Best Suburbs to Buy a House [[Long-Term Outlook)

[Seven&wyo]

Ok I have no problem being wrong, but what evidence do you have that the OP just wants a white school district in the suburbs? The suburbs are mostly white so the schools will be mostly white by default. Some are just better than others. I'm pretty sure Birmingham had better schools than most of the surrounding white areas. If the OP wanted to live in the city or would be a different story [[Cass and King for example), but the clearly they want the suburbs

[Gistok]

I'm not even sure OP newbie ROXY is still on this thread... he's not responded since page 1 of this 5 page thread. So we may just be spinning our wheels talking to ourselves....

[Jimaz]

... So we may just be spinning our wheels talking to ourselves....

But that's what we customarily do here, right? It's like ... our job.

Roxy's "Last Activity [was] February-09-20 06:38 PM"

Thanks for noticing that. LOL!

[gnome]

I think you mean Richard Headlee, don't recall a Dick Chrysler running for governor but I could be wrong.

Yes, you are right. Thank you for correcting me and my fading memory.

I guess with both of those Dicks it difficult to keep them straight.

[Ray1936]

Well, for my two cents, any school is only as good as the child's parents.

[bust]

Totally agree, Ray! Good parents are more important than good schools.

And Metro25, I get what you're saying. I've heard plenty of people use "good schools" the way you describe. But almost always in suburban Detroit. It doesn't usually mean the same thing places I've lived since then, where it's much less segregated. Also, not everyone in Metro Detroit uses the term that way -- you're an example!

From my perspective, as a [[hopefully good) parent, good schools are still among the most important reasons to live somewhere. And for me, a diverse student body is among the most important considerations. Especially as we are a mixed-race family.

I attended Grosse Pointe schools when they were rated among the best in the state. Many of the classes and all of the facilities were great. My parents chose to live there for that reason. But students were almost entirely white and Christian, and kids there grew up saying things like "nigger pile." A few called one of my Asian friends a "chink." "Jewing" meant treating someone unfairly. Calling something "gay" was to say it was lame. My friend's mom spoke forebodingly how she suspected our classmate's family was Muslim. At least one kid wore blackface for halloween. I think two did the same year.

According to some ratings, Grosse Pointe schools have slipped a bit since then, even while they're still among the best. But the ratings are based mostly on test scores. Grosse Pointe schools are now also a lot more diverse, and I doubt kids there are still so ignorant. In my opinion, that makes the schools even better today. Same great facilities, probably classes just as good. And I'll bet there are less diverse schools that are rated higher where the social education is ignorant like Grosse Pointe's used to be.

Good parents don't just make sure their kids do their homework. And there are bad parents who do.

[ct_alum]

Yes, you are right. Thank you for correcting me and my fading memory.

I guess with both of those Dicks it difficult to keep them straight.

LOL, so true.

[Squirtle]

Ok I have no problem being wrong ....

You aren't wrong; some people just find a reason to be offended over anything.

[rickbak]

I guess with both of those Dicks it difficult to keep them straight.

Insert Viagra joke here....

[Roxy]

Another +1 to the Pointes. We moved to the Park from Seattle in 2017. For us, the fact that there *aren't* big box stores five minutes from away is a huge selling point. They're ugly and don't provide an interesting streetscape. If I want toilet paper, wiper blades, artificial flowers, and a bag of onions all at once, I get on Amazon. That shit comes right to my door for me. Shocking. We're on Balfour - pretty close to the border - and we can take Jefferson downtown in 10-15 minutes. I love that 313wx used the term 'plan' a trip downtown. So out of touch. We don't plan any goings to downtown any more than we plan going to trader joes for some cheap and entirely mediocre wine. We get in an uber and go. Maybe make a reservation if we're on the ball. Usually we're not.

Our home is beautiful. GP has some of the best housing stock of any suburb. Public schools are some of the best in the state. Yes, we take it up the ass in taxes. But when it snows and the city plows our sidewalks for us, and when I head on down to windmill pointe, I ease into it. All those who live in Bham and A2 take it up the ass too. Any time you have high home values combined with city amenities, you get high taxes.

