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  1. #3676

  2. #3677

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    Quote Originally Posted by oladub View Post
    For starters, Trump didn't call "the Constitution" either 'fake' or 'phony'.
    He most certainly did and he thinks that the constitution doesn't apply to him? Who gave him a pass?

  3. #3678

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    Uhh, has the impeachment started yet?

  4. #3679

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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnnny5 View Post
    Bill Clinton and Barack Obama have both become enormously wealthy by using the fame and connections from their time in the White House.


    Totally different from having foreign dignitaries enriching your failing hotels, forcing the US to fork over millions in tax-payer dollars by having your veep stay 300 miles away from a meeting to give your hotel a bunch of taxpayer dollars and having the military use your golf club for no apparent reason. Not to mention the millions of dollars he is spending at his golf clubs (at an apparent premium over regular guests).

    On the opposite end of the spectrum, Donald Trump will probably be the first President in living memory that leaves office with less wealth than when he was elected. Much of that a result of his forced absence in directly handling his business affairs and the public backlashes from those that oppose his politics.
    Considering his rather poor track record (6 bankruptcies - including 2 gaming concerns) and how poorly most of his properties were doing - the only loan he could get was under rather dubious conditions from Deutsche Bank - his net worth would eventually zero out as all his creditors came to call. His "wealth" is paper at best, fraudulent at worst.
    Meanwhile, his racist, white supremacist BS is causing huge problems for Trump-branded properties all over the place.

    Who's more guilty of profiting from their time in the White House? A man that is likely losing billions by taking the office, or those that have seen their net worth multiply 100 times over?
    The one who is using taxpayer dollars to prop up his failing businesses, and who is having foreign players buy influence by staying at his businesses.

  5. #3680

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maof View Post
    He most certainly did and he thinks that the constitution doesn't apply to him? Who gave him a pass?
    I covered all that in post 3675.

  6. #3681

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    I don't care what anybody says. I like Chump.

  7. #3682

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zacha341 View Post
    Uhh, has the impeachment started yet?
    Yea,they are working on it,like nothing else,they ask thier supporters to please hold their breath as they will have bombshell news soon.

  8. #3683

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    Quote Originally Posted by canuck View Post
    I don't care what anybody says. I like Chump.
    awwww and I am sure he likes you tooo,if you send him a PM maybe he will send you a gallon or two of some good ol American whole milk for Christmas.

    None of that cheap 1% crap for our north of the border buddies,only the good stuff.

  9. #3684

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    Quote Originally Posted by oladub View Post
    Are you sure that the word "fake" isn't a characterization to spin how Trump characterized the emolulants clause or did he actually call the Constitution "fake" as you earlier wrote. ("Trump called THE CONSTITUTION fake". your post 3663)

    "So what?" You are missing the elephant in the room. In post 3663 you also wrote, "
    Trump just willingly ceded power and influence to the Russians." Trump did not just do it. The major part of the power ceded happened because Obama/Biden/Kerry/Hillary interventionist foreign policy spectacularly failed. Tulsi Gabbard pointed that out. Trump, on the other hand, seems to be removing troops from Syria that Congress never sent there. We wouldn't be having this discussion if Obama foreign policy hadn't failed.

    You didn't define 'our partners' either. Do you mean our partners who also helped drive back ISIS in Syria? They would include the Kurds, Russians, and Assad governments. Or do you mean partners who were funded by the CIA and the Pentagon who fought each other with our weapons?

    14 of the 28 groups fighting under the Turkish banner were actually trained and armed with US weapons,including TOW missiles under the Obama administration in order to fight ISIS.

    So we armed both sides who are now fighting each other.

    The elephant in the room in Sryia is the multi billion dollar drug trade,legal and illegal that is being interrupted which pays for a lot of weapons.

  10. #3685

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    Did I hear this right?

    https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/...sia-nr-vpx.cnn

    That last line says it all?
    Last edited by Dan Wesson; October-26-19 at 01:30 PM.

  11. #3686

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    Now we know the name and a little bit about the whistleblower at the center of Coup II. Its 33 year old CIA employee and political activist Eric Ciarmella. He's the son of a bank executive. It will be interesting to hear Edward Snowden's take on Eric Ciarmella.

  12. #3687

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    link to above article "How Whistleblower"

  13. #3688

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    Who cares who the whistleblower is? Trumps own words - and the heavily truncated document of the call - clearly show him asking for help from a foreign government to investigate a political rival, in clear violation of Federal election laws. QED

  14. #3689

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    ^ so based on that,any democrat currently running for president can collude with the Russians in order to win the 2020 election with impunity,because if the president called for an investigation it would be viewed as investigation of a political rival?

