even admit the basic fact that the opposite of "going backwards" has happened downtown since the start of this thread, this whole topic aged like milk. Instead it's the same concern trolling nonsense again and again. Can't you find something else to do with your day?? You're writing entire novels on nothing and cherry picking. Too expensive? LMFAO

Oh no! Susie TRIPPED on the sidewalk! Is this the end for downtown Detroit? What will be done about this???

**Satiricalivory** · June-08-21, 12:31 PM

Originally Posted by ABetterDetroit

One can be optimistic about the future but denying reality doesn’t solve very real problems.

One can be pointlessly negative but that doesn't stop the city from constantly making very real huge progress. If it's supposedly so bad for business and blah blah blah there wouldn't be a development boom happening despite a global pandemic.

**ABetterDetroit** · June-08-21, 08:53 PM

Originally Posted by Satiricalivory

Too expensive? LMFAO

Not happening to you so it’s just a joke Satirical? Not your problem so you just don’t give a shit for Detroiters stuck in some of the most violent neighborhoods in America while you go to the brewery of your choice a couple miles away and claim “Detroit is awesome”

Nothing funny about these cost estimates.
http://forcedetroit.org/wp-content/u...breakdowns.pdf

**Richard** · June-08-21, 10:48 PM

Originally Posted by K-slice

You guys can downplay these as isolated incidents but only time will tell. This is the first weekend without early bar closings, the FIRST WEEKEND.

This wasn't two groups of people fighting each other, this is people openly attacking police officers. I remember getting in scraps when I was younger, but if the police were on the way we ran.

Hopefully this is worry for nothing, but this seems beyond the usual rowdy bar patrons. Don't forget it was only a few short months ago we were still in lockdown and there's no guarantee that people will come back if they can't feel safe.

Its an understandable concern and a quality of life issue,one only has to see the stats of thousands currently fleeing cities after a summer of no accountability and violence.

What is interesting is the age group of those involved in the violence 12 to 23 year olds but even more interesting is a majority of crimes are being committed by a few.

Some examples,by me 3 teenagers died in a firey crash running from the police in a stolen SUV.The oldest was 18.

They were carjacking at gun point and using the stolen cars to rob stores and neighborhood burglary’s.

Between the 3 of them,160 arrests in the last 2 years each time they were released the same day because the judge felt it was not right to jail kids.

They are not stacking charges anymore,you can walk down the street and strong arm robbery even with a weapon 15 people in one night and they will prosecute it as 1 charge and not 15,so the penalty is nothing.

Not sure about Detroit but the city I am in the police are doing little to nothing,not by their wanting but simply because they do not want to catch a charge themselves.

You notice the difference,crowds are starting to hang out in front of the stores driving away businesses,they no longer pull over driving on suspended,large gatherings with certain groups have become retaliation warfare with automatic weapons,Miami has reverted back to the Wild West of the drug fueled 80s of running gun battles in the streets even on South Beach broad daylight.

You are seeing it in every city,it is real and it is happening,I think it is a valid point and I think people do need to discuss it and decide how they are going to deal with it before it gets out of hand and it will effect the city negatively.

It was mentioned that Detroit was not impacted like many others were in the last few years,the difference is those city leaders choose to give free reign and now are suffering the consequences.

You guys made that choice of not wanting to let it get out of hand and it worked for you, but in the future one needs to support the police and keep pressure on the judicial system to find that middle ground.

It does the police no good if somebody robs you while out on the town when they arrest them there is no accountability and they are released an hour later to do it all over again.

Complacency and settling for less is what drove the city into the ground in the past,I would be more worried about the city of somebody did not bring it up,because if they did not bring it up it would be because they did not care,when it gets to that point the violence does not matter,it will be a case of deal with it or move.

Proactive is forward thinking,the city needs more of that.

**bartocktoo** · June-09-21, 01:12 PM

There are so many more people on the streets all day and evening downtown. Not to mention the retail, the lighting, the CRANES, and most of all, the number of people just around. One of the biggest differences between downtown Detroit now versus in the early-mid 90s when it was a dead zone and outside of Club X, St. Andrew's, and a few other things, it seemed the only thing going was Comerica getting built and the Coney Islands. But...there used to be fights and shootings all the time. It wasn't often reported. Downtown is so much busier now, and there are a LOT more people just around. And most any violence gets formally or socially reported constantly. Relatively speaking, there hasn't been that much here. And hasn't been that much for a while. I'm speaking downtown, not the neighborhoods. This "worry" about people fighting in a place where a lot of people commence is honestly really stupid, and I question the veracity and motives of those who promulgate it.

**royce** · June-11-21, 11:06 PM

Someone had mentioned earlier about the number of people riding scooters on downtown sidewalks. Well, I have driven through downtown recently and to my surprise I have seen a number of kids riding these scooters. I have seen many kids that appear to be under ten. My question is how are they accessing these scooters? I thought you had to have a credit card to access these things. Also, I thought the age limit was 18 and over. What gives?