Welcome to Dem Land

**Zacha341** · February-14-20, 02:13 PM

Like former president Obama's warning against 'circular firing squads' ala the purity tests/ in fighting in the dem party....

https://www.cnn.com/videos/tv/2019/0...k-4-7-2019.cnn

Originally Posted by Richard

^ pretty much sums up the current Democratic Party in 8 frames or less.

**ABetterDetroit** · February-15-20, 01:00 AM

Originally Posted by bust

Bloomberg was my mayor for 12 years.
He's definitely not perfect, but he's eminently capable.
He was very wrong on stop-and-frisk [[as I have often argued on this forum with that ardent stop-and-frisk defender, Wesley Mouch).
And he was right about most of the rest.

Here's what Henry Louis Gates, Jr. said about him:

"Among all the candidates, the person who I believe could stand toe-to-toe, strongest and longest with Donald Trump is Mike Bloomberg.

Why? Who do you think his constituency is? I know Mike Bloomberg socially. Every summer I go to a dinner on Martha’s Vineyard with Mike Bloomberg. I’ve argued with him about policies that I didn’t like. He is enormously intelligent and capable. When he was mayor, I watched him. He could wear it lightly. It’s not like Jimmy Carter with the weight of the world on him. I think that he’s tough, and I think he could take on the bully Donald Trump. Very few people can stand up to a bully. Mike’s got some bully in him. I think he’s good.

“Stop and frisk” isn’t too much of a problem for him? He faces two problems that he has to overcome. He has already apologized for “stop and frisk,” but he has to put it behind him, and also the Central Park Five. What the city and the legal structure did to those five boys was shameful. The mayor has to put that behind him. If he’s successful doing that, I think black people want him, because he is smart, sensitive, strong. I think he cares about health care. He understands the economic system. This is not an endorsement. But I would support him if he got the nomination."

I would enthusiastically vote for him if he's the democratic candidate too.

I am hearing a lot of of support for Bloomberg lately from people I know who voted Trump 2016 on the single issue of he would lower their taxes. Another significantly sized group that pushed him into his narrow victory.

Many of these people are real unhappy with the tweets, idiocy, his lack of morals and respectability. Now they feel guilt that it wasn’t worth it for the paltry saving in their brackets. They just want him gone and what they are saying is “I will vote for Bloomberg for sure if I have the chance but I will not vote for Bernie no matter what.”

These next 6 weeks are critical to winning the general. No time to bail and just go with whoever. Pick the candidate that has the very best chance to beat Trump and by the highest margin. That is all that matters now.

**Maof** · February-15-20, 09:19 AM

Originally Posted by ABetterDetroit

I am hearing a lot of of support for Bloomberg lately from people I know who voted Trump 2016 on the single issue of he would lower their taxes. Another significantly sized group that pushed him into his narrow victory.

Many of these people are real unhappy with the tweets, idiocy, his lack of morals and respectability. Now they feel guilt that it wasn’t worth it for the paltry saving in their brackets. They just want him gone and what they are saying is “I will vote for Bloomberg for sure if I have the chance but I will not vote for Bernie no matter what.”

These next 6 weeks are critical to winning the general. No time to bail and just go with whoever. Pick the candidate that has the very best chance to beat Trump and by the highest margin. That is all that matters now.

This is what I've heard all week as well. He is not my first choice but if it gets Trump out of office, I'm all for it. "Carnival barking dog"...lol

**jcole** · February-15-20, 09:57 AM

Originally Posted by Maof

This is what I've heard all week as well. He is not my first choice but if it gets Trump out of office, I'm all for it. "Carnival barking dog"...lol

"Vote Blue, no matter who"

**Richard** · February-15-20, 12:09 PM

Originally Posted by ABetterDetroit

I am hearing a lot of of support for Bloomberg lately from people I know who voted Trump 2016 on the single issue of he would lower their taxes. Another significantly sized group that pushed him into his narrow victory.

Many of these people are real unhappy with the tweets, idiocy, his lack of morals and respectability. Now they feel guilt that it wasn’t worth it for the paltry saving in their brackets. They just want him gone and what they are saying is “I will vote for Bloomberg for sure if I have the chance but I will not vote for Bernie no matter what.”

These next 6 weeks are critical to winning the general. No time to bail and just go with whoever. Pick the candidate that has the very best chance to beat Trump and by the highest margin. That is all that matters now.

What do you consider a lot of support for Bloomberg?

