Ilitches finally moving on Fine Arts Building facade & Blenheim Apts?

[Gistok]

It looks like the mothballed facade of the Ilitch owned Fine Arts Building [formerly the entrance to the Adams Theatre] on W. Adams [west Grand Circus Park], and the red Blenheim Apartments building behind Little Caesars HQ [facing Park Ave.] may finally see some movement on redevelopment.

The District Detroit RFP:

https://thedistrictdetroitoc.com/rfp...tWzm8uL1Kdr81Q

The once intact Fine Arts Building [and connected Adams Theatre] across the back alley facing W. Elizabeth, were purchased by the Ilitches in the early 1990s after Mayor Young shut down the Adams Theatre following a shooting there. The bad news was that the Ilitches used their demolished by neglect method by never putting a new roof on either building, and the 2 inches of mold on the Adams [1917 built] Theatre seats, and the partial collapse of the wood frame [1905] Fine Arts Building made them dangerous for anything but demolition. Fortunately the Detroit Historical Commission made them preserve the Fine Arts facade [held up with girders since 2009]. So now 15 years later, the Ilitches are finally moving on the W. Adams fronting Fine Arts facade, and the site of the W. Elizabeth facing former Adams Theatre auditorium.

Here is the 0.53 acre parcel from the W. Elizabeth side [where the Adams auditorium used to be]... with a functioning alley separating the 2 parcel halves. So any development there would have to retain the alley. [Note: the former Adams Theatre was known as an "alley jumper", where there was a under the alley passage for main floor patrons, and a skyway above the alley for balcony patrons.]

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Hu...rl4j?entry=ttu

Also on this parcel facing W. Adams is the parking lot of the former 7 story Shurly Hospital, razed in the 40s or 50s. See image.

The other site is for a renovation of the red 1909 built 5 story Blenheim Apartments Building right behind the new Little Caesars HQ on Park Ave. The Ilitches have had this building mothballed for at least 25 years...

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Hu...rl4j?entry=ttu


Attached image of West Grand Circus Park circa 1940s, showing the [razed] Shurly Hospital, and Fine Arts Building/Adams Theatre entrance... the Ilitch owned parcels to be RFPed for redevelopment.

[Lowell]

Nice find Gistok..

Of the 3 sites I would think the Blenheim would be jumped on most quickly. Its location on the corner of the Colombia Street walkway has to make it very attractive.

Worth adding a screen snap for reference.

[Gistok]

With the opening of the Huntington Bank Tower on Woodward, this is the only parcel of land available on that block... and unlike the Huntington Tower, the Fine Arts parcel fronts Grand Circus Park.

The Fine Arts facade and 0.53 acre parcel of land is next door to the new 21 story Huntington Bank Tower on the W. Elizabeth St. side of the parcel, and next to the former [honey colored] Michigan Mutual Building on the W. Adams St. side of the parcel.

With the Huntington Bank Tower sitting on a 10 story parking deck, perhaps any new building behind the Fine Arts Building facade could get parking spots for its development from the bank tower?

Image of the 2 towers that abut the Fine Arts property on the east side, and the 18 story Kales Building and [not visible in this image] the 2 story Cliff Bells Building on the west side.

[Richard]

Designed in the transitional style by architectural firm Baxter and O’Dell in 1909 as the Blenheim Apartments, it originally comprised 19 apartments and a speakeasy.

Built in 1909 - speakeasies did not come about until 1920 when prohibition started.

Who ever built it originally had some serious forward thinking.

Cool building though,but it is just RFPs,given how people are freaking out about current interest rates,remaining optimistic is what one can hope for.

[Gistok]

^ As Lowell said... the Blenheim Apartments is not in bad condition, unlike most Ilitch owned [poorly maintained roof] properties. And its' location is adjacent to the Columbia St. "festivites" area, it being a closed street with festoon lighting pedestrian area with shops and restaurants. So as Lowell said, this building, more than most downtown, would make a relatively easy rehab... Ilitches permitting...

[ABetterDetroit]

^ As Lowell said... the Blenheim Apartments is not in bad condition, unlike most Ilitch owned [poorly maintained roof] properties. And its' location is adjacent to the Columbia St. "festivites" area, it being a closed street with festoon lighting pedestrian area with shops and restaurants. So as Lowell said, this building, more than most downtown, would make a relatively easy rehab... Ilitches permitting...

