The Big Fat Compendium Of Russiagate Debunkery

[Maof]

Former three-star general and Trump National Security Advisor Mike Flynn is willing to testify under oath that Donald Trump HIMSELF directed Flynn to contact the Russians. He is also ready to testify against other Trump family members and top White House officials.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ds-GUILTY.html

How’s that “nothingburger” tasting, fellas? Taste good yet?

Can't come soon enough! I'm thinking Kushner might be next? Wouldn't be surprised he spills on his father-in-law for fear of jail time.

[GMan]

Can't come soon enough! I'm thinking Kushner might be next? Wouldn't be surprised he spills on his father in law for fear of jail time.

Here's the contact reason: http://thehill.com/policy/national-s...dered-flynn-to

Nothing to do with rigging an election.

[Pam]

Nothing to do with rigging an election.

The goalposts keep moving.

[GMan]

The goalposts keep moving.

No the goalposts haven't moved. The point of the investigation is that the outcome of the election was changed by Russian intervention with a colluding candidate. [[ Read Donald Trump.) That never happened as Mueller has found out.
[[If anything it was the DNC that was Colluding with Foreign Nationals.)
But he can still keep himself relevant by finding those that lied about business dealings with foreign agents with Russian ties. This keeps the current administration tied up answering allegations and a wanting public clamoring for answers and the administration not enacting the agenda that got them elected.
Borders and Trade.

[aj3647]

Here's the contact reason: http://thehill.com/policy/national-s...dered-flynn-to

Nothing to do with rigging an election.

So you don’t have any opinion on the Trump Administration literally being full of criminals as long as they aren’t rigging elections?

Fine. Trump didn’t rig the election. Good for him. Now, care to offer your thoughts on the fact that Trump’s former National Security Advisor just plead guilty to a federal offense and implicated the President himself in a criminal conspiracy?

Or is the new defensive talking point going to be that any criminal activity committed by the Trump organized crime family doesn’t matter as long as they didn’t rig the election?

[GMan]

So you don’t have any opinion on the Trump Administration literally being full of criminals as long as they aren’t rigging elections?
........................

I wouldn't call it full of criminals. The charges are for lying under oath on a witch hunt of an investigation based on a false premise by a former FBI administrator who himself lied under oath during a congressional hearing. How well does that weigh out?

[aj3647]

I wouldn't call it full of criminals. The charges are for lying under oath on a witch hunt of an investigation based on a false premise by a former FBI administrator who himself lied under oath during a congressional hearing. How well does that weigh out?

So you think Flynn's only crime was that he lied to the FBI, eh? If that's the case, then why did he plead guilty to that AND also turn state's evidence? I mean, if that's the one and only crime he committed and he plead guilty to it, what's the motivation to become a cooperating witness in Mueller's investigation? You know that makes no legal sense, right?

Please tell me that you fundamentally understand what a "plea deal" is and why somebody would cut one. Flynn didn't just lie to the FBI, he did a whole lot more, that's why he cut a deal and plead guilty to the one charge. That's how deals work. Flynn turns state's evidence, and in exchange, Mueller agrees not to charge him with whatever litany of other felonies that Flynn committed that would probably get him locked up in the grey bar hotel for the next 10-20 years.

So please, don't insult your own intelligence by pretending that all Flynn did was lie. You know it was more than that.

Also, since the Administration isn't "full of criminals", just who exactly do you think that Flynn is flipping on to Robert Mueller as we speak? A bunch of nobodies? Some unpaid volunteers for the Trump Campaign? Are you really that naïve, Gman? Is your head buried that far in the sand? You think Flynn was the last felony indictment that will come out of this investigation?

It's OK, I imagine that for people like you and Pam, 2018 is going to be a rough year of trying to constantly defend the indefensible. Just remember though, when this plays out to its completion, which side you chose to defend.

[Bong-Man]

The only facts you currently know are that the former National Security Advisor has been given and accepted a plea deal currently based on one felony count he was charged with. That deal obviously does not center around The Logan Act, because that would be a waste of time for the FBI to pursue. He's singing to Mueller, and we currently have no idea what songs he's singing, or who possibly might have sang along. You also have no idea what other information the FBI has that caused Flynn to accept the deal. The bottom line is, it's no longer a compendium, an actual charge has been levied, with a guarantee there's more to come. That's not fake news, it's not speculation, and it's not from an opinionated website trying to analyze information they don't even have.


I got an idea....let's rename this thread, "The Big Fat Compendium of the Russian Uranium Deal", for that would now be far more accurate than the current title.

[GMan]

The only facts you currently know are that the former National Security Advisor has been given and accepted a plea deal currently based on one felony count he was charged with. That deal obviously does not center around The Logan Act, because that would be a waste of time for the FBI to pursue............................................ ..............

24 days on the job as national security advisor. Wow. I bet he knows a lot!

You did get one thing right. Big waste of time. That is what the FBI and Mueller are proven good at. As well as spending the taxpayers money.