Most remember him for stop and frisk [[That now he apologizes for after affecting the lives of 1000s) and trying to regulate the size of the soda that they drink.

I do not know about your circles but 95% of the people that I deal with do not discuss politics,know what Trump tweets or are triggered by every tweet that they do hear.

They are busy running businesses and taking care of their families,the Trump supporters that I do know are going to vote for him again and really for the most part do not discuss him in public because of the attacks and the first argument the left comes up with is labeling.

Its that silent majority that bit the left in the rear in 2016,they look at if he has kept his promises and is looking out for the best interests of the country,the rest is the same politics that has going on Sense the republic was founded.

If you are hearing a lot,maybe it is because you hang around with a closed vocal group that is not indicative of thoughts in the bigger picture.

There are staunch party supporters on both sides but most are adult enough to see through the rhetoric and have the common sense not to just vote for somebody/anybody because they can beat Trump,but maybe they are just a part of a group that still believes that there are consequences for actions.

I think if Stalin was running people would vote for him if they thought he could beat Trump,they would not care of the consequences,unless of course it was them that was being thrown up against the wall and frisked for just walking down the road.

Notice how the academy awards has been losing support as has the NFL,you will not see the silent majority yelling about kids drinking from toilets or tearing down or burning everything that offends them or picketing a business because it offended somebody in their mind.

They are going to do exactly what they are doing,show the support for the candidate by showing up by the thousands at rallies and when it comes time to vote they will show their support there once again.

Anybody over the age of 6 knows that nothing is free in life and the promises of things need to be paid for.

Keep running on the basis of the only thing that you have to offer is the ability to beat Trump and watch how that goes.

Circus act is right,they are up there entertaining with no substance.

Ringling bros circus never disappeared,they created the monster truck jams,so all that protesting about animal rights abuses that was proven false in the end,all it did was take a triggered moment with the end result of depriving future generations of children of their day at the circus.

I guess if one lives in a predominantly blue city the odds are that you run across more like minded then not,which stands to reason,but when you look at the map of voting in 2016 that whole electoral vote kick in and did what it was designed to do.

Used car salesmen are a dime a dozen,there is a reason some are successful while others are not.

**Maof** · February-15-20, 12:38 PM

Richard.....Trump was all for stop and frisk in New York and Chicago as recently as 2016. A simple google search will tell you that. Now he's singing a different tune ONLY because it's dirt on Bloomberg. Bloomberg did apologize something, the Donald would never do.

**oladub** · February-15-20, 01:49 PM

Age of the probable next President upon taking office after the 2020 election:

Trump 74+
Hillary 73+
Buttigieg 39 years 1 day [[39.1)
Gabbard 39.283
Klobuchar 60.240
Steyer 63.207
Warren 71.212
Hillary 73+
Trump 74+
Biden 78.61
Bloomberg 78.341
Sanders 79.134

Bloomberg might be considering Hillary for his VP. The DNC loves Hillary and Bloomberg's money so this might work.

**Richard** · February-15-20, 01:50 PM

Maof

has he shown any support for it while in office.

You also have to remember that he was once a registered Democrat,so he may still have some taint left over.

Here is an article from back in 2016 raising the issue that he was not really a tried and true conservative.

https://lidblog.com/donald-trump-has...es-since-1987/

You are overlooking that no matter what he may have done in the past,he has a 3 year track record of what he has done while in office,that is what people are going to look at,in case you have not noticed even with all the dirt people came up with he still won and nobody really cares about what happened before.

That is the thing,you have progressives that want to up end things with radical change with no clear plan on how to do that,that scares people.

The end results are going to be based on if people prefer to be comfortable as they are verses the unknown that radical change brings.

Most people are not comfortable with scorched earth policies,weather they Personally like Trump is irrelevant,they do not need to like him in order to support him,it is based on policy.

Everybody wants affordable healthcare,that is not some kind of ground breaking news,they have to be able to sell it and they lost a lot of support when Obama could not.

Most are aware of how intrenched our healthcare system is and know you cannot change it systematically just like that,it would take 20 years with a massive overhaul of the system and bring millions into the unknown.

Stating the obvious is easy,coming up with a solution is another and selling it to the public is another.

