Detroit's Problem is a Lack of Job, Not Too Much Gentrification

[Bigdd]

I had a co-worker who was very involved with Focus Hope until he quit for roughly the same reason. He was involved in creating, first, the remedial curriculum so students could get into the machinists program. Then he helped create the pre-remedial program, as applicants couldn't even get through the basic level. Neither program worked very well, but instead of revamping them, he claimed, they tried creating further programs, and blamed him for not making the remedial programs easy enough.

Keep in mind we're talking middle school level mathematics and basic reading comprehension.

The problem as I see it had to do with programs like AFDC, which used to pay mothers for having illegitimate children. That program was reformed by Engler in the late '90's,.. but a lot of those sorts of programs are still in effect at reduced levels.

Hundreds of thousands of Michigan children [[in the 20-45 year old age range especially) grew up in households where mom sat around the house, and received a stack of government checks on the first of the month. To them that is "normal". Checks just come in the mail from this magical government thing.

As such,.. they viewed school as truly useless. They know a $5 bill from a $20,.. and knew they only had to scratch their name on the back of a check to cash it at the bank.

So they really truly thought they had no use for school, and I've always had a lot of sympathy for the teachers that tried in vain to teach them.

Now there is this population of completely uneducated people that believe deep down that working is for suckers. So unless you're going to pay them big bucks for doing almost nothing,... they're simply not interested. Then when push comes to shove and they realize there isn't an endless supply of free checks [[applies to males especially),.. they aren't qualified to do anything, and often can;t be taught because they lack basic reading and math skills that just take too long to teach.

I grew up watching my dad go to work 40+ hours a week. So to me,.. working 40-60 hours a week just seemed normal.

[Wesley Mouch]

The problem as I see it had to do with programs like ADC, which used to pay mothers for having illegitimate children. That program was ended by Engler,.. but a lot of those sorts of programs are still in effect at reduced levels.

Hundreds of thousands of Michigan children grew up in households where mom sat around the house, and received a stack of government checks on the first of the month. To them that is "normal". Checks just come in the mail from this magical government thing.

As such,.. they viewed school as truly useless. They know a $5 bill from a $20,.. and knew they only had to scratch their name on the back of a check to cash it at the bank.

So they really truly thought they had no use for school, and I've always had a lot of sympathy for the teachers that tried in vain to teach them.

Now there is this population of completely uneducated people that believe deep down that working is for suckers. So unless you're going to pay them big bucks for doing almost nothing,... they're simply not interested.

I grew up watching my dad go to work 40+ hours a week. So to me,.. working 40-60 hours a week just seemed normal.

I share your concern that programs discourage market participation. But I also believe we absolutely must care for everyone. Social programs are critical, but we've built them all wrong. Great in theory -- but mostly ineffective and counter-produtive in practice.

[Richard]

I share your concern that programs discourage market participation. But I also believe we absolutely must care for everyone. Social programs are critical, but we've built them all wrong. Great in theory -- but mostly ineffective and counter-produtive in practice.

The original intent was as a hand up and not a career,not so much now but not to long ago it was more advailable to some then others,which in turn created what we have today,the focus should be on how to reverse that cycle but it does not seem like a priority,unless it is happening in another country,then it becomes a no holds barred.

Somewhere along the line we lost site of our priorities.

[mwilbert]

The problem as I see it had to do with programs like AFDC, which used to pay mothers for having illegitimate children. That program was reformed by Engler in the late '90's,.. but a lot of those sorts of programs are still in effect at reduced levels.

Regardless of the merits of AFDC, it was a federal program which was ended by Congress and Bill Clinton in 1993/1994, not by Engler.

[Zacha341]

Yes, that's right. Sorta breaks up the standard narrative that only the right signals reduction in welfare. Clinton for sure spearheaded welfare reform during his administration.

Regardless of the merits of AFDC, it was a federal program which was ended by Congress and Bill Clinton in 1993/1994, not by Engler.