Welcome to the Reality of DEFUNDING Policing...

**Honky Tonk** · July-01-20, 01:19 PM

Originally Posted by aj3647

And? Is robbery unique to New York, or to this period in time? I'm genuinely curious what the point is of your cherry-picked example.

The bodies of two dead children were discovered buried on a property in rural Rexburg, Idaho. Their mother, Lori Vallow, and her husband Chad Daybell are suspected of their murder. Both are members of an apocalyptic Christian death cult and have been linked to numerous suspicious deaths over the preceding years.

https://www.ktvb.com/article/news/cr...7-85f62da8d3b9

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deaths...w#Chad_Daybell

Why are you calling my post a "cherry-picked example"?

**Zacha341** · July-01-20, 01:36 PM

^^^ Actually the attacks upon older populations have been reported here before and it's a growing problem! The usual politic is to distract one case towards another if one case mention shows a certain narrative not preferred.

Living in urban settings beyond the safety of keyboarded blogs, no one wants to be a mark [[to be preyed upon). And as the culture and civility devolve further people are increasingly desensitized to brutality against the older less capable.

Sounds corny, in eh' light of our progress, but a societies character is revealed in how its older citizens are treated.

I say take care if you must be out alone during these times. Crime is up, and no one may come to your aid beyond taking a video for social media of for the news reports - after you're already hurt or worse.

**Dumpling** · July-01-20, 01:49 PM

Originally Posted by Ray1936

Sure hope you guys on the far left don't want to defund my pension. Sigh.

Ray, I wondered for a moment about this. Most directly, the parties
who would be considering defunding your pension would be the
financial administrators for the pension funds and the City of Detroit
and other entities contributing to the pension funds indirectly.

On the face of it, based on the following analysis by John Naglick
in the Detroit News, the Police and Fire Pension has a shortfall
of one billion dollars from a needed amount of four billion dollars.
So if a pensioner's promised amount per year is $20,000, there will be
available to that pensioner, as things stand now, $15,000 per year.

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/ne...ises/33141691/

I don't consider "the far left" [[BAMN, Antifa, socialist workers
movements, trade unions, Red Diaper Babies, the Green Party,
the Cuban government and similar entities) and the
financial administrators affecting the pension funds to be
overlapping groups, myself.

**Dumpling** · July-01-20, 03:01 PM

In the Detroit News article in the previous post, the City of Detroit was
setting aside funding through 2023 to partially address the pension funding shortfall that would become apparent in 2024.

This year, 2020, the pandemic is happening and the fallout from it totally
rearranges the City of Detroit budget. The pension funding shortfall will
likely still be apparent before 2024. The city council approved a budget
that does reduce the intended amount to be allocated for retiree costs.

https://www.crainsdetroit.com/govern...s-due-covid-19

Disclosure: I am a former City of Detroit employee who was/is
vested in the GRS pension system. There was a retiree
representative on the GRS board [[probably still is). There
should be an equivalent retiree representative for the Police
and Fire pension system [[Greg Trozak, retired police trustee on the
Board of Trustees for the pension system). You should be getting
updates from this person or someone similar in regard to how
the probable funding shortfalls starting in 2024 will be dealt with.

The worst case HAS happened: all the monies in the pension
system were disbursed and not replaced and there was NO
more money for the aging pensioners. It was this one:

https://www.al.com/live/2011/05/how_..._fund_wen.html

**Ray1936** · July-01-20, 04:24 PM

Originally Posted by Dumpling

In the Detroit News article in the previous post, the City of Detroit was
setting aside funding through 2023 to partially address the pension funding shortfall that would become apparent in 2024.

Fortunately, since I'm 84, I'll likely be dead by 2024 anyway. But my original post was meant more humorously than anything else. Not much humor on DetroitYes anymore.

**Zacha341** · July-01-20, 04:36 PM

^^^ Laughter humor can be contagious or not... it depends.

The times are quite serious but indeed I do take determined time away enjoying some sun, sharing laughter and joy.

You have to balance-For certain!

**Dumpling** · July-01-20, 05:08 PM

I remember that you lost your healthcare funding in the bankruptcy
and that wasn't fun - and nobody needs another pension cut after
that for sure.

