New York terrorist driving truck kills many - wounds others....

[Zacha341]

Remembering the victims of the NY attack...

[canuck]

What needs to be elevated in the discussion?

The immigrants of today are far different then the immigrants that helped build this country,so it needs to be looked at differently.

I live in a heavy immigrant community,from all corners of the globe,75% of the people that I deal with on a daily basis have been in this country less then 5 years.

Two common denominators.

1 they are shocked that they actually have to work hard to get ahead,because thier impression of this country before coming here was that we are a rich country and everybody lives in a big house and drives a new car without having to work for it.

2 The majority,not all,has no loyalty to this country,they are here for one reason and one reason only,to make money,and they have a right to that.

Most of them feel like a cashier should be making the same monies as skilled labor and as they are coming from a poor country they should be able to pay everybody what they feel is right based on zero research or knowlage of how our system works.

When an American born citizen has to bear more scrutiny to prove that they are citizens then certain immigrants,there is a problem.

The solution is easy,just pick how many Americans are worth sacrificing in order to have infrettered access to this country.

The reality is there is no middle ground,it is thier job to kill everybody that they do not agree with and our job to prevent them from doing that.

That is thier job 24/7 365 to figure out how to kill as many as possible,why is that such a hard thing to grasp.

It is our personal responsibility as Americans to put our country and our fellow Americans first and foremost,it is the duty of the federal government to protect our borders and in turn protect United States citizens.

If people have a problem with that then they need to seriously think about where thier loyalties lie or maybe it is time to find another country,good luck with that considering we do have some of the most liberal immigration policies and penalties around.

So now because NY has a gun ban the next step is to ban airplanes and Home Depot trucks with high capacity fuel tanks,that should make everybody safe,right ?

Are you listening to your own police chief when he talks about how many attacks they have prevented so far,this is not just a random event,there is an ongoing assault across the country.

That’s a hell of a lot of cashiers wanting to kill you Richard, be careful steppin’ out of that there pickup truck...

Don’t want to rain on your parade but, watch out for non immigrant types doing damage without the high capacity fuel tanks you mentioned in Small town Texas. Heck, they may be fair skinned and 2nd amendment lovers after all. Who knows. it’s a complicated whirled.

[oladub]

That’s a hell of a lot of cashiers wanting to kill you Richard, be careful steppin’ out of that there pickup truck...

Don’t want to rain on your parade but, watch out for non immigrant types doing damage without the high capacity fuel tanks you mentioned in Small town Texas. Heck, they may be fair skinned and 2nd amendment lovers after all. Who knows. it’s a complicated whirled.

It was another white guy who checked the box to indicate he didn't have disqualifying criminal history when he filled out the background check paperwork. Actually he did have a disqualifying criminal history as he was kicked out of the Air Force for beating up his wife and kid but he lied. The neighbor with a gun did more good than background check gun legislation in this case. I wonder if the white guy from Uzbekistan lied about the 23 other Uzbeks he decided to let in to the US actually being his close relatives. That's quite a system; allowing Islamic terrorists chosen in a lottery choose 23 additional immigrants of their own choice. It must make sense to Democrats. DNA tests only cost about $100 but our government chooses to look the other way. No one in government vets the background gun paperwork or the chain immigration immigrants very carefully.

Of course killing 8 people with a rent-a-truck isn't so bad compared with killing 3,000 with boxcutters and airliners or eventually much larger numbers with WMDs. Therein lies a difference. We can be fairly confident that right wing nuts or crazies who want to take out an abortion clinic or shoot up country music fans for reasons unknown wouldn't use backpack nukes if they could get their hands on them. Mohammed Atta probably would have. Just as we didn't anticipate three planes flying into buildings on 9/11, the left seems unable and unwilling to anticipate something much bigger.

[aj3647]

Here are your words exactly:

Just out of curiosity, why did you bring up Trump at all? What did he have to do with someone killing this individual with their vehicle?

Yes, those were my words. And as a matter of fact, that was the one and only time I ever used the word "Trump" in that entire thread. Now here's what MF-ing liar Honkey Tonk falsely accused me of saying in that thread:

Yet when some bonehead drove his vehicle into a crowd of protesters, you were the first one advocating for Trump's head on a platter, accusing him of sending in Nazi's to slaughter innocent people.

So feel free to point out where in that quote of mine I do either one of those things, where I "advocate for Trump's head on a platter" or "accuse him of sending in Nazis to slaughter people." I said no such thing. None. You just fucking proved it. All I ever said was the the neo-Nazi driving the Dodge Challenger was a Trump supporter. That is a factual statement. Want proof? Here you go:

http://heavy.com/news/2017/08/james-...-hitler-trump/

Now I will do you the courtesy of answering your question. Why did I bring up Trump at all? Well aside from the fact that the terrorist in question was both an avowed white supremacists and a Trump supporter, I brought it up because I firmly believe that Trump has encouraged and emboldened the white supremacist "Alt Right" with his words and actions, including people like James Alex Fields. Fields' own mother told the press that she believed her son's decision to go to Charlottesville had "something to do with Trump."

