Mercedes-Benz, BMW Unfair?

[ArchNigel]

I ain't ne'er seen no liberal drivin' no pickup any old how anyways. Only real men drive pickups as far as I is concerned. There.

Believe me, they exist. Case in point, my grandfather, a proud, and rather liberal, card-carrying, straight-ticket, democrat [[a man who has acted as such for the last 60 or so years, and has reaffirmed his political preferences via his undying allegiance to the UAW) has usually had at least one truck or van in his driveway for the last 40 years [[and still does). Truck-driving liberals may be incredibly rare, but they most certainly exist.

[noise]

I always wondered why some feel it is necessary comment on spelling,is it thier way of trying to sound superior over everybody else or is it that they are unable comprehend the message so they lash out to make themselves feel better? Serious question.

I'm not one to comment on another person's spelling or grammar, but since you asked the question I feel compelled to provide my thoughts. I typically write off these posts as ignorant or misinformed. If the poster doesn't have the self-respect to concern themselves with acceptable writing, why should I respect what the poster is trying to convey?

[noise]

Believe me, they exist. Case in point, my grandfather, a proud, and rather liberal, card-carrying, straight-ticket, democrat [[a man who has acted as such for the last 60 or so years, and has reaffirmed his political preferences via his undying allegiance to the UAW) has usually had at least one truck or van in his driveway for the last 40 years [[and still does). Truck-driving liberals may be incredibly rare, but they most certainly exist.

And some of them even own guns!

[313WX]

And some of them even own guns!

Exhibit A: Myself.

[noise]

Exhibit A: Myself.

I guess I'll be Exhibit B.

[Zacha341]

Yeah, I've know two people with Range Rovers and they both turned out to be 'tinker-mobiles' constantly in the shop! And very expensive to attempt to keep them running!!!

It all boils down to perceived quality, not actual quality. People actually thought Range Rovers were a "great suv" and many people still do, yet they were constantly ranked as a crap quality automobile.....

[Honky Tonk]

My experience has been that Volkswagen, Audi, and Porsche, are problematic vehicles, and expensive to fix. Things go wrong with them that, in this day and age, should never go wrong with a vehicle, much less repeatedly. This was not with a single vehicle but with a variety of them over the years.

[Zacha341]

Hah! Try to find a mechanic for an Audi, or worse get the neighborhood 'mechanic' [[who's great on working on the ten y/o Chevy) try and you're TOAST!

Some cars require DEALERSHIP only service. And let's not even mention the expensive metric tires. No thanks.

[Richard]

I'm not one to comment on another person's spelling or grammar, but since you asked the question I feel compelled to provide my thoughts. I typically write off these posts as ignorant or misinformed. If the poster doesn't have the self-respect to concern themselves with acceptable writing, why should I respect what the poster is trying to convey?

Why make life more complicated then it already is,if you do not like my spelling,formatting,what I say etc. when you see my post skip over it or ingnore it,but do not even think about explaining how to turn auto fill off because that is not your job,your job is only to try an impress me with superiority.

That is the difference,I have always paid my way in life and do not feel the need to impress anybody,unless they are paying my bills or sleeping with me.

You think my spelling is bad if you saw my math you would probably explode.

I am saying you but not meaning you directly,I have to convey that thought because some can read a post and understand the context of it without being blinded by the OCD of a misspelled word and some cannat.

[SyGolden48236]

Hah! Try to find a mechanic for an Audi, or worse get the neighborhood 'mechanic' [[who's great on working on the ten y/o Chevy) try and you're TOAST!

Some cars require DEALERSHIP only service. And let's not even mention the expensive metric tires. No thanks.

This is precisely why it is better for one to lease a car for two years rather than buy one. If you lease you will always, unless you drive an extraordinary amount of miles per year, be covered under warranty and not have to worry about repair bills. This applies to both foreign and domestic brands. Many brands now even cover the cost of oil changes and basic maintenance under the warranties.

I haven't paid a repair bill on a car since the early 1990s.

[ArchNigel]

And some of them even own guns!

I almost forgot about that. In line with the "anti-stereotype", my grandfather does in fact have a few old guns he occasionally breaks out for hunting [[usually deer).

[313WX]

Personally, I have found the some Japanese cars to be more durable, especially smaller car comparisons in the past. By the way what it does 'fleet dump' mean?

Fleet dumping is when the automakers bulk sale their cars to commercial businesses [[such as rental car companies) or government entities at deep discounts, in order to maintain economies of scale and keep their plants running at a certain capacity when there's a softening or decline in retail demand.

The problem this causes for consumers is that it hurts the resale value of the vehicles most suspectible to fleet dumping, since there's a larger supply of these cars on the road.

Ford and Chrysler especially are notorious for this now. GM was the king of this pre-bankruptcy, although they don't do it nearly as much under Mary Barra's leadership.