If I have to choke down “festivities” area… Dare I ask what took so damn long? And WTF with the Detroit Life building? Nothing festive about that capping the festival block. Gilbert would have finished that empty beauty 10 years ago if it was in his portfolio.

[Gistok]

If I have to choke down “festivities” area… Dare I ask what took so damn long? And WTF with the Detroit Life building? Nothing festive about that capping the festival block. Gilbert would have finished that empty beauty 10 years ago if it was in his portfolio.

You forgot to mention "festoon lighting"... when I looked that up it mentioned "light bulbs strung along".

I am just as skeptical as you are... after all the Detroit Life Building has been a work in progress for over 20 years! And I worry that the Ilitch owned Women's Club just south of the Blenheim will be a work in progress for some time as well.

My only hope is that if the Ilitches hand over the property for someone else to develop, so that something will actually happen with the Blenheim and Fine Arts properties, besides fester.

Maybe the city administration is finally calling the Ilitches to task for their slumlord activities. So they release the properties for someone with actual development experience to take them over [like with the United Artists Building]. But definitely we have to invoke Skipper's Rule here [we won't believe it until it is done].

Here are 2 images of W. Adams, one from Woodward in the 1940s at night looking past the now gone Adams Theatre entrance, past the neighboring gone Shurly Hospital... all the way to the Downtown [former Oriental] Theatre blade sign, where the auditorium was torn down in the early 1950s, but the former lobby [now PAO Restaurant] is housed within the Briggs Houze apartments.

The other image is aerial from the other end showing the now gone Downtown Theatre auditorium [replaced by parking], the PAO Restaurant, farther up to Woodward the missing gap in the streetwall where the Shurly Hospital and Fine Arts Building [Adams Theatre] used to be. This 2nd color image also shows the red Blenheim Apartments up Park Ave.

[Gistok]

Also... somewhere in the bowels of DYES archives is a 20+ year old thread talking about Mike Ilitches "Agora" [Greek/Macedonian for marketplace]... his idea to turn the 1 block closed section of W. Columbia St. into a marketplace type area.

It looks as though they finally went thru with it, with all that 'festoon lighting"!

Here it is at Christmas 2023... and yes... it does look "festive"... especially if you click on the music sound... lol. Only thing missing are people... besides the 4 shown.

https://www.instagram.com/michiganli...l/C1cXJVIudl0/

Of course turning the Fox Building into a Hotel, and actually having residents living in the Blenheim and Detroit Life Buildings, and points west of Park Ave... that might actually attract visitors to this area at night, as well as the day traffic it already gets.

[Lowell]

But definitely we have to invoke Skipper's Rule here [we won't believe it until it is done].

Slight correction on Skipper's Rule: We won't believe it until it has tenants.

From what I read the Ilitch's are asking for proposals for others to develop three of their slumlord holdings. To their credit they have restored the Eddystone and the Fox Theater Building [long, long ago]. They seem to be slow-walking the Detroit Insurance, Women's Club and United Artists but they are getting some things done. I'll give them a C- for now and bump them up when I see tenants.

Does anyone have any idea of what's happening with the apartments the preservationist forced them to choke down at Cass and Henry.

I'm wondering if some of the issue is that they lack an energetic real estate arm, like Gibertville's Bedrock.

[Danny]

They better put a build there. I'm at look at their 'Pantheon-like' ruin.

The Illeetches finally know how to be property developers!

[Richard]

They own 72 properties around the casino.

It does appear to be a cluster phuck but their mission seems different then Mr. Gilbert who buys randomly.

In the 80s Bob Snow bought up many blocks in a section of Orlando that was derelict and most would not dare to venture into,he created a multi block entertainment district,multiple levels of dining,shops and comedy clubs,piano bar etc.

It was called Church Street Station and it was packed 7 days a week with tourists and locals. He did the same thing in Vegas and in South Beach somebody else did the same thing.

As the downtown Orlando became populated again,church street station is now high rise condos and apartments.