    You are discussing a foreign country where a comedian won office because everybody before him in the government was corrupt,so the president was within his right to question how the investigation was going when it comes to corruption and United States political figures.

    Why should a US politician receive immunity simply because they are a political opponent?

    Biden and or his son was already involved in the investigation before Trump even took office so the question of the president asking for updates to that investigation is within his right and would be expected.

  15. #3690

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    Quote Originally Posted by rb336 View Post
    Who cares who the whistleblower is? Trumps own words - and the heavily truncated document of the call - clearly show him asking for help from a foreign government to investigate a political rival, in clear violation of Federal election laws. QED

    Like you said; Who cares?

    I'm gonna use a word I'm seeing more and more...

    Irrelevant.

    What's good for the Goose is good for the Gander.

    How do accommodate conflict without total all out warfare.

    Tit for tat.

  16. #3691

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    I have come to the conclusion that the folks who wish the worst and most outrageous misfortunes on Trump should just say they hate the man.

    These attempts to justify their hatred many times makes them look unjustified based on false premises. Chicken Little Syndrome.

    You don't like the guy?
    Make it short and sweet.
    Fuck him and the horse he rode in on.

  17. #3692

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    ^^^ Hah! Your last statement is the rub! The horse he rode in on includes the rule of law, the republic etc.

    If we justify and sacrifice all of that to take down a president what will that mean for rank and file individual rights and due process (the horse so to speak)?

    Increasingly at the behest of politics we're being asked to not question a society where you can be accused, with secret testimonies, hidden accusers, double judged if you respond, etc.

    All is justified until it's someone you like, or you, your business or family member(s).
    Last edited by Zacha341; November-06-19 at 07:01 AM.

  18. #3693

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    Would the Founding Fathers Impeach Trump? with Robert Reich
    Former Secretary of Labor Robert Reich explains what the Founding Fathers wanted to protect against when they wrote the impeachment clause of the Constitution.

  19. #3694

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    We have a president who is waging an all-out assault on the rule of law. Read our election laws. Read the Emoluments Clauses. Learn what "emoluments" means. You are willing to sacrifice that to support the most corrupt administration in history.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zacha341 View Post
    ^^^ Hah! Your last statement is the rub! The horse he rode in on includes the rule of law, the republic etc.

    If we justify and sacrifice all of that to take down a president what will that mean for rank and file individual rights and due process (the horse so to speak)?

  20. #3695

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    Quote Originally Posted by rb336 View Post
    Who cares who the whistleblower is? Trumps own words - and the heavily truncated document of the call - clearly show him asking for help from a foreign government to investigate a political rival, in clear violation of Federal election laws. QED
    The link in post 3687 probably identifies the whistleblower. I fault Trump for carrying over Obama staffers and political operatives who have proven they can't be trusted. "Ciaramella worked with a Democratic National Committee operative who dug up dirt on the Trump campaign during the 2016 election, inviting her into the White House for meetings, former White House colleagues said. The operative, Alexandra Chalupa, a Ukrainian-American who supported Hillary Clinton, led an effort to link the Republican campaign to the Russian government." Biden's office invited Ciaramella to hang out with Comey and Clapper. This is the same Clapper who lied to Congress without being punished.

    Ciaramella was a political activist and deep state operative who used his position to promote the coup. That's one reason we should care about who the 'whistleblower' is.

    Speaking of coups- The elephants in the room include the same cast of characters including the CIA and Obma administration who helped overthrow the elected government of Ukraine and Libya that led to Russia responding by invading and occupying Crimea and destroyed and turned Libya into an ISIS half way house. Maybe this bunch will do better conducting a coup at home.

    I watched Jimaz' link too. Although corporate puppet Robert Reich championed policies that led to the housing crises and recession, he failed to predict that recession coming. Having failed as an economist, he is branching into the Constitution of all things. Speaking of emoluments, he failed to notice the millions of Russian dollars that went into the Clinton Family Foundation, the coincidental appointments of a former CIA official and Biden's son to the Burisma board or Hillary's campaign paying for a British firm to manufacture the piss-gate manuscript that was handed to alphabet agencies to undermine the Trump candidacy.

  21. #3696

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    First off I GET IT, fully, I really do, but I shall we in turn destroy (congress, et al) the rule of law in order to remove him?

    There has to be a way that does not so adversely affect how judicial laws will be applied to individuals going forth.

    Secondly, I did not say I desire to support this admin. But again I'm looking at the fallout beyond THIS ADMIN, beyond this man.

    Are we to BECOME what we are going after?