**jcole** · February-15-20, 05:56 PM

Originally Posted by oladub

Age of the probable next President upon taking office after the 2020 election:

Trump 74+
Hillary 73+
Buttigieg 39 years 1 day [[39.1)
Gabbard 39.283
Klobuchar 60.240
Steyer 63.207
Warren 71.212
Hillary 73+
Trump 74+
Biden 78.61
Bloomberg 78.341
Sanders 79.134

Bloomberg might be considering Hillary for his VP. The DNC loves Hillary and Bloomberg's money so this might work.

Does including them twice make them more important or did your copy/paste just go wrong?

**oladub** · February-15-20, 07:16 PM

Originally Posted by jcole

Does including them twice make them more important or did your copy/paste just go wrong?

I looked up Trump and Hillary's age, added a list of Democratic candidates from elsewhere, spliced Trump and Hillary in, but should have cut and pasted instead of copied and pasted.

My concern though had to do with the geriatric aspect. 6 of these 11 will be over 71.The oldest person to be elected to a first term was Trump who became President at the age of 70 years, 220 days. Trump and Hillary are getting up there. Add a few years for Biden, Sanders and Bloomberg who are already too old. Biden is the only one having a lot of senior moments. Hillary coughs and stumbles sometimes. Trump is overweight. Sanders is still sharp but had a recent heart attack. This is a stressful job involving some overnighters.

**Pam** · February-15-20, 07:30 PM

Originally Posted by oladub

Bloomberg might be considering Hillary for his VP. The DNC loves Hillary and Bloomberg's money so this might work.

Dumb idea. Hillary will turn off voters just like last time. I don't see Bloomberg making it out of the primaries anyway. Bernie has millions of followers. Bloomberg is spending tons of money on ads. Is that going to translate into the kind of support candidates that have actually been campaigning have?

He seems like a real asshole.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graph...oomberg-women/

Several lawsuits have been filed over the years alleging that women were discriminated against at Bloomberg’s business-information company, including a case brought by a federal agency and one filed by a former employee, who blamed Bloomberg for creating a culture of sexual harassment and degradation.

**Pam** · February-16-20, 09:51 AM

I can't believe anyone seriously wants to vote for this guy.

https://www.motherjones.com/politics...bush-and-j-lo/

Over two decades in politics, Bloomberg, a self-described fiscal conservative and social liberal, has switched his party affiliation three times and defied the Democratic party’s base on key issues. His history of degrading comments about women, meanwhile, has dogged him throughout his political career.

**Zacha341** · February-17-20, 12:21 AM

Bernie Sanders

...His signature issues have become the lingua franca of liberals on this list

From list:

Nuclear Power Support closing down existing nuclear power reactors

TWO CANDIDATES HAVE SIMILAR VIEWS

Oil and gas drilling Ban fracking everywhere

ONE CANDIDATE HAS SIMILAR VIEWS

Felon Voting Felons should be allowed to vote while incarcerated

ONE CANDIDATE HAS SIMILAR VIEWS....

https://www.politico.com/2020-electi...ernie-sanders/

**Zacha341** · February-17-20, 12:29 AM

Maybe he thinks he has enough money to more than wish his opponents into the 'corn field'!

Originally Posted by Pam

I can't believe anyone seriously wants to vote for this guy.

https://www.motherjones.com/politics...bush-and-j-lo/

**Zacha341** · February-17-20, 12:32 AM

Then maybe Sanders and AOC [[Imagine her that close - a heart beat - to the presidency?). It's coming.

If not now perhaps later! Hah!

Originally Posted by Pam

Dumb idea. Hillary will turn off voters just like last time. I don't see Bloomberg making it out of the primaries anyway. Bernie has millions of followers....
https://www.washingtonpost.com/graph...oomberg-women/

**Maof** · February-17-20, 08:27 AM

Originally Posted by Pam

Dumb idea. Hillary will turn off voters just like last time. I don't see Bloomberg making it out of the primaries anyway. Bernie has millions of followers. Bloomberg is spending tons of money on ads. Is that going to translate into the kind of support candidates that have actually been campaigning have?

He seems like a real asshole.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graph...oomberg-women/

I voted for Hillary but her time is over. He'd be shooting himself in the foot.

As far as Bloomberg's past, look who's sitting in the white house. His track record isn't any better.

**jcole** · February-17-20, 08:48 AM

Originally Posted by Zacha341

Then maybe Sanders and AOC [[Imagine her that close - a heart beat - to the presidency?). It's coming.

If not now perhaps later! Hah!

Not gonna happen; she is far too young

**Zacha341** · February-17-20, 08:55 AM

Whew...