That seems to be the difference between Bedrock and Olympia and now Ross in some,Bedrock randomly targets singular buildings,mostly because they were acquired cheap.

Olympia targets large blocks in order to change that entire block verses one building on the block.

You guys have to remember,you hired as taxpayers Bedrock to do what they are doing.

Olympia and the others were not specifically hired to do what they are doing.

But they also paid the city the $850,000 to complete the survey for the long term future plan for Corktown.

What they are doing is more complicated then what Bedrock is doing,it does take years to put projects of that scale together verses just buy a building,and many things have to fall into place to pull it off,verses buy a single random building fix it and rent it.

Two totally different strategies between the investors.

When it comes to the condition of buildings in the city,investors and speculators are going to do what they do,it is up to the city to set mothball standards and enforce the security of the buildings and hold the owners accountable,that clearly was not done in the past,but that is not a Detroit specific thing.

Olympia and related companies are seeking close to 1 billion in taxpayer funding,tax credits etc

Given their mission and strategy taxpayers investing in those types of projects are not going to see quick returns,taxpayers have a limited pile of money at this stage it may be more prudent to deal with quick flips as in Bedrock style of investments verses these massive multi block projects.

Timing has a lot to do with it all and it sucks that large sections of the city remain in that condition, but in the city you have long term goals and short term goals,then clearly really long term goals.

But those large multi block projects have to be done right the first time.

When you look at for instance,rebuilding a section of highway,that took up to 10 years in planning before the first machine rolled.

These big projects,you cannot just throw them up on top of 100 YO infrastructure it becomes a case of building a city within a city from scratch,but more expensive because it is not raw land .

You guys are basically rebuilding an entire city,one that was developed over a course of 100 years,it took other cities over 40 years to get back up to the point you are seeking to achieve.

When I first moved to Orlando 1980,downtown was no different then Detroit,if not worse,the only people there were people sleeping on bus benches and the random cop on a bicycle that was so bored they would give you a ticket for jaywalking when it could be an hour before you would even see a car driving.

Many cities were like that,you will get to where you are going,it takes time.

[Gistok]

<SNIP>

That seems to be the difference between Bedrock and Olympia and now Ross in some,Bedrock randomly targets singular buildings,mostly because they were acquired cheap.

Olympia targets large blocks in order to change that entire block verses one building on the block.

You guys have to remember,you hired as taxpayers Bedrock to do what they are doing.

Olympia and the others were not specifically hired to do what they are doing. <SNIP>

^ I'm not even sure what this all means??

Let me put this into laymen's terms... both Gilbert and Ilitch get taxpayer money for their development...

Gilbert fixes buildings up and restores them, with new construction as infill.

Ilitch bulldozes, and makes a ton of money for parking lots... and when something is needed they prefer to start anew, since they don't have much expertise at restoration.

Ilitch gets criticized because their 1999, 2015 and 2023 District Detroit plans keep showing up with dazzling ideas for developing the north end of Detroit for public money... with not much to show for it [yet].

Gilbert also gets public money, but follows thru on much [although not all] of his plans.

But I guess they are both in it for the long haul.

[Richard]

You are not sure what it means because you are trying to compare two totally different business profiles and expecting them to operate the same way.

One buys a building,fixes it up and puts it to use,what project has Bedrock done that can be considered developing an entire district.

Olympia would have been insane to launch a district project in 1999,the city was not ready for it.

When projects like that are announced it does not mean tomorrow they are going to start digging,it’s saying that’s what they envision as a long term plan to start gaining support.

You do understand there is a massive difference between buying a single building for $10 and fixing it for $20 dollars verses planning and developing an entire district that involves multiple blocks and a billion dollars.

Then there is Detroit time in Tampa a 40 story apartment/condo tower with all of the fixings is 6 months or less start to finish.

How long has there been plans for the Hudson’s property and how long has it been to put a building up ?

All of these other cities that you want to be like were in not very good condition in the 70s early 80s it took them over 40 years to get where they are now.

Half of those are back on the down slide again.

It’s easy to buy 1 building and fix it and the public gets what they are looking for ,instant gratification.

