Stephen Henderson Is Out...

[Wesley Mouch]

^ Yea,I do not know,I have had bars,nightclubs,towing companies,salvage yards,buy here pay here car Lots,quick lubes pretty much all started with nothing,I get bored easy once the challenge of starting something from nothing and building it up to profit is done.

...snip...

The whole he said she said part is scary,just as I would have imagine people felt in the McCarthyism days.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCarthyism

Generalization and prejudice are wrong, even when applied to non-blacks. This idea of 'white privilege' isn't just useless -- its harmful.

Instead of telling someone to work hard, we tell them to be jealous. This, and so much of liberal orthodoxy corrode opportunity.

Is there 'white privilege'. Of course, as a generalization -- yes. Is it something we can act on? No. Building up is better than tearing down.

Thanks, Richard.

[southen]

It is accurate.

Who is telling anyone to be jealous? My fiance is a teacher in Detroit who deals with students and parents daily and for the life of me I can't recall her telling me of any instances where people are being told to be jealous and not work hard. Opportunity is not spread equally across the board, no matter how much you would like to pretend it to be. Furthermore, it isn't about YOU. Why is it whenever something like this is brought up white individuals take it as some affront to their accomplishments as opposed to a societal problem? Nobody is tearing anyone down. You are not a victim in this conversation.

It is something you can act on btw, it just doesn't fit your ideology so you choose to ignore possible solutions.

[Smirnoff]

Anyone believe a plea bargain will be made to avoid hard time......?

[Richard]

Anyone believe a plea bargain will be made to avoid hard time......?

They would have to have some really solid proof until then it is just allegations and character attacks.

I wonder if I could use my white privilege and get a job at a big corporation that has a woman CEO,work there a couple of days and then say that she said if I wanted to advance real quick I would have to sleep with her.I could probably make some quick cash.

I wonder if the ones that fought so hard to keep women from the work place are up there wagging a finger saying,see, we told you nothing good would come from this.

[aj3647]

If asking somebody out at work and getting turned down is harassment, then we might as well go ahead and fire every male employee in the country. I'm married to a former coworker. Would I have been guilty of harassment if she said no when I asked her out? I have great sympathy for women who have been harassed or worse but some of these stories of "harassment" are just innocuous behavior that for some reason is taken as offensive.

Which stories are "innocuous behavior?" Specifically. Go ahead and provide some examples. I'd love to see the plethora of examples of men being fired for politely asking out a female coworker once, getting rejected, and then not pursing the matter further. Go ahead and shock me with some links!

Spare us your male victimhood BS. Nobody is getting fired for simply asking a co-worker out once.

And of course, the self-appointed expert in what women should consider offensive is DrJeff. Geez ladies, lighten up! If DrJeff doesn't see a problem with it, then obviously there is no problem with it! Is that sort of like how white dudes are the best judges of what is and isn't racist?

[Richard]

It is something you can act on btw, it just doesn't fit your ideology so you choose to ignore possible solutions.

So we had an African American president for 8 years,Detroit has had African American mayors for how many years?

The Detroit board of Education is comprised of African Americans all who are well aware of a decades old problem but have been unable to adress it.

So how has the inner city school systems improved in the last 50 years or even the last 10.

So other then leaning on it is the white persons fault argument,what is your solution?

I say we cannot change the past or use it as an excuse and look to the quasi independent school board for recommendations and hold their feet to the fire while also supporting their recommendations.

Or who knows maybe it is a long term plot by the Russians to undermine our economy by not allowing everybody to reach their full potential.

[southen]

So we had an African American president for 8 years,Detroit has had African American mayors for how many years?

The Detroit board of Education is comprised of African Americans all who are well aware of a decades old problem but have been unable to adress it.

So how has the inner city school systems improved in the last 50 years or even the last 10.

So other then leaning on it is the white persons fault argument,what is your solution?

I say we cannot change the past or use it as an excuse and look to the quasi independent school board for recommendations and hold their feet to the fire while also supporting their recommendations.

Or who knows maybe it is a long term plot by the Russians to undermine our economy by not allowing everybody to reach their full potential.

It is not about you as a white person. I know selfishness is one of the key components of the conservative ideology but try to think about other communities. For a group of people that hates the "victim mentality" you sure have no problem invoking it when it comes to this topic.

How much power for change did BO have to help inner cities with a conservative congress? How much could these black mayors do with a dwindling tax base and little to no support from the state? Being in positions of power is great, but the system itself doesn't necessarily allow them to do what is necessary to fix the situation.

The inner city school systems struggle due to poor leadership, from the state on down, and lack of funds. When we adopt a system where school funding is tied to property values the inner city kids will always have a tougher road to success. The solution is putting more resources into the Detroit school system, but people of your ilk will cry foul and claim that isn't fair or that we are picking winners or losers.