On the other hand it is good to look at the likely potential shortfall
years in advance and plan with the likely shortfall in mind so
in the future one can be pleasantly surprised if it actually doesn't
happen!

**jcole** · July-02-20, 06:18 AM

My dad was DPD who retired in 73 and thought his pension would last forever; he was one of the guys that never paid into SS, so pension and some insurance was all he had. Well, turned out he didn't need it; he died in 75, but that left my mom with a half pension. At first all was well, but my dad had taken a locked COLA of 1%; don't know how that worked but he had some choice and chose wrong. Any way, my mom lived til 9 yrs ago and was living on $800 per month. CoD pension barely housed her. And no SS
And during her old age, CoD dropped the wonderful Bankers Insurance and she ended up on a BC/BS PPO. During those years, someone in the administration of pension fund embezzled millions. And all were screwed. And on $800 a month, there is no way to "plan for a shortfall"

Originally Posted by Dumpling

I remember that you lost your healthcare funding in the bankruptcy
and that wasn't fun - and nobody needs another pension cut after
that for sure.

On the other hand it is good to look at the likely potential shortfall
years in advance and plan with the likely shortfall in mind so
in the future one can be pleasantly surprised if it actually doesn't
happen!

**aj3647** · July-02-20, 09:25 AM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

Why are you calling my post a "cherry-picked example"?

Because you posted a single example of an armed robbery that occurred in a city of 9 million people, without any context or commentary, let along any hint of what it has to do with the topic of this thread. So I'll ask a second time, what was the point of your post exactly? That there's crime in NYC?

Thank you for letting us all know that a woman was robbed in NYC. That was very important information that we all needed to be made aware of. I look forward to your future police blotter postings of random crimes that occur around the country.

**Wheels** · July-04-20, 04:16 PM

Originally Posted by aj3647

Because you posted a single example of an armed robbery that occurred in a city of 9 million people, without any context or commentary, let along any hint of what it has to do with the topic of this thread. So I'll ask a second time, what was the point of your post exactly? That there's crime in NYC?

Thank you for letting us all know that a woman was robbed in NYC. That was very important information that we all needed to be made aware of. I look forward to your future police blotter postings of random crimes that occur around the country.

Thank you for defining so accurate exactly what BLM and the liberal media does with news stories. I could post 20 stories of violent beatings by blacks on whites and attacks on police but the don’t fit the liberal agenda!

**Dumpling** · July-06-20, 08:40 AM

Due to significant double digit inflation from about 1976 to
about 1982, those City of Detroit retirees who retired at that
time or before had much less of a pension than those before
or after that time frame. There should have been a one time
COLA for those retirees as a corrective but there was/is no
political will to do that. These retirees even to this day for
those that are still around are getting about one-fifth of a fair
pension.

This shows up in the tables in the City of Detroit General
Retirement System Annual Report.

**Dumpling** · July-06-20, 08:42 AM

Ray I hope you are happy and well when you are 88!

**aj3647** · July-06-20, 09:31 AM

Originally Posted by Wheels

Thank you for defining so accurate exactly what BLM and the liberal media does with news stories. I could post 20 stories of violent beatings by blacks on whites and attacks on police but the don’t fit the liberal agenda!

Is that what you do over on Gab? Do those stories get your motor running? Feel free to start a new thread and post away! I mean, this place isn't quite "Storm Fronty" enough yet, so do your part to make Lowell's vision a reality!

**Dumpling** · July-06-20, 12:27 PM

Wheels, what aj3647 might like to see, when he isn't going ad
hominem on you, is for you to put a cherry picked example
into some structural context.

For example. There was a broadly shared and publicized
cherry picked instance, which was video taped from several
angles, of a School Resource Officer violently arresting a school
girl clinging to her school desk after she wouldn't give up
her cell phone to her teacher whereupon the teacher called
in the SRO.

The term coined for this particular structural context is the
"School To Prison Pipeline".

The structural context is that overall, but especially in schools
with SROs, and even more especially in those schools that are
both majority white and have SROs, minority students are
suspended and arrested in much greater numbers than
white students are. White students in such schools are more
likely to receive medical care for mental wellness issues
than to be suspended and arrested.

