City Club Apartment progress.

**Satiricalivory** · October-24-20, 12:58 PM

It looks fine to me. The internet has been complaining about this development for years, it's time to get over it.

This is actually one of the less offensive designs cityclub has come up with, but I do agree they need to fire whoever their architect/designer is.

**401don** · October-24-20, 01:51 PM

Originally Posted by Satiricalivory

It looks fine to me. The internet has been complaining about this development for years, it's time to get over it.

This is actually one of the less offensive designs cityclub has come up with, but I do agree they need to fire whoever their architect/designer is.

That would be an interesting conversation. Considering the budget you were given, your building looks fine. Therefore you're fired.

**Satiricalivory** · October-24-20, 04:21 PM

Originally Posted by 401don

That would be an interesting conversation. Considering the budget you were given, your building looks fine. Therefore you're fired.

Their other buildings usually have insane wacky materials and colors.

**Danny** · October-24-20, 04:33 PM

That building is fine. In fact lots of people can't wait to move in.

**Dmberko11** · October-24-20, 06:27 PM

Originally Posted by Seven&wyo

I’m so depressed by this....

Lol! That belongs in brush park or midtown or new center, NOT on prime land in downtown. Geeze. Oh well

**EGrant** · October-25-20, 07:53 AM

I'm over complaining about this design. It creates a very nice streetwall on Washington, and should bring some much-needed foot traffic to the area [[and even more when the Book opens). There's plenty of other empty lots we can develop with architectural gems in the future.

**Danny** · October-25-20, 08:33 AM

Originally Posted by Dmberko11

Lol! That belongs in brush park or midtown or new center, NOT on prime land in downtown. Geeze. Oh well

What do you expect? A 100 story New York-esque skyscraper. That you buy with a million dollars?

**Dmberko11** · October-25-20, 11:01 AM

Originally Posted by Danny

What do you respect? A 100 story New York-esque skyscraper. That you buy with a million dollars?

I think it could've been 15-20 stories at least. It just doesn't fit into its neighborhood. I think they could've just waited for the right development. Even if that meant letting it sit for another 10 years undeveloped. Now you have the suburban stick crap that'll be there for the next 50 years!

**Seven&wyo** · October-25-20, 11:30 AM

Originally Posted by Satiricalivory

Their other buildings usually have insane wacky materials and colors.

Can’t I hate them both?

**JonWylie** · October-25-20, 12:07 PM

Originally Posted by Dmberko11

I think it could've been 15-20 stories at least. It just doesn't fit into its neighborhood. I think they could've just waited for the right development. Even if that meant letting it sit for another 10 years undeveloped. Now you have the suburban stick crap that'll be there for the next 50 years!

If you want to keep the footprint, 20 stories would be a massive undertaking that would likely not completely rent out for years. I think this 7 story development is like 250 apartment, so we’re talking at least 500 apartments. Unless they did some mixed uses I couldn’t see a 500+ Apartment development being feasible right now.

I’d rather have a shorter building with a bigger footprint than a tall building on a small lot.

**Gistok** · October-25-20, 01:39 PM

Originally Posted by JonWylie

I’d rather have a shorter building with a bigger footprint than a tall building on a small lot.

You must not visit downtown that much...

**Dmberko11** · October-25-20, 03:16 PM

Originally Posted by JonWylie

If you want to keep the footprint, 20 stories would be a massive undertaking that would likely not completely rent out for years. I think this 7 story development is like 250 apartment, so we’re talking at least 500 apartments. Unless they did some mixed uses I couldn’t see a 500+ Apartment development being feasible right now.

I’d rather have a shorter building with a bigger footprint than a tall building on a small lot.

I'm happy for the 250 apartments, that's a good number. And you're right, it would've had to have been mixed use to go taller if it were to cover the full block because 500 apartments probably wouldn't be feasible. But then again, maybe it is? How has demand for downtown living been? Is it still pretty strong? I live in Texas so I only have you guys and the usual suspects to go to for development news on the region.

**401don** · October-25-20, 04:03 PM

Originally Posted by JonWylie

I’d rather have a shorter building with a bigger footprint than a tall building on a small lot.

Downtowns are supposed to have tall buildings on smaller lots. Twenty storeys wouldn't be considered remotely tall for a residential building overlooking anything similar to Grand Circus Park in most cities. However we know why it was built as it was. They didn't want to spend the money on a steel/concrete highrise.

**Danny** · October-25-20, 04:50 PM

Originally Posted by 401don

Downtowns are supposed to have tall buildings on smaller lots. Twenty storeys wouldn't be considered remotely tall for a residential building overlooking anything similar to Grand Circus Park in most cities. However we know why it was built as it was. They didn't want to spend the money on a steel/concrete highrise.

But those developers spend money on 10,000 cut down trees to build wood frames for apts. What a waste of trees.

**JonWylie** · October-26-20, 07:49 AM

Originally Posted by Gistok

You must not visit downtown that much...

I'm not really sure what that means, but I live in a nice 10 story building and I'd much rather have more of those filling up lots than one huge building. If you have a 20+ story building, you don't get any more store fronts or restaurants at the ground level, you just get more people living above. With the amount of open land, it would be hard to convince a developer to go higher when they could building multiple smaller buildings.