[Pam]

Jimmy Dore show- "Flynn's Plea Is Another NothingBurger In Russiagate "

https://youtu.be/XUuoE7DcZDY

[313WX]

Neoliberals are going to be really disappointed when it's officially announced that there was no evidence of Trump colluding with Russia to rig the US election.

[aj3647]

Neoliberals are going to be really disappointed when it's officially announced that there was no evidence of Trump colluding with Russia to rig the US election.

Ever hear the phrase "the cover-up is worse than the crime?" When Trump stupidly admitted that he knew Flynn was guilty of a crime BEFORE he asked James Comey to back off the Flynn investigation, he sealed his own fate. My money is on Trump resigning as President in early 2019 to avoid impeachment.

But hey, when he leaves office in disgrace and drags the GOP down with him, at least you can content yourselves with the fact that there was no conclusive evidence that he personally colluded with the Russians.

[313WX]

Ever hear the phrase "the cover-up is worse than the crime?" When Trump stupidly admitted that he knew Flynn was guilty of a crime BEFORE he asked James Comey to back off the Flynn investigation, he sealed his own fate. My money is on Trump resigning as President in early 2019 to avoid impeachment.

But hey, when he leaves office in disgrace and drags the GOP down with him, at least you can content yourselves with the fact that there was no conclusive evidence that he personally colluded with the Russians.

So now you're moving the goal posts.

I need you to stay focused. Where is the evidence that Trump colluded with Russia to rig the US election, which is what neoliberals have accused him of doing over the past year?

I will wait.

[313WX]

So now you're moving the goal posts.

I need you to stay focused. Where is the evidence that Trump colluded with Russia to rig the US election, which is what neoliberals have accused him of doing over the past year?

I will wait.

Bump for aj3647. Question still stands [[so he doesn't forget).

[aj3647]

So now you're moving the goal posts.

I need you to stay focused. Where is the evidence that Trump colluded with Russia to rig the US election, which is what neoliberals have accused him of doing over the past year?

I will wait.

Why don't you ask the "neoliberals" who say that then? Shall I demand that you defend every accusation leveled against Hillary Clinton by the Alt-Right? Show me some proof that a crime was committed in the Uranium One deal. Show me proof that Hillary Clinton runs a child sex ring out of the basement of a DC pizza place. Show me proof that Barack Obama was born in Kenya.

If you want to challenge an accusation that *I* have personally made, then you can quote the post where I make it and I'll respond to it. I will be more than happy to do that. Barring that, I do not feel obligated to defend everything ever said by any liberal anywhere anymore than you should feel obligated to defend everything that comes out of some Alt-Right white supremacist's mouth.

Meanwhile I'm content to sit back and let Robert Mueller do his job and we'll see where the cards fall. Now that Mike Flynn is singing like a canary as a cooperating federal witness, 2018 is looking to be a great year!

[313WX]

Why don't you ask the "neoliberals" who say that then?

You, who was an extremely loyal supporter of former politician and neoliberal Hillary Clinton, have been [[by far) the most vocal person on this forum about the accusation, which is why I asked you specifically.

Shall I demand that you defend every accusation leveled against Hillary Clinton by the Alt-Right? Show me some proof that a crime was committed in the Uranium One deal. Show me proof that Hillary Clinton runs a child sex ring out of the basement of a DC pizza place. Show me proof that Barack Obama was born in Kenya.

I have no reason to defend things I don't believe to be true. But nice try with your pivot.

Besides, this thread is about "The Big Fat Compendium of Russiagate Debunkery." So please stay on topic.

If you want to challenge an accusation that *I* have personally made, then you can

quote the post where I make it and I'll respond to it.

Here you go!

FBI said Russia interfered in our election.
CIA said Russia interfered in our election
NSA said Russia interfered in our election
Defense Intelligence Agency said Russia interfered in our election.

Republicans in Congress have conceded and do not dispute that Russia interfered in our election.

The ONLY people who still cling to the lie that Russia didn't do anything wrong [[aside from Putin, of course) are Trump and his supporters on the Internet.

Meanwhile I'm content to sit back and let Robert Mueller do his job and we'll see where the cards fall.

Sorry, but you already lost the ability to fall back on "let Robert Mueller do his job" when you made posts such as the following:

OK, so you believe that the CIA/FBI/NSA/DIA/etc. are all lying to you. And you believe that the entire mainstream media is lying to you. And apparently you also believe that all the top cyber-security firms are lying to you. What about Republicans in Congress? While they continue to deny that Trump colluded with the Russians, Republicans in Congress fully admit that Russia interfered in our election via coordinated hacking efforts and disseminating fake news propaganda to influence the American electorate. THEY ADMIT THIS. Not Democrats, mind you, but Republicans.

http://www.weeklystandard.com/congre...rticle/2006181



Here's Senator Marco Rubio talking about how he was targeted by Russian hackers when he was running against Trump in the primaries:

http://www.cnn.com/2017/03/30/politi...earing-russia/

Republican Senator Lindsey Graham: "We must punish Russia for interfering in our election" and "I'm 1,000 percent certain that the Russians interfered in our election."
http://www.newsweek.com/lindsey-grah...eddling-608900

The ship has sailed on this. The only people at this point who are still claiming that Russia didn't interfere at all in our election are the following: Donald Trump, Julian Assange, Alex Jones, and Vladmir Putin.