If someone believes that the "School To Prison Pipeline" is
a real thing, then they are likely to believe that eliminating
the SRO position in schools and simultaneously enhancing
the availability of mental health and other counseling in
schools is a desirable direction to move towards.

So in your opinion, is the "School To Prison Pipeline"
a real thing?

And, is there some structural context for the cherry picked
examples of violence that you provided that we should also
be considering?

**Honky Tonk** · July-07-20, 10:05 PM

https://www.yahoo.com/news/watch-yor...171911829.html

**Zacha341** · July-08-20, 06:48 AM

^^^ Ridiculously tragic. As society continues to devolve towards this escalation of crime and mayhem, our city leaders will talk their jargon and rhetoric believing they will never be ground-level to this kind of senseless crime.

**Richard** · July-08-20, 06:50 AM

Welcome to the new normal,soon those with means will leave for the safety of the burbs and the cycle of decline continues.

Notice none of those mayors or city council members have offered to give up their taxpayer funded protection units,even back when the virus first hit,many have had around the clock police units sitting outside of thier homes.

**Zacha341** · July-08-20, 07:04 AM

Yes, I have been clear from the beginning that I do NOT believe in dis-banding the police - they yet have a job to do - they need to do it better without the mass cover-ups for misconduct and brutality. But they're needed. It's rhetoric to think that major cities will be police-less long-term. Sure, the talking heads [[safe and away, for now, in their well armed and guarded residences etc.) will 'virtue signal' to the extreme groups among the protestors.

Heck they will even go along with it short-term which will have many innocents murdered and maimed while they fiddle. But thinking cynically, if not benevolently, there's no way New York City is going to cede Manhattan long term sans police [[national if not local). There's too much valuable business, retail and other financial holdings at stake. However, more of the elite rich our clearing out anyway! Tiring of being prisoners in their million dollar high-rises they are leaving - taking with them their big tax contributions.

And if your poor your jacked as you never say even if you thought you did.

**aj3647** · July-08-20, 08:08 AM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

https://www.yahoo.com/news/watch-yor...171911829.html

SAD!

https://www.baltimoresun.com/marylan...2fe-story.html

**Richard** · July-08-20, 03:47 PM

Atlanta breaks down and declared a state of emergency clearing the way to bring in 1000 national guard troops in after a weekend of escalating violence.

I could have sworn there were those here that a few weeks ago were crying Trump for suggesting bringing in the National guard.

They will be used to protect the governors mansion,protect the mayor and other officials in order to redistribute more police.

They are saying the escalating voilence is due to emboldened criminals,commonly referred to as THUGS and police burn out after spending the last 60 days with little time off.

Look carefully at the message that sends when the military is used to protect the leaders,much like in most communist and socialist countries.

One would think that the mayors and governors by design allowed the carnage to spiral out of control in order to turn control over to the military.

I still believe this all has nothing to do with racism and it is a tool being used to gain control by the leftists in order to force change though violence.

The crossed the line from democratic socialist to flat out socialists that wish to take power by force.

ol Bernie must be during cartwheels about now.

Maybe that was the deal between the Chinese and the DNC

Help us overthrow democracy and we will give you all of our trade.

**Honky Tonk** · July-08-20, 04:04 PM

Originally Posted by Richard

Atlanta breaks down and declared a state of emergency clearing the way to bring in 1000 national guard troops in after a weekend of escalating violence.

I could have sworn there were those here that a few weeks ago were crying Trump for suggesting bringing in the National guard.

They will be used to protect the governors mansion,protect the mayor and other officials in order to redistribute more police.

They are saying the escalating voilence is due to emboldened criminals,commonly referred to as THUGS and police burn out after spending the last 60 days with little time off.

Look carefully at the message that sends when the military is used to protect the leaders,much like in most communist and socialist countries.

One would think that the mayors and governors by design allowed the carnage to spiral out of control in order to turn control over to the military.

I still believe this all has nothing to do with racism and it is a tool being used to gain control by the leftists in order to force change though violence.