**JonWylie** · October-26-20, 07:52 AM

Originally Posted by 401don

Downtowns are supposed to have tall buildings on smaller lots. Twenty storeys wouldn't be considered remotely tall for a residential building overlooking anything similar to Grand Circus Park in most cities. However we know why it was built as it was. They didn't want to spend the money on a steel/concrete highrise.

Yeah I think this is the tallest they can go wood built. Lots like the Hudson make the most sense for the size, but this lot obviously didn't because if it would make the developer money, they would have went taller. I'm not going to sit here and constantly complain that we're getting a 9 story building with shops, restaurants, and likely 300+ residents. There are a lot of taller buildings in the works, and those will be complimented by the mid size buildings.

**EGrant** · October-26-20, 09:02 AM

There is SO MUCH empty space in downtown Detroit, that I am totally fine with shorter buildings. Even though skyscrapers are cooler, the city needs infill more than it needs towers.

**ShadowSoarer** · October-26-20, 10:42 AM

DC might be a good example where the tallest building is only like 300 feet, but it also still a pretty vibrant city [[similar population to Detroit as well, but smaller in area). If Detroit can build tall skyscrapers in Downtown then great, but if that isn't feasible then multiple smaller buildings are fine as well, just fill in those surface parking lots.

**Gistok** · October-26-20, 10:56 AM

Here is the block while the stick built complex was still under construction. Low lying and flat. Now much of downtown is an assortment of buildings of various heights... some 20 stories, others 5 stories... and that's fine. But this building would have been much improved if say the GCP end had a 20 story tower to it... that would have blended with the rest of the view along Washington Blvd., as we see in the first image. But you can't build a 20 story stick built building.

And also... the "armpit" of this building is so large because it also has a swimming pool at ground level. They couldn't put it on top of the building because stick built buildings cannot carry the heavy weight of a swimming pool.

The 2nd image was taken 5 years ago, before the Book complex had any renovation. Notice that the Statler block doesn't have anything peeking thru the trees. Well that image could have been taken yesterday, because the Statler block still doesn't have anything peeking thru the trees.

Yes we are in a pandemic now... but this isn't Detroit 20 years ago... where the "anything is better than nothing" mentality persisted...

**Gistok** · October-26-20, 11:02 AM

Originally Posted by ShadowSoarer

DC might be a good example where the tallest building is only like 300 feet, but it also still a pretty vibrant city [[similar population to Detroit as well, but smaller in area). If Detroit can build tall skyscrapers in Downtown then great, but if that isn't feasible then multiple smaller buildings are fine as well, just fill in those surface parking lots.

Comparing Detroit to D.C. would be like comparing Paris to London or Frankfurt... it's not a fair comparison, since all [[except the Tour Montparnasse) taller buildings are on the fringes of Paris.

**JonWylie** · October-26-20, 11:43 AM

Originally Posted by Gistok

Here is the block while the stick built complex was still under construction. Low lying and flat. Now much of downtown is an assortment of buildings of various heights... some 20 stories, others 5 stories... and that's fine. But this building would have been much improved if say the GCP end had a 20 story tower to it... that would have blended with the rest of the view along Washington Blvd., as we see in the first image. But you can't build a 20 story stick built building.

And also... the "armpit" of this building is so large because it also has a swimming pool at ground level. They couldn't put it on top of the building because stick built buildings cannot carry the heavy weight of a swimming pool.

The 2nd image was taken 5 years ago, before the Book complex had any renovation. Notice that the Statler block doesn't have anything peeking thru the trees. Well that image could have been taken yesterday, because the Statler block still doesn't have anything peeking thru the trees.

Yes we are in a pandemic now... but this isn't Detroit 20 years ago... where the "anything is better than nothing" mentality persisted...

Everyone agrees that a taller building would have been better, but besides aesthetics, it wouldn't have improved the building much. There would be no increase in street level shops and restaurants, it would have likely increased rent prices, and it would have taken longer to build.

**Gistok** · October-26-20, 05:13 PM

Originally Posted by JonWylie

Everyone agrees that a taller building would have been better, but besides aesthetics, it wouldn't have improved the building much. There would be no increase in street level shops and restaurants, it would have likely increased rent prices, and it would have taken longer to build.

I can agree with much of what you said... but I'm not sure if it would have taken them longer to build... they've been working on that for years... and it is stick built...

**JonWylie** · October-27-20, 08:25 AM

Originally Posted by Gistok

I can agree with much of what you said... but I'm not sure if it would have taken them longer to build... they've been working on that for years... and it is stick built...

Lol I wonder if this or "The Boulevard" took longer to build. Both had to be over 3 years.

**ShadowSoarer** · October-27-20, 10:14 AM

Is the Boulevard technically fully finished yet? Seems like on the ground floor about 50% of the ground level is leased, but the other half isn’t quite finished. Did manage to walk by Elton Park and the Corner and it also seems like a large portion of the Corner for the ground level isn’t finished. Elton Park seems worse since there is still dirt on the entire ground level.

**JonWylie** · October-27-20, 10:24 AM

Originally Posted by ShadowSoarer

Is the Boulevard technically fully finished yet? Seems like on the ground floor about 50% of the ground level is leased, but the other half isn’t quite finished. Did manage to walk by Elton Park and the Corner and it also seems like a large portion of the Corner for the ground level isn’t finished. Elton Park seems worse since there is still dirt on the entire ground level.

I would consider these projects done once the residential portion is done. They still may be waiting on tenants to lease the ground floor for a while.