[canuck]

My experience has been that Volkswagen, Audi, and Porsche, are problematic vehicles, and expensive to fix. Things go wrong with them that, in this day and age, should never go wrong with a vehicle, much less repeatedly. This was not with a single vehicle but with a variety of them over the years.

As Adolf would say: Totally.

VW is a weapon of long lasting demoralization set on hapless consumers. I positively hate it.

[Hermod]

Fleet dumping is when the automakers bulk sale their cars to commercial businesses [[such as rental car companies) or government entities at deep discounts, in order to maintain economies of scale and keep their plants running at a certain capacity when there's a softening or decline in retail demand.

The problem this causes for consumers is that it hurts the resale value of the vehicles most suspectible to fleet dumping, since there's a larger supply of these cars on the road.

Ford and Chrysler especially are notorious for this now. GM was the king of this pre-bankruptcy, although they don't do it nearly as much under Mary Barra's leadership.

Back in the 70s and 80s when I was doing a lot of business travel, Budget Rent-a-Car had the GSA contract in many cities. First I had to suffer AMC Gremlins, then there were a lot of Ford Fairmonts and Mercury Zephyrs.

[Richard]

Back in the 70s and 80s when I was doing a lot of business travel, Budget Rent-a-Car had the GSA contract in many cities. First I had to suffer AMC Gremlins, then there were a lot of Ford Fairmonts and Mercury Zephyrs.

It is hard to view the Gremlin and business travel in the same picture but I guess it would have been better then the Pacer.
They did make a Bad ass Gremlin that is in the $60,000 range now that sold in the mid $3000 range back then.

http://blog.caranddriver.com/what-ma...lin-worth-60k/

So was fleet dumping involved when the big three got into the rental car ownership business? It was thought at the time that it was set up for pumping up the 1 Year old car market.

[Hermod]

So was fleet dumping involved when the big three got into the rental car ownership business? It was thought at the time that it was set up for pumping up the 1 Year old car market.

The Big 3 didn't get into the rental car ownership business, they did "fleet dumping" on the rental car companies, the government GSA fleets, and state and local government agencies. The idea behind it was to keep the sales figures up.

[Richard]

From 1994 to 2005

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/money...12-hertz_x.htm

GM & Chrysler

http://www.nytimes.com/1995/04/05/bu...ntal-unit.html

[EastsideAl]

Believe me, they exist. Case in point, my grandfather, a proud, and rather liberal, card-carrying, straight-ticket, democrat [[a man who has acted as such for the last 60 or so years, and has reaffirmed his political preferences via his undying allegiance to the UAW) has usually had at least one truck or van in his driveway for the last 40 years [[and still does). Truck-driving liberals may be incredibly rare, but they most certainly exist.

I'm as "liberal" as they come, and I owned trucks for years. From the 1967 Ford pickup that was the first vehicle I ever personally owned [[bought used in 1977), to the 1987 Ford E-150 van I put well over 300,000 miles on while driving it from Maine to California and Alaska to Mexico, to the 2004 SUV that was easily the crappiest thing I ever owned. Of course, I now drive a aging Ford Focus, but that's a family inheritance and has the advantage of somewhat more tempered gas usage better suited for my own advancing age.

[Richard]

Lol liberals and useing the word,is used liberally.

Most mature adults realize that to lump every single person in a category is not always applicable.

I guess ,I would just be concidered confused because I have both liberal and conservative views,stuck in the middle.

[archfan]

They did make a Bad ass Gremlin that is in the $60,000 range now that sold in the mid $3000 range back then.

http://blog.caranddriver.com/what-ma...lin-worth-60k/

A buddy in high school had that V-8 Gremlin. A V-8, rear wheel drive and a light back end were a bad combination. Why we didn't die, I don't know.

[Lowell]

This is a great thread in spite of diversions into politics and grammar. Regarding grammar/spelling… time a favorite quote attributed to Andrew Jackson "It's a mighty poor mind that can spell a word only one way." As for Richard, who was singled out, I find his thoughts and posts clear and to the point. To me that's all that matters, whether I agree with him or not.

I'm a re-converted, not just American but, Michigan car buyer. It happened some years back when my wife showed up driving a 2003 Buick Rendezvous SUV she bought unannounced from her sister. I was a po-ed, even though she got it for a great price. Then.... I started driving it and I'm like, whoa, I didn't know American cars could handle like this. Loved it, loved the high ride, space management [I have to have a hauling vehicle for my business activities] and it never broke down or had anything major fail. My son still drives it, I bought the successor Enclave [also built in Delta Twp outside Lansing] and can't praise it enough.

I was among those who got branded non-American when I came into 1st new car buying age which happened, coincidentally, in the bicentennial year 1976. I needed small for price and, in those oil embargo days, mileage. The options were the exploding Pinto, cracking aluminum block Nova, and the dumpy Chevette. Not satisfied I tried a VW Rabbit and couldn't believe how far, far superior the handling and quick acceleration was - perfect, as I would later learn, and as DetroitSoldier observed, for German roads, parking and tiny spaces — and for me.

I comforted my loyalty issues in that VW was constructing the Westmoreland PA plant, to build future Rabbits, and thus ended up in VW world until the current century. In the end it was a succession of Jetta’s, with which I had a lot of repair costs and some major failures. Plainly put the Buick was a superior vehicle, as I discovered by chance.

The American car makers lost a generation, maybe two, due to laziness and an emphasis on form over function. I remember being shocked when I learned that the 4 cylinder transverse engine Chrysler designed for the Omni and Horizon was the first new engine design they had done in 23 years — and that was cribbed from VW, as did Ford with the Fiesta.

[O3H]

Competition is good , for the consumer, and the manufacturer.
Trump needs to crawl under a rock for the next 4 years.

[313WX]

This is a great thread in spite of diversions into politics and grammar. Regarding grammar/spelling… time a favorite quote attributed to Andrew Jackson "It's a mighty poor mind that can spell a word only one way." As for Richard, who was singled out, I find his thoughts and posts clear and to the point. To me that's all that matters, whether I agree with him or not.

I'm a re-converted, not just American but, Michigan car buyer. It happened some years back when my wife showed up driving a 2003 Buick Rendezvous SUV she bought unannounced from her sister. I was a po-ed, even though she got it for a great price. Then.... I started driving it and I'm like, whoa, I didn't know American cars could handle like this. Loved it, loved the high ride, space management [I have to have a hauling vehicle for my business activities] and it never broke down or had anything major fail. My son still drives it, I bought the successor Enclave [also built in Delta Twp outside Lansing] and can't praise it enough.

I was among those who got branded non-American when I came into 1st new car buying age which happened, coincidentally, in the bicentennial year 1976. I needed small for price and, in those oil embargo days, mileage. The options were the exploding Pinto, cracking aluminum block Nova, and the dumpy Chevette. Not satisfied I tried a VW Rabbit and couldn't believe how far, far superior the handling and quick acceleration was - perfect, as I would later learn, and as DetroitSoldier observed, for German roads, parking and tiny spaces — and for me.

I comforted my loyalty issues in that VW was constructing the Westmoreland PA plant, to build future Rabbits, and thus ended up in VW world until the current century. In the end it was a succession of Jetta’s, with which I had a lot of repair costs and some major failures. Plainly put the Buick was a superior vehicle, as I discovered by chance.

The American car makers lost a generation, maybe two, due to laziness and an emphasis on form over function. I remember being shocked when I learned that the 4 cylinder transverse engine Chrysler designed for the Omni and Horizon was the first new engine design they had done in 23 years — and that was cribbed from VW, as did Ford with the Fiesta.

To your point, I notice the main folks who refuse to buy American they are those who were burned horribly with the vehicles they purchased from the Big 3 automakers back during the late 70s through late 90s [[who are also too young to remember the quality vehicles they built in the 50s and 60s).

This is especially true within the black community.

[Zacha341]

I was one of those folks who threw in the towel on American cars from about '83 onward until recently. It was the small compact cars from the big three that were really weak and under-engineered for a time. I had two used Chevy Chevettes and from that horror I drove Honda Civics and Toyota Tercels for many years, loving the durability, fit-finish, and amenities those cars had, well exceeding the US compact car competitors at the time.

I love what Buick is doing now. They are strong runners and the new fleet is awesome. I'd consider a new Buick sedan if I was in the car market!

...The American car makers lost a generation, maybe two, due to laziness and an emphasis on form over function. I remember being shocked when I learned that the 4 cylinder transverse engine Chrysler designed for the Omni and Horizon was the first new engine design they had done in 23 years — and that was cribbed from VW, as did Ford with the Fiesta.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

I was one of those folks who threw in the towel on American cars from about '83 onward until recently. It was the small compact cars from the big three that were really weak and under-engineered for a time. I had two used Chevy Chevettes and from that horror I drove Honda Civics and Toyota Tercels for many years, loving the durability, fit-finish, and amenities those cars had, well exceeding the US compact car competitors at the time.

I love what Buick is doing now. They are strong runners and the new fleet is awesome. I'd consider a new Buick sedan if I was in the car market!

Buick is doing surprisingly better, than I initially thought, probably because they are well received in China. When GM first made the decision to keep Buick over Pontiac, I was skeptical, because I've always liked Pontiac's and they were like the sporty, performance division, of GM. Buick's had a reputation for being cars for senior citizens.