You are rebuilding a city,unless you can twinkle your nose and make every pretty in a matter of seconds it’s going to take time and that time is going to be filled with lots of things that never come to fruition and lots of things that will,you are not going to change that.

Push comes to shove,go down to your bank,pull out a few billion and get it knocked out and show them how to do it.

Back in those days you could have also bought those buildings for pennies on the dollar while restoring them,but think how it was then what would you have done with the building?

It cost you money to buy it,it cost you taxes and money to maintain it while there was no demand for it,so a parking lot was the highest and best use until in the future dictates it’s use.

It was a pretty common thing to do under urban renewal,destroy it and they will come,but nobody came.

Back to what does it mean ?

The same thing it has always ment,you take everything with a grain of salt and until the shovel hits the dirt it is what it is.

You have to admit sending out RFPs is a good way of showing people you are not just letting a building sit there while doing nothing with it,without actually doing anything.

There is a whole bag of tricks when it comes to optics.

[Gistok]

Here is an early 20th century art rendered postcard of West Grand Circus Park from the early 20th century. It will be nice to see the street wall fill up again with a project on the Fine Arts/Shurly Hospital site, if Ilitch comes to terms with a potential developer.

The long gone Tuller Hotel that framed the west end of the park [mislabeled in the postcard], and on the same block as the renovating United Artists Building is another large Ilitch owned empty parcel. We'll have to see how long that remains vacant.

[mikeg19]

Still lamenting the loss of the Statler in the hasty "we need to demo every building pre Super Bowl" by Kwame and co. Tuller and Statler anchoring that end of the park, surely at this point would have been redeveloped into hotel or housing in today's market, would have made such a better street wall.

[mwilbert]

Still lamenting the loss of the Statler in the hasty "we need to demo every building pre Super Bowl" by Kwame and co. Tuller and Statler anchoring that end of the park, surely at this point would have been redeveloped into hotel or housing in today's market, would have made such a better street wall.

The Tuller was pretty awful by the time it was demolished, but I can see how it could have been redeveloped. The Statler would have been an enormous project; it was a huge hotel. Even if it had been preserved, I kind of doubt it would have been redeveloped by now. Of course I don't like the replacement; it's undersized for the site, and uninspired.

[Gistok]

The Tuller was pretty awful by the time it was demolished, but I can see how it could have been redeveloped. The Statler would have been an enormous project; it was a huge hotel. Even if it had been preserved, I kind of doubt it would have been redeveloped by now. Of course I don't like the replacement; it's undersized for the site, and uninspired.

The Tuller had the same issues as the Fine Arts Building... namely it was wood trusses [or as we like to say for the underwhelming apartments currently on the Statler site... "stick built"].

I didn't fully understand the reasons behind why they couldn't make the numbers work with the Statler [unless it was just George Jackson giving excuses], but it was "V" shaped with some kind of rusting construction in the armpit of the "V"... that looked decrepit.

I'm not sure what angers me more... the loss of the Statler... or the 5 story stick built apartments that replaced it...

[mikeg19]

I'm not sure what angers me more... the loss of the Statler... or the 5 story stick built apartments that replaced it...

The only thing that's good about that is hopefully in 20-30 years someone comes along and goes "hey, this is a great spot to build a big ole 40 story skyscraper. Thank god someone back in the 2000's built this out of wood and will be incredibly easy to demo...."

[Richard]

The RFP reads that these buildings are wood frame construction with brick façade- wonder what hidden damage is there - or the next thing will be they need to much work - need to demolish.

Interesting video in the restoration of the Metropolitan building into the Element Hotel.

I say restoration because that’s what they did - impressive work

Video has before and after

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=lqg3dI...IGRldHJvaXQ%3D

Here is Detroit 1930s can you identify the street or factory that everybody is headed to as they exit the street cars ?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=U2_8gq...Bjb2xvcg%3D%3D

Remember that would be a year into the depression,it does not look like it effected much.

[Gistok]

^ I can't speak about the 3rd building farther from downtown, but the Blenheim Apartments [stick built] went from being occupied to being mothballed relatively quickly... no scavengers got in, and it should still be in [relatively] decent condition.

And the Fine Arts Building is only a facade, the stick built 6 story building behind the facade is gone. So a steel framework is an option for that site.