So think about that collection of above individuals that you find trustworthy and do some soul-searching.

So again, please answer the question. Where is the evidence that Trump colluded with Russia to rig the US election, which is what neoliberals have accused him of doing over the past year?

[Richard]

Yea do not worry,they will find something else to obsess on,it makes it easier then having to deal with the hard stuff like mass transit,inner city schools,job training and the whole concept of selling our soul for a dollar.

I guess the silver lining is investments in drug stocks is showing a good return,high demand for Prozac and qaludes and tissues to dry the tears.

[Zacha341]

I just doesn't matter anymore. We're so divided as a country. The far left is a problem, the far right is a problem. Got that. People will hold fast to their beliefs and or their politician[[s) right or wrong.

Trump [[being who he always said he was) is making huge errors, where there could have been things he needed to address. Then he tweets on. Hillary would have ushered in her form of fixation to our detriment as well.

When Donald Trump is gone either soon [[from impeachment) followed by Pence or in 2020, we will have as recue remediation the extreme radical left to fix all that the extreme radical right did... SHM.

No were can reason be found it seems.

And now for that cup of tea I was about to have...........

[rb336]

There is no "extreme radical left" that has any kind of influence in US politics. What some call "extreme liberalism" was very much centrist politics in the days of Ike, and up until the early 80s.

[313WX]

There is no "extreme radical left" that has any kind of influence in US politics. What some call "extreme liberalism" was very much centrist politics in the days of Ike, and up until the early 80s.

Exactly.

On a global scale, what people consider "far left" in the US would be Centrism elsewhere.

[GMan]

Exactly.

On a global scale, what people consider "far left" in the US would be Centrism elsewhere.

No. The Dems back in Ike's time were centrist.
Today's views, both dem and repbub have moved further left back with the blessing of the socialist agenda. Control every aspect of a persons life seems to be the goal. From cradle to grave.

[Richard]

No. The Dems back in Ike's time were centrist.
Today's views, both dem and repbub have moved further left back with the blessing of the socialist agenda. Control every aspect of a persons life seems to be the goal. From cradle to grave.

That is why both Democrats and Republicans fight tooth and nail to keep our guns,they can take it to the edge,but know full well it is not wise to cross over it.

It is not a perfect system and nobody agrees all of the time but most will set all of that aside to protect it,if it came down to that.

[313WX]

No. The Dems back in Ike's time were centrist.
Today's views, both dem and repbub have moved further left back with the blessing of the socialist agenda. Control every aspect of a persons life seems to be the goal. From cradle to grave.

Yeah, sorry. You're wrong.

Democrats were more socially conservatives back then, that is true. But economically, they were far more liberal. The party actively stood for the interest of labor unions by fighting against illegal immigration and free trade. Also, Democrats [[And even Republicans) were actually open to the idea of UBI and Universal Healthcare.

Today, you have democrats defending a right-wing healthcare bill, bending over backwards to defend illegal immigrants and democrats throwing labor unions under the bus with free trade agreements.

Legislation akin to Medicare / Medicaid, Social Security and Food Stamps would *NEVER* see the light of day with the Democrats who are in office today.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Democrats

[GMan]

Yeah, sorry. You're wrong.

Democrats were more socially conservatives back then, that is true. But economically, they were far more liberal. The party actively stood for the interest of labor unions by fighting against illegal immigration and free trade. Also, Democrats [[And even Republicans) were actually open to the idea of UBI and Universal Healthcare.

Today, you have democrats defending a right-wing healthcare bill, bending over backwards to defend illegal immigrants and democrats throwing labor unions under the bus with free trade agreements.

Legislation akin to Medicare / Medicaid, Social Security and Food Stamps would *NEVER* see the light of day with the Democrats who are in office today.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Democrats

Your response confirms what I said. The fact that both sides are supporting universal healthcare = socialism.
The fact that dems support trade co-ops = socialism.
Left leaning ideas.
The past dems and repubs were more focuses on national issues that benefited American Public, [[ with the help of strong trade unions.) That is how the politicians controlled the wealth back then and there was still enough around to satisfy anyone's ambition.
Now, the view is globalism and the things that used to keep the government in check such as trades unions, are instead used to keep the american public in check and secure a vote for who ever doles out the most scraps [[such as universal healthcare) to the members.

Both sides have moved Left.

[313WX]

Your response confirms what I said. The fact that both sides are supporting universal healthcare = socialism.
The fact that dems support trade co-ops = socialism.
Left leaning ideas.

Except I said nothing of the sort.

Since when is deregulation [[of trade) and supporting a health care bill crafted by a right-wing think tank [[Obamacare) "left leaning" or "socialism?"

Please explain.