Now since I answered your question, you answer mine. Was Honkey Tonk lying when he accused me of saying those things about Trump? Yes or no? He very specifically accused me of saying some very specific things, did I say them? Yes or no?

[aj3647]

That's quite a system; allowing Islamic terrorists chosen in a lottery choose 23 additional immigrants of their own choice. It must make sense to Democrats.

The 1990 Immigration Act [[which contained the diversity visa lottery program) had bipartisan support [[it got a 89-8 vote in the Senate) and was signed into law by Republican President George HW Bush. But yeah, it was just the Democrats. They're the only ones that voted for it, right? And that Democrat Bush signed it into law! Mitch McConnell voted for it too, back in 1990. Remind me again what position he holds today?

Of course killing 8 people with a rent-a-truck isn't so bad compared with killing 3,000 with boxcutters and airliners or eventually much larger numbers with WMDs. Therein lies a difference. We can be fairly confident that right wing nuts or crazies who want to take out an abortion clinic or shoot up country music fans for reasons unknown wouldn't use backpack nukes if they could get their hands on them. Mohammed Atta probably would have. Just as we didn't anticipate three planes flying into buildings on 9/11, the left seems unable and unwilling to anticipate something much bigger.

On what insane grounds can you sit there and assert that the Las Vegas shooter wouldn't have used a backpack nuke if he had access to one? It's plainly obvious his goal was to kill as many people as he could before he died himself. But yeah, it's only Muslims who would use such weapons if they had the chance, right?

Remember that prior to 9/11, the largest death toll from a terror attack on American soil was thanks to radical Right Wing white extremist named Timothy McVeigh, who used a Ryder truck full of ammonium nitrate. You think he wouldn't have used a nuke if he could have?

The notion that only Muslims could do such a thing is total 100% bullshit. Remember the 2001 anthrax attacks? A white dude did that.

[Richard]

I think the point was if we cannot vet an American citizen with a life long history how is it expected to vet somebody else from a foreign country with no records.

What was the death toll at the Branch Dravidian?

At this rate, Chicago is expected to see 3,600 to 4,200 people shot in 3,200-3,500 shootings by the end of the year.

[oladub]

aj, I said nothing about who voted for anything in 1990.Please refrain from making insinuations. I am just as opposed to W. Bush's cheap labor immigration policy or Reagan's amnesty as Obama's and most other Democrats'. But this chain immigration idiocy supported by every Democrat I know has resulted in, in this case, a terrorist choosing 23 "relatives" or somebody to move to the US. Imagine that; here we have a terrorist directing our immigration. There aren't even any DNA tests given to prove these are real relatives. How stupid can we be to let this go on?

Part of your problem is that you are trying to shift the discussion to a 1990 law. It was instead the 1965 National Immigration Act that brought on the chain migration by a Democratic Congress and President Johnson who also brought us the Vietnam War. DEMOCRATS! That is, of course, assuming those brought in are actually relatives.

Abortion clinic bombers and the Las Vegas shooter were not hooked up to Wahhabi financiers and/or Islamic governments. Mohammed Atta was and his ideological heirs will be. Unlike you, I do not sweep 9/11 under the rug. I also perceive more such attacks probably with larger weapons in our future. So yes, outside of hostile governments, major threats are usually religion related. I do remember McVeigh and Terry Nichols. But McVeigh seemed to be attempting to avenge some personal issues and/or was avenging Waco. He wasn't promoting his religion and, as far as I know, he didn't have significant foreign ties or funding to buy backpack nukes or other trinkets. Big difference. He might have rented a bigger Ryder truck though. The numbers are in and on a per capita basis some small fraction of the Muslim population is doing far more than their share of ideological terrorist killings.

Regarding the 1965 National Immigration Act: "The elevation of the family unification preference ultimately facilitated a process of chain migration. An engineer from India with a U.S. job offer or a Korean woman married to a member of the U.S. military, once naturalized as U.S. citizens, could sponsor the immigration of all their brothers and sisters plus their spouses, who in time could arrange for the immigration of their own siblings."

[313WX]

Now I will do you the courtesy of answering your question. Why did I bring up Trump at all? Well aside from the fact that the terrorist in question was both an avowed white supremacists and a Trump supporter, I brought it up because I firmly believe that Trump has encouraged and emboldened the white supremacist "Alt Right" with his words and actions, including people like James Alex Fields. Fields' own mother told the press that she believed her son's decision to go to Charlottesville had "something to do with Trump."

So Honky Tonk was correct when he accused you of claiming Trump was responsible for he incident in Charlottesville.

Thanks for the clarification!

[Zacha341]

That pesky little detail does seem to emerge doesn't it?

I think the point was if we cannot vet an American citizen with a life long history how is it expected to vet somebody else from a foreign country with no records.

[aj3647]

So Honky Tonk was correct when he accused you of claiming Trump was responsible for he incident in Charlottesville.

Thanks for the clarification!

The intellectual dishonesty is astounding. Dasvidaniya, comrade!