The crossed the line from democratic socialist to flat out socialists that wish to take power by force.

ol Bernie must be during cartwheels about now.

Maybe that was the deal between the Chinese and the DNC

Help us overthrow democracy and we will give you all of our trade.

Remember this news story when the riots hit closer to home?

https://nypost.com/2020/06/18/democr...ver-vandalism/

**Richard** · July-08-20, 04:22 PM

Yea she says a result of 400 years of racism,bet she goes to work in a bullet proof vehicle guarded by the very ones that she is wanting to defund.

That’s how you know it is not a political thing and more so a violent takeover.

From the same link

Once inside, the boy allegedly shoved the victim to the floor and attempted to remove her clothing. But the woman fought back and the pre-teen ran out of the building, according to police.
The kid has been charged with robbery, assault, burglary, sex abuse, menacing and criminal possession of a weapon.

It was a 12 year old kid that did that,but the police is the problem,the only reason they want to defund the police is in order to have free rein to create mayhem.

https://nypost.com/2020/07/08/12-yea...ape-in-queens/

The 12 year old had a weapon,how much you want to bet if the police had intervened and had to use deadly force,cities would be burning to the ground and the news would read.

White Police officer kills black 12 year old that tripped and fell on a white woman.

Brauer’s firm estimated that gun purchasers acquired 2.3 million firearms for the month, an increase of 145.3 percent compared to June 2019. The figure includes a 177.5 percent increase in hand gun sales [[for a total of 1,511,714) and a 114.3 percent increase in long-gun sales [[for a total of 690,212).

According to FBI data, more than 3.9 million background checks were processed through the bureau’s NICS database in June

https://www.mediaite.com/news/gun-sa...l-time-record/

That will put gun sales in July over 4 million after the background checks clear.

I guess any presidential candidates would not find this a good year in order to push their anti 2A agenda.

**Zacha341** · July-08-20, 04:24 PM

For certain what's going on now for some [[escalation of violence) is well beyond the core protests for George Floyd and Rayshard Brooks [[they're rarely mentioned now) and social justice!

I have friends/ family in Calli, GA and ILL and they report that it's out of control. And to think Minneapolis still voices the idea of abolishing all police?! We're talking anarchy should that happen.

And I say this fully supportive of the need for very strong police reform police with teeth and consequence for police misconduct rooting out the those that need to go!

I get it the reticent for the mayors, govs and even the president to do anything. As everyone is BOUND!

If the city admins try to put down the criminality as it intertwines with the protestors they are deemed racists and Trumpters [[BOUND).

Ditto if the feds move in. Yet if Trump and the feds do nothing they/ he OWNS it [[BOUND).

Good times! In the midst of this the police departments have been neutralized - BOUND and unable to do their job as part of their service to communities!

And if I thought about that [[neutralization of the police) for CERTAIN the criminal element has! Were not talking rocket science here.

Bad people [[imagine actually admitting that there are some roaming the planet) and those plying criminal behaviors have never had it so good with so many aspects of governance BOUND in politics.

Again good times for the average citizen just trying to live.

The elite [[dem and repubs) can continue to look down upon it all... giving platitudes and false threats ASSUMING that what they've allowed will never quite reach them. Their form of 'supremacy' ensures that. For now.

Additionally, if you took a poll of most who actually LIVE in the high protests cities they will not be for full disbanding of the police. Nope.

Did we think the police do not have a job to do? They do. But they must do so sans the cover-up culture allowing deadly misconduct.

**Richard** · July-08-20, 04:41 PM

Did you know that the person killed in the CHOP zone family can now sue the city because the police failed to protect him.

There are lots of lawsuits brought on against the cities and states by individuals and businesses because the mayors and governors failed on their number one duty.

To protect the citizens and property they serve,that also includes the protesters.

**Zacha341** · July-08-20, 04:47 PM

^^^ That would be but another example of the Tower of Babel [[USA). Totally incoherent, and conflicted. Victories, failures, noble ideas, corruptions, and failed policies, rules and edicts eroding one another.

Filled to the brim of contradictions, hypocrisy, eyes wide-shut and BOUND.

And a pandemic pulling up the rear.