... true that! But eventually she'll be all grown up!

**jcole** · February-17-20, 09:23 AM

Originally Posted by Zacha341

Whew...

... true that! But eventually she'll be all grown up!

Yeah, not for another 10 or 12 yrs...Bernie will be loooongggg gone

**Pam** · February-17-20, 10:29 AM

Originally Posted by Maof

I voted for Hillary but her time is over. He'd be shooting himself in the foot.

As far as Bloomberg's past, look who's sitting in the white house. His track record isn't any better.

Yeah so who wants more of the same? Instead of "vote blue no matter who" the slogan should be "Any asshole with a D by his name [[who used to be an R) will do". We can do better.

**bust** · February-17-20, 10:38 AM

Not going to vote for Bloomberg in the primary, but hell yes I will in November if it comes down to that.
Trump vs. Bloomberg is like a choice between poison or a bruised apple.
If you were on a desert island and had only those to pick from for the next four years, which would you choose?
Pam, it's strange you never complain a peep about the poison.

**Richard** · February-17-20, 11:07 AM

Originally Posted by bust

Not going to vote for Bloomberg in the primary, but hell yes I will in November if it comes down to that.
Trump vs. Bloomberg is like a choice between poison or a bruised apple.
If you were on a desert island and had only those to pick from for the next four years, which would you choose?
Pam, it's strange you never complain a peep about the poison.

yea,we are not on a deserted island,and if we were on a desert island we would be more concerned about finding water.

I do not agree with Pam’s choice but she has the right to have that choice,your position would be to provide the argument of who you think the better candidate is.

If the best you have is anybody but Trump it is probably better that you sit this one out because you make it clear that you are more concerned about your little personal feelings versus what is best for the country as a whole.

Ad Hominem is weak and you can teach a parrot to say anybody but Trump.

**bust** · February-17-20, 11:15 AM

Originally Posted by Richard

yea,we are not on a deserted island,and if we were on a desert island we would be more concerned about finding water.

I do not agree with Pam’s choice but she has the right to have that choice,your position would be to provide the argument of who you think the better candidate is.

If the best you have is anybody but Trump it is probably better that you sit this one out because you make it clear that you are more concerned about your little personal feelings versus what is best for the country as a whole.

Ad Hominem is weak and you can teach a parrot to say anybody but Trump.

Define ad hominem without using the Google to look it up.

I really like Pam's first choice.

There is not a democratic candidate who is not miles better than the toxic charlatan we have today.

History will be the judge.

**Richard** · February-17-20, 11:33 AM

Originally Posted by bust

Define ad hominem without using the Google to look it up.

There is not a democratic candidate who is not miles better than Trump.

History will be the judge.

Ad Hominem = Bust

When you have no solid argument, attack the poster,because that is really all you have left.

The progressive left is miles apart from the right,it is no secret and has actually already been covered here.

With all the current democrat line up,maybe your first step would be to define what they represent within the party?

Hilliary already went down the path of Trump and anybody that agrees with him are deplorable,ask her how well that worked out as her second presidential run ended in failure.

You guys have had over 3 years to get your party together and the best you can come up with is Trump sucks and he is to blame for your failures,not for nothing but it has not appeared to be a winning solution.

**oladub** · February-17-20, 11:38 AM

Originally Posted by Pam

Yeah so who wants more of the same? Instead of "vote blue no matter who" the slogan should be "Any asshole with a D by his name [[who used to be an R) will do". We can do better.

By running for president, Bloomberg is allowed to spend unlimited amounts of money. If Bloomberg doesn't come near winning the nomination, he most likely has plans B, C, or Hillary to promote. The DNC had super delegates in 2016. It now has Bloomberg's checking account.

“I could teach anybody in this room” to be a farmer. “It’s a process,” “you dig a hole, you put a seed in, you put dirt on to, add water, up comes the corn.” Michael Bloomberg, 2016

He might as well have called farmers "a basket of deplorables".

No one here has endorsed Bloomberg's military and interventionist tendency:

"Bloomberg supported the Iraq War and opposed creating a timeline for withdrawing troops from Iraq, calling Democratic Senators who supported the measure “irresponsible”. Bloomberg supports the use of surveillance in efforts to protect national security.^{" -Wikipedia}

Bernie, in contrast, voted against giving Bush his congressional power to decide whether or not to wage the Iraq war.

Michel Bloomberg quotes for vote for anyone with a "D" acolytes.

sample: