Coronavirus: Threat Beyond Politics [For Political Discussions of CoV]

[Zacha341]

^ Just speeding as has increased over the last few months. A few donut-nuts too. Stupid considering those factory installed tires are crap, and new ones are about $450 each. But hey money seems to be flowing so what me worry. I'll just try to avoid them as they slip and slide on the baldies in January!

I need to manage the fortune of insurance I'm paying for my dull sedan.

[Jimaz]

Whitmer's being called out...
https://www.yahoo.com/news/gretchen-...094502576.html

Funny thing, that piece was written by this guy....
https://catholicherald.co.uk/wp-cont...-Supporter.jpg

Thanks for that Maof... it did raise my level of respect for Whitmer somewhat... obviously a biased opinion piece... but the nursing home fiasco was troubling....

'It's just plain false.' State did not order nursing homes to take COVID-19 patients, Whitmer says

Whitmer said there has not been a single instance where the state ordered nursing homes to keep COVID-19 patients.

She said the state followed CDC guidance to allow nursing home residents to come back after they were hospitalized as long as they had a separate unit that was separately staffed.

"That was the CDC guidelines, that's what we followed," she said. "We never required a single nursing home to take in a patient that was recovering from COVID-19, it's just plain false."

I have personally visited a COVID-19 isolation wing at a nursing home. The precautions taken are astonishing, e.g., double masks — the outer disposable to protect the inner reusable N95 mask.

True, it is a deadly situation but ultimately we have to consider where else are these patients to go? No one's going to construct a separate COVID building on the fly.

They're called "isolation wings" for a reason.

[Zacha341]

^^^ For sure everyone has the nursing or aged facility story, or two, or three. I have a friend involved in one in Oakland county they had NOT TESTED their staff UNTIL reported to the state to do so.

Motive [[as Columbo would say): If you test your staff and some one pops positive you have to send them home, quarantined, with pay 14 days and they were too cheap to do that. Until forced.

[jcole]

I went to a business in Macomb county with this sign on their door:

"...Therefore, if we see you without a mask, we will assume you have a medical condition and will welcome you inside to support our business,"

And they THINK they are obeying the law. They are not. You can't "assume" this crap.

[Honky Tonk]

'It's just plain false.' State did not order nursing homes to take COVID-19 patients, Whitmer saysI have personally visited a COVID-19 isolation wing at a nursing home. The precautions taken are astonishing, e.g., double masks — the outer disposable to protect the inner reusable N95 mask.

True, it is a deadly situation but ultimately we have to consider where else are these patients to go? No one's going to construct a separate COVID building on the fly.

They're called "isolation wings" for a reason.

Before or after people died?

[Jimaz]

I went to a business in Macomb county with this sign on their door:

"...Therefore, if we see you without a mask, we will assume you have a medical condition and will welcome you inside to support our business,"

I've seen one with the same wording. Perhaps it's organized.

And they THINK they are obeying the law. They are not. You can't "assume" this crap.

True:
Gov. Whitmer says Michigan businesses can’t assume unmasked customers have medical justification

[Honky Tonk]

I've seen one with the same wording. Perhaps it's organized.

I'm waiting for Thom to have an expert confirm that in their new book.

[aj3647]

As predicted, within a week of going back to campus, there have been COVID outbreaks among returning students. Michigan State, UNC, and Notre Dame have all cancelled in-person classes.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ay-by-students

[Zacha341]

Yep. It's hard to predict and maintain how students [[and faculty) will interact and how facilities will be maintain [[presumably) in resuming F2F classes. K12 and college...

Detroit teachers [Union] authorize strike over safety fears

[Dan Wesson]

State won't say where 'eh. That crap don't sit well with me.

https://www.bridgemi.com/michigan-he...wont-say-where

[Dan Wesson]

As predicted, within a week of going back to campus, there have been COVID outbreaks among returning students. Michigan State, UNC, and Notre Dame have all cancelled in-person classes.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ay-by-students

CMU has picked up 5 more cases according to Mt Pleasant paper. Paper notes that unlike before the college is not notifying the publicthis time.

[oladub]

Bill Gates has been a critic of Trump, the CDC's initial deployment of its testing program, and on August 13 the quality of tests. So I was surprised to hear Gates say a couple of things that were unique and even one good thing about the U.S. response to Covoid-19 on August 18.

Gill Gates partially blamed Americans for not wearing masks. Gates said, "We believe in freedom, individual freedom. We optimize for individual rights.""I don’t think a change in administrations will get people to wear masks. ... It’s hard to see how we build that trust network and improved behavior. It’ll mostly be incremental.""He added that a Biden presidency would not necessarily convince anti-maskers to start wearing masks because they would oppose a mandate from a different president." Gates was probably right. Bikers at Sturgis probably wouldn't care about whatever message Biden read to them.

The one very positive thing Gates had to say about U.S. policy was that so much money was dedicated early on to R&D to develop a vaccine. " "Thank goodness...with all its imperfections, [the U.S.] was there to move things ahead," he said of American R&D, adding that other countries should be questioned over why they "weren't able to orchestrate early high-risk money." For instance, Johnson and Johnson reached a deal with the U.S to provide 100M doses of vaccine for $IB. Pfizer has also agreed to sell the U.S. government 100M doses of vaccine and up to 500M more doses for $1.95B

I like the concept of making the these companies prioritize America with vaccines. That's what should have been done with N-95 masks. We are still short of N-95 masks and all I can find at Menard's is occasional batches of KN-95 masks from China. I'll bet we could have all the N-95 masks we needed if the government would guarantee the purchase of 1B N-95 masks at some low price and work in tariffs to guarantee a market for American masks makers.

[Gistok]

^^ Well stated Oladub....

[Honky Tonk]

Bill Gates has been a critic of Trump, the CDC's initial deployment of its testing program, and on August 13 the quality of tests. So I was surprised to hear Gates say a couple of things that were unique and even one good thing about the U.S. response to Covoid-19 on August 18.

Gill Gates partially blamed Americans for not wearing masks. Gates said, "We believe in freedom." "We believe in freedom, individual freedom. We optimize for individual rights.""I don’t think a change in administrations will get people to wear masks. ... It’s hard to see how we build that trust network and improved behavior. It’ll mostly be incremental.""He added that a Biden presidency would not necessarily convince anti-maskers to start wearing masks because they would oppose a mandate from a different president." Gates was probably right. Bikers at Sturgis probably wouldn't care about whatever message Biden read to them.

The one very positive thing Gates had to say about U.S. policy was that so much money was dedicated early on to R&D to develop a vaccine. " "Thank goodness...with all its imperfections, [the U.S.] was there to move things ahead," he said of American R&D, adding that other countries should be questioned over why they "weren't able to orchestrate early high-risk money." For instance, Johnson and Johnson reached a deal with the U.S to provide 100M doses of vaccine for $IB. Pfizer has also agreed to sell the U.S. government 100M doses of vaccine and up to 500M more doses for $1.95B

I like the concept of making the these companies prioritize American with vaccines. That's what should have been done with N-95 masks. We are still short of N-95 masks and all I can find at Menard's is occasional batches of KN-95 masks from China. I'll bet we could have all the N-95 masks we needed if the government would guarantee the purchase of 1B N-95 masks at some low price and work in tariffs to guarantee a market for American masks makers.

The problem isn't supply. To quote a George Carlin bit, "you gotta WANNA!" The weekend is coming up. If you're in the Detroit area, take me up on my offer. Drive Kerchaval from the Hill to Alter, in the early evening, and take Mack back. [[there's a restaurant at Moross & Mack too) Look at all the people clustered in the outside sidewalk cafes. You'll be hard pressed to see anyone wearing a mask. [[there will be some) Granted they're outside, but there's no way they're 6' apart. People don't seem to care, or else they feel it's not them or it can't happen to them. Masks will only work if you use them.

[Gistok]

People don't seem to care, or else they feel it's not them or it can't happen to them. Masks will only work if you use them.

Agree 100% Honky Tonk... I will always remember that 30 year old young guy in Texas who [[hospitalized) just before he died of COVID-19 said "I think I made a mistake" by going to bars without social distancing or mask wearing.

Sadly none of us knows if we are a ticking time bomb or not if we catch the virus... or just as bad... be asymptomatic, and pass it on to a loved one who ends up dying of it.

A good Facebook friend has a nephew... whose wife is a 40 year old nurse and caught it at her hospital [[she thinks)... but was asymptomatic... she passed it to her husband, who spent weeks in the hospital in ICU... while she was a tortured soul at home thinking that she was responsible.

[Honky Tonk]

Agree 100% Honky Tonk... I will always remember that 30 year old young guy in Texas who [[hospitalized) just before he died of COVID-19 said "I think I made a mistake" by going to bars without social distancing or mask wearing.

Sadly none of us knows if we are a ticking time bomb or not if we catch the virus... or just as bad... be asymptomatic, and pass it on to a loved one who ends up dying of it.

A good Facebook friend has a nephew... whose wife is a 40 year old nurse and caught it at her hospital [[she thinks)... but was asymptomatic... she passed it to her husband, who spent weeks in the hospital in ICU... while she was a tortured soul at home thinking that she was responsible.

I'm sorry for your friend and his wife. I hope they both recover physically and mentally. You don't have to go all the way to Texas. Right here in MI, in Saline, less than 50 miles away, 43 infected after a 4th of July party.

https://www.mlive.com/news/ann-arbor...aw-county.html

[Richard]

How exactly does one determine the exact time and date that they caught the virus?

Some say it may take up to 5 days for symptoms to show.

So do you get tested before walking into a bar and then again when leaving?

Unless one goes from a perfectly sterile environment while wearing a sterile suit,then remove the suit before entering the bar,then put it back on when leaving?

What if you stop for gas along the way and the virus is on the pump handle how can you pinpoint that moment of contact?

[jcole]

If 43 people attend the same party and come down with the same virus, it's a damned good bet that they got it at the party....

How exactly does one determine the exact time and date that they caught the virus?

Some say it may take up to 5 days for symptoms to show.

So do you get tested before walking into a bar and then again when leaving?

Unless one goes from a perfectly sterile environment while wearing a sterile suit,then remove the suit before entering the bar,then put it back on when leaving?

What if you stop for gas along the way and the virus is on the pump handle how can you pinpoint that moment of contact?

[Richard]

Or maybe 42 were already effected before attending the party and did not know it,the party brought out the question, then testing occurred.

Thats the thing,outside of saying I was in a large group,that must have been where I caught it,many others caught it without being in a large group.

yes?

Large groups may increase the odds,no different then any other spreadable bug,but as they have said,it can lay in wait on any surface anywhere,even floating through the air.

A party of 2 can spread it to each other.

[jcole]

42 random people had it when they went to the party, but didn't know it, and several days to a week later one more person gets it then they all test positive. Yeah, that'll work....

[Richard]

I would work based on there is not 100% of the population tested every day,what we see is a sampling based on the population size.

8 months into this so far and they do not know,or if it is even possible to know,how many actually have contracted it in some form or another.

You can bet there are millions running around the country that is infected one way or another and may very well be showing no symptoms but without saying,everybody stop and get tested tomorrow,all at the same time it’s all based on best guess.

How many of those 42 were tested before the party?

If large groups are responsible for the spread,should we not be seeing skyrocketing cases in cities that have had large protests with some lasting for over 60 days?

You are talking about groups that have had literally 100s of people in close contact but yet no large outbreaks.

[bust]

There's always a guy who says, "Yeah, but what if? How can you know?"
Like with tobacco and fossil fuels.
[[By the incredibly rigorous standards of science) "It hasn't been proven yet."
They work for high paid PR agencies. They earn as much per hour as the most skillful dishonest lawyers.
Richard is that guy, always on the wrong side of every matter.
But I don't think he works for a PR agency, do you?
Do you think he does this for free?

[Richard]

^ actually I make more per hour then my skillful dishonest lawyer,as usual the ones that think they have it all figured out are the ones wrong most of the time.

Nice comrade to follow the line and not question anything.

Show me where the science has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that everybody has been tested and they can determine the exact time date and location one contracts the corona virus.

There is still a 30% false positive testing rate,so even if you are told you have it,you still do not know.

MDHHS also reports a total of 7,438 probable cases and an additional 246 probable deaths.

What exactly is a probable case?

So maybe you have 7,438 cases and maybe you have 246 deaths.

So the science boils down to the probability of,where I am at the probability of contracting the corona virus is less then 1%
whereas the probability of me getting hit by lightning is 1 in 3000.

Last week people were quick to say the rona virus was devastating Florida and yet as of today it was 5.3%.

So why did it dramatically drop when nobody has done anything different?

Could it be that,it just goes away?

No - no way because they said unless we stay locked down we will never stop the spread but yet here we are with life going on as usual and the numbers continue to drop.

Maybe the science can splain that.

[bust]

Show me where the science has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that everybody has been tested and they can determine the exact time date and location one contracts the corona virus.

By the rigorous standards of science, we can't.
So let's have a frat party, and Jager shots for anyone who bogarts the bong!

[Richard]

^ meh I am sticking with hookers n blow we are all going to be dead in 9.5 years from climate change anyways.

How exactly does one hire a hooker while practicing social distancing? Asking for a friend.

Remember when AIDS first came on the scene,the controversy that surrounded that and all the wild speculation on how one can contract that,it was close to a year before the scientists could clear that one up.

They are only people like you and I,whenever something new comes up it takes time to gather all of the actual facts.

But now that you mention it,I am 60,where is this frat party,it might be fun.