This is just a hunch, but I have a feeling GP has the most to gain as downtown revives. But who the hell knows.

Our neighbors are awesome. The block we're on has nearly entirely turned over the past four years, so we're almost all new here and have bonded well. Block parties. Hiding from teenage children behind the garage to smoke weed. We're in the process of building a block float for the GP Pride parade in June. They're all pretty damn fine people.

Anyway. I like living here. Much much more than I thought I would. Best of luck in your search

Thanks, gpp1004. The best housing stock in the area is in Detroit proper and the Grosse Pointes. Oakland County is the trendy place to be right now, but the housing stock is not worth the price in my humble opinion. I also agree that the Grosse Pointes will benefit the most from a Detroit resurgence.

[Roxy]

It has been a long time 2 years to be exact since I posted on here. I was looking for an old friend I grew up with [[female) that I knew when I lived in Detroit way back in the day. Thanx to some of the input & tips from some of you I found her living in Macomb County married 2 kids 2 grandkids we got together for brunch & have kept in touch for the past year.Once again thank you all! I did want to respond to this question of where to buy a house to live long term. Quick personal history born & lived in Detroit for 13 years family moved to Warren where I lived till I got married with brief stints in Roseville & Sterling Heights. Have been living in Royal Oak since 1987 first in a starter home then in a new home that my ex-wife found that I live in to today. from my experience having lived in Royal Oak for 33 years I will say this. Very nice area we raised two kids safe environment but the taxes are extremely high for the type of service you don't get what I mean is the city of R.O. doesn't give a damn about the residents and only cares about the money coming in Over the 33yrs there have been nickel and dime issues but my opinion of this city was cemented in August 2014 when the city's sewer system failed and dumped 5 feet of water into my basement the city response was a snotty letter from the legal department basically saying shit happens while myself and my two daughters lost almost all of our personal possessions not to mention but I will the furnace hot water tank washer & dryer I got a little chunk of change from FEMA but had to clean up & pay for all replacements myself while the city took a powder singing we don't care.Also for those of you sayin what about insurance my homeowners at the time did'nt cover it have since put in an additional clause. So I guess what i'm sayin is if you you want to to pay high taxes just for the zip code without gettin zip from the city Royal Oak is your place. Oh one more thing for all of you thinking Dude just move I am retired got my house paid & I am just playing playing out the string. Thanks for letting me vent!!!!!

I like hanging out in Royal Oak, but I don't see myself moving there. The houses are way overpriced in my opinion. One night I was driving in Royal Oak and was shocked that there were no street lights on for miles. I thought to myself that the houses there are so expensive these days [[and housing stock isn't impressive at all) but the city can't afford street lights? Thank you for your input.

[Roxy]

Every year someone asks about what places are good to move to... and every year we have this same real estate "food fight" over which location is best, and every year we end up with the same responses that totally muddle the OPs question. We need to start assembling a bookmark of threads that nearly breaks out into a brawl of comments... to save everyone time and energy.

I've been on this forum for 20 years... and I'm sure there are about a dozen threads that answer with the same set of replies. It's just that the forum headings vary, and finding them is a challenge...

I don't see the problem with starting a new conversation on real estate and housing each year. The market changes year to year. The conversation could be different in 2021 depending on what happens with the Coronavirus, presidential elections, the stock market, etc. I've also been reading that after years of decline, real estate in some inner-ring suburbs is bouncing back.

[Roxy]

Good schools is simply code language for "is the area sufficiently white?". It's got nothing to do with the actual school or the education your child is getting.

This is why I will always side-eye the hell out of anybody who recommends a place based on "good schools". It's revolting and it needs to stop immediately.

No. There are plenty of bad schools in working class white suburbs and rural areas in Michigan. Some of the best schools in the state are in Troy where much of the student population is Asian, South Asian, and Middle Eastern. People of all races look for good schools. Why do you think many families living in Detroit rent homes in the Grosse Pointes? Some do it just to be able to send their kids to better schools there.