Not using the past is a convenient argument. In case you were wondering what white privilege was or how you were practicing look no further than that particular view point. The past is represented in the city we have today and the struggles that came from it.

Since it is just lazy people who aren't successful do you think there are extra hardships to endure for a child growing up in a city with abandoned burnt out buildings that they have to pass daily, that they have to be worried about their safety from said buildings. What about the rampant crime in their neighborhoods, could that have an affect on their ability to reach potential? How about woefully understaffed and underfunded schools in crumbling buildings? Since things are so damn equal that shouldn't affect them right? Opportunity isn't equal across the board and until it is made such there will be a continuing disparity. Acting like all people have to do is try harder is a naive argument, especially in the face of statistics that show it is exponentially tougher to be successful when you are a person of color living in the city.

But sure, it is either the Russians, OR ideologues who are incapable of empathy. One or the other.

[Richard]

^ so what is your solution? You said people are ingoring possible solutions.

Or you can just wait for a governmental solution because that has proven to work so well.

People of my ilk ? That's funny I believe the stronger each individual city is and what that entails the stronger we are as a country,or we can just support massive immigration and bury the problems.

If that is ilk then ilky I am .

Tomorrow is another day.

[southen]

I am fairly certain I laid out what is necessary. Better facilities and funding to start. I would add in teaching civics and basic life skills and prioritizing those things for young people in the city.

A government solution can work, it really depends what party is in power though. As long as Michigan remains as gerrymandered as it is you will continue to see conservatives control the state legislature which means funding for education in the city will remain an issue.

So a private solution like charters? Yeah, there is plenty of data showing that they are just as poor performing as public schools. In fact Henderson did a great series of articles on the subject to bring things full circle. My fiance also works for a charter in the city, if you think they are a solution then you really don't understand how they work in practice.

Yes your ilk. The kind that loves to espouse conservative platitudes while ignoring possible real world solution for the sake of the ideology.

"That's funny I believe the stronger each individual city is and what that entails the stronger we are as a country"

You could run for office with that drivel. It means absolutely nothing, especially if you think all cities are on equal footing.

[Richard]

So in other words you have no solutions,just ideas based on what you are told backed up by reasons why they would not work.

You do realize that just because charters did not work in Detroit it does not meen that they are not successful in other cities,so instead of looking at why they did not succeed there your stance is charters are bad everywhere.

The president elect says let's build a wall,1/2 the country rallies with protests.

An officer shoots somebody and before it is investigated half of the country rallies and burns cites.

25 years ago somebody kissed somebody and half the country rallies to burn half of the male population at the stake.

You kinda get the jist of it,so where is the outcry when it comes to inner cities?

People do not care, because it is not a problem that they can comprehend,it does not effect them,at this point it has zero to do with racism,or white privilege or politics and everything to do with the voice of the people.

There is no solution to fix the system without getting people to think outside of their personal space.It takes a village,it is a twofold problem that involves in the home as well as in school.

But it is easier to place blame and tell everybody else it is all of their fault and it is because of them and their ilk that we are in this situation.

Again,nobody cares about a situation that they either are unaware of or never experienced,you votes are the ones that puts people in office and they remain there for 40 years while the top still spins in the same spot.

A local reporter writes a story about local charters to a local audience that is already well aware of the situation,that is like a street performer walking up and down the Ave ringing a bell and telling everybody that Ford started in Detroit.

Meh it is just filler while we are waiting on Mr Henderson results,we did have this same conversation 3 years ago and here we are again still in the same place.

You are a professional photographer,have you ever taken one day and told the story from the kids aspect to show the rest of the country? Or ruin porn was more popular and photogenic and more of a priority?

See how that works.

[Zacha341]

Hey, I know you like to boss-talk and intimidate some on this board but in this case, please PUMP your brakes!

SO, I made a mistake in typing misconduct when I should have said "assault". Walking the plank, firing squad or hanging? You ain't gon-na' do neither [[And yes I used slang here for emphasis).

Back to standard English: Sounds like your sensibilities are a bit askew. You chose to read into what I wrote that I'm endorsing or dismissing misconduct and assault? I do not.

Check this: A young teen, under a secluded train viaduct in Detroit, I endured an assault that ended only by my successfully fighting off a craven male teen [[we attended the same school - which is why I stopped peddling to talk to him). He brutally tried to take my bike and possibly more [[per his comments) had I not fought him off. My parents quickly pursued the case and he was dealt with. That was my response.

I was young, a female, a teen who SPOKE OUT, you dig?

And yet I understand why that option's not available for all depending on many circumstances. And the statute of limitation for children abused brings forth other considerations - I get that.

It's not about my sensibilities or even yours relative to WHY these old [[some now over 40-50 years) cases are now coming forth. It's not all about morality or delayed retribution either. This is much bigger than that.

As I clearly stated: "Setting aside guilt or innocence of those involved..." the worldview of accusation without proof has historically been problematic at the political, social and policy level.

And yes, also I'm woman enough to say it: some women lie, just as some men do.

It was his choice to kill himself and he was not accused of "misconduct", he was accused of ASSAULT, as in molesting someone under the age of 18. That's not misconduct, that's a felony.

No rape victim should stay silent to appease YOUR sensibilities or those of their rapist. If you don't like that these women are speaking out, tough shit.

[southen]

One, the problem isn't beyond comprehension, it is beyond a conservative to solve. What do good suburban schools have that Detroit doesn't? Proper facilities, more funding, retention of teaching talent. If you want to fix something that is broken do you go above and beyond or do you treat it the same as something that isn't broken?

Sure, charter schools may work elsewhere, but we are talking about Detroit. In Michigan, propped up by conservative education principles we have charters that go unchecked and have less oversight than public schools. I would care a lot more about what you have to say if liberals were in control of funding but they aren't.

Oh and I would love to hear YOUR solutions to solve the issue other than the very vague concept of getting government out of the process.

You are a professional photographer,have you ever taken one day and told the story from the kids aspect to show the rest of the country? Or ruin porn was more popular and photogenic and more of a priority?

Since you feel the need to bring up my job I happen to work for several foundations where all I do is produce work showcasing the city and its residents to the rest of the country and world. I just so happen to donate work to charities where the money goes towards helping the less fortunate in the city. I would also like to thank you for following my work but I hate to inform you that I haven't taken a "ruin porn" shot since 2009.

[Zacha341]

Interesting points L. Response can speak volumes, and if Henderson is seeking legal counsel he's showing some determination to push-back against the accusations.

Far from naive, I say this understanding that you can get a defense attorney to DEFEND anything and those not innocent are defended along with the just.

Still, we have had many of the recently accused packing-it-out without much comment of defense. Some openly admitting their conduct/ assault/ actions minimal post amble so far.

Oh, yeah indeed, I agree: 'Stay tuned'....

...In his statement he asserted there were two events that Gannett cited as the basis of his dismissal from the Free Press. One was an off-color remark, the second was that he twice made un-wanted advances. The events were several years in the past. He asserted that he has had friendly relations with both women since. He felt the dismissal was unfair and he was investigating legal recourses. He apologized for any harm that may have occurred.

[JBMcB]

What do good suburban schools have that Detroit doesn't? Proper facilities, more funding, retention of teaching talent.

Detroit spends $13,000 per pupil. It's in the top 50 in per-pupil expenditures. It's about the same as Birmingham. Troy, one of the top ranked school districts in the state, spends $8,000 per pupil.

Over the last 30 years, the refrain has been "we need more money," for the Detroit school district. The state has pumped more and more aid into it. Academic performance has worsened.

At what point do you say that more money isn't working, and something else has to change?

[Bham1982]

Detroit spends $13,000 per pupil. It's in the top 50 in per-pupil expenditures. It's about the same as Birmingham. Troy, one of the top ranked school districts in the state, spends $8,000 per pupil.

Over the last 30 years, the refrain has been "we need more money," for the Detroit school district. The state has pumped more and more aid into it. Academic performance has worsened.

At what point do you say that more money isn't working, and something else has to change?

Detroit should get more money than a Birmingham, obviously. They have tons of high needs kids. Detroit kids are 90% poverty, very high % special ed, lots of English as second language, etc. There are tons of additional expenses compared to a Birmingham, from security, to transportation to supplies.

And it's a logical reasoning fail to assume that money is wasted because Detroit gets a lot of money and school performance is poor. It's a very complicated issue, with lots of variables.

I am fairly certain, though, that cutting Detroit school funding would not benefit Detroit kids. They need more money, not less.

[aj3647]

It's not about my sensibilities or even yours relative to WHY these old [[some now over 40-50 years) cases are now coming forth. It's not all about morality or delayed retribution either. This is much bigger than that.

They're coming forward now because the social climate has evolved to the point where people are finally willing to listen to them and take action instead of ignoring them or actively trying to silence them. Same reason why 50+ years of sex abuse in the Catholic Church exploded onto the public scene all at once.

Or let me guess, all those people who came forward with claims of being molested by a priest 40-50 years ago were lying and had some nefarious agenda?

Now by all means, go back to feeling sorry for some POS who killed himself.

[southen]

Im stealing that Catholic Church analogy. That is the perfect response.

[Zacha341]

I do agree the social climate is part of it.

Nope, not going back to a place I never was [[feeling sorry). Sarcasm noted to your favor.

And no, I never said time frame meant that all were lying. The attempted attack up my person was over 40 years ago. Some may be lying about an incident that occurred last week.

And uh, nope, wrong 'GUESS' on your part: I'm not catholic nor do I reflexively find all the claims nefarious therein. Those are your words [[and guesses).

They [[the catholics) best carry their own water on that one.

They're coming forward now because the social climate has evolved to the point where people are finally willing to listen to them and take action instead of ignoring them or actively trying to silence them. Same reason why 50+ years of sex abuse in the Catholic Church exploded onto the public scene all at once.

Or let me guess, all those people who came forward with claims of being molested by a priest 40-50 years ago were lying and had some nefarious agenda?

Now by all means, go back to feeling sorry for some POS who killed himself.

[gnome]

Stephen went through a divorce a few years back, right around the time these incidents in question occurred.

For those who have never had the pleasure of going through a divorce let me fill you in on a truth: you have no idea how to date women because you are completely out of practice.

In fact, ones working knowledge of the dating scene may be decades old. So, if you are 40-45 yrs old your dating skills might be those of an 18 or 19-yr-old.

Chatting up the ladies with your mad Napoleon Dynamite dating skillz when you are 45 and have gray hair is going to lead to hilarious results if you are a stand-up standing up.

If you're clicking glasses at a party that hilarity is going to come off as creepy.

And, in today's environment it is going to get you fired.

Zacha, my comments are not directed at your situation, just the new dating moonscape.

[Zacha341]

^^^ No problem G. I get what yo' putting down....... Dating has to be a mess these days. Compared to years ago. One of my friends does that speed-dating thing! Whatever you do you best be blunt on the subjects of personality types, expectations and boundaries. With little ambiguity!

The game of playing-hard-to-get [[for those so inclined) must be jettisoned. Fill out your menu card in detail and determine quickly if your are at the right restaurant! Make that menu in triplicate, for records sake!!

[aj3647]

I find it more than ironic that many of those on the side of the political fence that championed the concept of "at-will" employment laws [[where employers can legally fire any employee any time for any reason they want) are now up in arms that men are getting fired for sexual harassment allegations.

I mean, an employer has the RIGHT to fire any employee they want for whatever they want whenever they want, right conservatives?

[Richard]

^ that is kinda of a weak basis,can you show how many that have been accused are members of a union verses right to work?

The majority so far have been actress and actors who are unionized and also members of the actors guild,a double whammy of protection.

One or two senators in the south but the rest have been up in cold country which leans towards unions,but it is the conservatives fault?

If one is in a bar trying to pick up a woman,do they ask if they are in a union or not,let alone who they voted for or if they contribute to the save the endangered Indonesian earth worm,when it comes to that goal it is a straight line thought to the objective,bluntly speaking,thinking with the wrong head knows no boundaries and gets many in trouble.

[Richard]

Stephen went through a divorce a few years back, right around the time these incidents in question occurred.

For those who have never had the pleasure of going through a divorce let me fill you in on a truth: you have no idea how to date women because you are completely out of practice.

In fact, ones working knowledge of the dating scene may be decades old. So, if you are 40-45 yrs old your dating skills might be those of an 18 or 19-yr-old.

Chatting up the ladies with your mad Napoleon Dynamite dating skillz when you are 45 and have gray hair is going to lead to hilarious results if you are a stand-up standing up.

If you're clicking glasses at a party that hilarity is going to come off as creepy.

And, in today's environment it is going to get you fired.

Zacha, my comments are not directed at your situation, just the new dating moonscape.

Mature dating has its challenges,you are not shure weather to bring a bottle of wine or offer a Prozac for the ones that are coming out of the 30 year bad boy fixation.

We jest but really there are still a lot of good respectful women and men out there left,the Internet is there for the ones on both sides where it is common knowlage of what is expected from both parties at the end of the evening,but long term is still old school to me,take the time to get to know each other and no smooching on the first date.

Of course there is also the whole mail order bride thing,point,click,order three weeks later delivered to the airport closest to you for pick up.

I guess they were not kidding when they said technology would make life easier.

[Zacha341]

Hah! Yeah the time in getting to know someone and extra caution of not getting physical fast until you know what you're working with ain't all bad. Talk it out to see if there's interest without the blur/ distraction/ and ambiguity of the other stuff. Less romantic? Perhaps, but best for clarity.

...Internet is there for the ones on both sides where it is common knowledge of what is expected from both parties at the end of the evening, but long term is still old school to me, take the time to get to know each other and no smooching on the first date.

[Hypestyles]

the optics are very bizarre now for Mr. Henderson- he still has two very high profile jobs after one was lost. I guess we'll see how this evolves.
$90K for the WDET job? Wow. Not hating, but.. wow.

The National Association of Black Journalists will have its 2018 national conference in Detroit in August. I suspect that sexual harassment journalism coverage and news workplace culture will be part of the panel discussions.