[Roxy]

I'm not even sure OP newbie ROXY is still on this thread... he's not responded since page 1 of this 5 page thread. So we may just be spinning our wheels talking to ourselves....

I don't log in often because I have a busy life, but I have read all the comments on this thread.

[Roxy]

But that's what we customarily do here, right? It's like ... our job.

Roxy's "Last Activity [was] February-09-20 06:38 PM"

Thanks for noticing that. LOL!

I do not log in often but I eventually read all comments and appreciate those who offered good advice and suggestions.

[Roxy]

Totally agree, Ray! Good parents are more important than good schools.

And Metro25, I get what you're saying. I've heard plenty of people use "good schools" the way you describe. But almost always in suburban Detroit. It doesn't usually mean the same thing places I've lived since then, where it's much less segregated. Also, not everyone in Metro Detroit uses the term that way -- you're an example!

From my perspective, as a [[hopefully good) parent, good schools are still among the most important reasons to live somewhere. And for me, a diverse student body is among the most important considerations. Especially as we are a mixed-race family.

I attended Grosse Pointe schools when they were rated among the best in the state. Many of the classes and all of the facilities were great. My parents chose to live there for that reason. But students were almost entirely white and Christian, and kids there grew up saying things like "nigger pile." A few called one of my Asian friends a "chink." "Jewing" meant treating someone unfairly. Calling something "gay" was to say it was lame. My friend's mom spoke forebodingly how she suspected our classmate's family was Muslim. At least one kid wore blackface for halloween. I think two did the same year.

According to some ratings, Grosse Pointe schools have slipped a bit since then, even while they're still among the best. But the ratings are based mostly on test scores. Grosse Pointe schools are now also a lot more diverse, and I doubt kids there are still so ignorant. In my opinion, that makes the schools even better today. Same great facilities, probably classes just as good. And I'll bet there are less diverse schools that are rated higher where the social education is ignorant like Grosse Pointe's used to be.

Good parents don't just make sure their kids do their homework. And there are bad parents who do.

Children benefit from good parents and good schools. I have heard that things have changed in Grosse Pointe since you went to school there. The schools are more diverse, probably because of Harper Woods and more families from Detroit renting in the Grosse Pointes. Like many schools in wealthy areas, some of these top ranked schools have underlying "rich kid" problems. I've heard there is a serious drug problem at West Bloomfield and Grosse Pointe schools.

[Roxy]

Wyandotte isn’t really a quick commute to Detroit, it’s pretty far from I-75. And commuting up Jefferson is ok but the Ecorse cops will pull over anyone going 36 in their 35 zone. If you want proximity to Downtown, you can’t do better than Allen Park—exceptional schools, great nearby shopping on “The Hill,” nice 50s brick housing stock, and a great location on I-75, the Southfield, and I-94–enabling quick access to Southfield, Dearborn, Detroit, and the western suburbs. Not to mention the Airport being within breathing distance but with less of the plane noise that Dearborn gets.

If you can handle being in a more *secluded* location, Wyandotte is amazing because it has really cheap housing stock and a nice downtown. If you like drinking or are of Polish descent, move there as well—Wyandotte once boasted of having a “church and a bar on every corner.”

I don't go south of Detroit often, but I visited Allen Park recently. There doesn't seem to be much to do there, but I was impressed with the housing stock. I wonder if there will be more interest in Allen Park in the future. The real estate is still very affordable. I see room for appreciation and growth if revitalization efforts are made.

[Gistok]

Roxy.... no insult intended towards you... but about every year some [[innocently) comes on this forum... and we go thru the same spiel that almost turns into a food fight over which place is the best to live.

Glad you came back to give your own feedback, and that you'll make the choice that is the better fit for you...

[mikehamm45]

Well, I'll throw Dearborn into the mix. We bought a nice stone/brick 1929 Tudor here 30 years ago and it's appreciated nicely. Never had a speck of trouble all this time---no vandalism, loud music, drag racing, etc. Oh wait, somebody once threw a pumpkin through the back window of our van. Turned out it was some kids who got the wrong house---they were gunning for the teacher who lived next door. Anyway, the school system and city services are excellent, the taxes a little high but nothing like Ann Arbor or GP.

My wife [[who has lived in Dearborn her entire life) and I always get a laugh over how Dearborn is portrayed in the media. One side still thinks the ghost of Orville Hubbard still rules City Hall and another side insists Dearborn is/will be under Sharia law. We've seen the community change so much from the time we bought our house. Used to be 98% white. Today, on our street alone [[Cherry Hill and Outer Drive area), we have Iraqi, Albanian, Syrian, and Lebanese neighbors, with a gay couple, a b/w couple, a black renter, and a retired Hispanic autoworker who does nothing but shovel everyone's snow when he isn't mowing their lawns. Had a woman from Somali living across the street for several years until she moved. And of course, there's still lots of us palefaces around. No block parties or hoe-downs, but we all get along fine. It's kind of inspiring, actually. They should move The Iowa and NH primaries to this part of town if they want a more accurate representation of America.

I would second this...

Strategically, I love Dearborn... while it does not have the panache of Birmingham, housing stock is similar, and nothing beats a neighborhood... I severely dislike sub-divisions that do not open to other neighborhoods.

I live on Michigan/Military, close to the historic home district.

My kid can walk to school, we have a small downtown to walk in, and can get into Downtown Detroit in about 20-30 minutes depending on traffic.

Housing is expensive though and taxes are also somewhat high. This is a big and old city that has a lot of legacy costs, and the school system could improve. The food is great as there are mom and pop restaurants, butchers, grocers all over the place. Shopping and movies not so much. In that department, Fairlane is a shell of its former self. And truth be told, it is not a "white" city, if that sort of thing bothers you then stick to Oakland county. White people are still the majority, but Arabs make up a large portion of that with a peppering of everyone in between. My neighborhood is very similar to what was described above.

But you cannot beat the location [[airport, Detroit) and the neighborhood amenities... also... bonus... Hines Drive Park... if you like to cycle it trumps everything.

[Gistok]

I would second this...

<SNIP>

But you cannot beat the location [[airport, Detroit) and the neighborhood amenities... also... bonus... Hines Drive Park... if you like to cycle it trumps everything.

Or in the spring time... if you like to paddle....

[mikehamm45]

Or in the spring time... if you like to paddle....

Thanks for the tip, after COVID is over, I will try it out.

[rooms222]

Roxy, I would just like to thank you for coming back and commenting. It makes the thread better.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

Not trying to be Debbie Downer, but buying a house, would be the last thing I'm thinking about right about now. Getting through this pandemic should be first and foremost for everyone. Some economists predict a downturn in housing due to the virus, as people get behind on payments. So you'll have your pick after this over, as they'll probably be plenty of foreclosures unfortunately.

[rickbak]

Not trying to be Debbie Downer, but buying a house, would be the last thing I'm thinking about right about now. Getting through this pandemic should be first and foremost for everyone. Some economists predict a downturn in housing due to the virus, as people get behind on payments. So you'll have your pick after this over, as they'll probably be plenty of foreclosures unfortunately.

No, Deb, you're just being realistic. What I'm fearing is the wave of bankruptcies and foreclosures, which is sure to come, ushering in another period like the one we just emerged from a few years ago: empty houses and an influx of renters who don't give a fuck about the property or the neighborhood. I admit that the only time we seriously considered moving was the circa 2008-2012 period. But home values had dropped so much and the equity we had dried up, so it didn't make sense. We hung on like so many others, and things gradually stabilized. Rinse and repeat? God, I hope not, but I'm thinking by end of summer things are gonna be looking really grim.

[Roxy]

Not trying to be Debbie Downer, but buying a house, would be the last thing I'm thinking about right about now. Getting through this pandemic should be first and foremost for everyone. Some economists predict a downturn in housing due to the virus, as people get behind on payments. So you'll have your pick after this over, as they'll probably be plenty of foreclosures unfortunately.

I didn't buy a place, thank goodness. I wanted to take my time while saving more for a down payment. It looks like I'll be taking my time for at least another 6 months to a year, waiting to see how the pandemic will affect the real estate market in metro Detroit.