    Sadly, IMO I think the answer is YES to those who want to BRING IT ALL DOWN, anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by rb336 View Post
    We have a president who is waging an all-out assault on the rule of law. Read our election laws. Read the Emoluments Clauses. Learn what "emoluments" means. You are willing to sacrifice that to support the most corrupt administration in history.
    Last edited by Zacha341; November-06-19 at 10:46 AM.

  22. #3697

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zacha341 View Post
    First off I GET IT, fully, I really do, but I shall we in turn destroy (congress, et al) the rule of law in order to remove him?
    Who's doing that? Impeachment is a CONSTITUTIONAL process, 100% legal. Did you all forget that just 20 years ago, Republicans impeached Bill Clinton for lying about a blow job? Was THAT a coup too, or only when the Constitution gets applied to Republican Presidents?

    You all are a bunch of hypocrites. Everything the Democrats have done thus far is 100% legal and in full accordance with Constitutional procedures and the rules/policies governing the House of Representatives. It's not a coup, if you don't like the Impeachment process, take it up with the Founding Fathers who created it.

  23. #3698

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    Meanwhile in Trump World, there were some elections last night. You guys didn't do so hot, LOL!

    Democrats FLIP the Kentucky Governor's mansion, despite Trump going all out to rescue Republican Governor Matt Bevin.
    https://thehill.com/homenews/campaig...or-in-kentucky

    Trump held a rally for Bevin in Kentucky the night before the election, implored Kentucky residents "not to let this happen to him" (referring to a Bevin loss), and tried to nationalize the race by making it a referendum on the Democrats' impeachment of him. He STILL lost.

    Democrats FLIP both chambers of the Virginia State Assembly, giving them trifecta control over the entire state.

    https://thehill.com/homenews/campaig...a-state-senate


    But hey, you held the Governor's Mansion in Mississippi by a mere 5 points, so good job! That's two elections in a row now where the suburbs have told Trump and the GOP to "go fuck yourselves." Best of luck in 2020, boys. 363 days and counting, it's coming.

  24. #3699

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    'You all'?! LOL! Sorry to break up the convenient easy-bake-oven 'us vs them' narrative. Remember this: I'm not a republican.

    I am a political orphan, if anything, expedient to the freedom that affords me to take the broader less partisan appraisal.

    Thus, I carry 'my president, right or wrong' water for no one!

    That includes Clinton, Obama and Trump. As an Indy, all I'm asking is that we think about again about 'becoming what we are going after' (leading up to this ala secret witnesses, etc.), including and up to as I meant a distortion of seeming constitutional processes.

    If legit the sooner the better re. the impeachment; maybe Trump will wiggle out of it as did Clinton. Impeachment looks like the only way Trump will be removed as the dems don't have a decent candidate. Impeach if possible so we can resume focusing upon this country for the better of all: dem, repub, indy, libertarian etc.

    BTW, the BJ and infidelity et al was not the crux of Clinton's impeachment. Nope. It was his obstruction of justice related therein.

    Quote Originally Posted by aj3647 View Post
    Who's doing that? Impeachment is a CONSTITUTIONAL process, 100% legal. Did you all forget that just 20 years ago, Republicans impeached Bill Clinton for lying about a blow job? Was THAT a coup too, or only when the Constitution gets applied to Republican Presidents?

    You all are a bunch of hypocrites. Everything the Democrats have done thus far is 100% legal and in full accordance with Constitutional procedures and the rules/policies governing the House of Representatives. It's not a coup, if you don't like the Impeachment process, take it up with the Founding Fathers who created it.
    Last edited by Zacha341; November-06-19 at 01:48 PM.

  25. #3700

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    Quote Originally Posted by aj3647 View Post
    Who's doing that? Impeachment is a CONSTITUTIONAL process, 100% legal. Did you all forget that just 20 years ago, Republicans impeached Bill Clinton for lying about a blow job? Was THAT a coup too, or only when the Constitution gets applied to Republican Presidents?

    You all are a bunch of hypocrites. Everything the Democrats have done thus far is 100% legal and in full accordance with Constitutional procedures and the rules/policies governing the House of Representatives. It's not a coup, if you don't like the Impeachment process, take it up with the Founding Fathers who created it.
    As you pointed out, the impeachment process is constitutional and can be conducted for any reason including not having sex with staffers. Democrats proved they could also try to litigate a different result in a presidential election by trying to recount votes in corrupt Broward County a number of times. Instead of getting out the big magnifying glasses to examine chads, Democrats have spent the last three years trying to come up with some sort of impeachment scenario. Weren't there some here who told us an impeachment would be coming once the Robert Swan Mueller III's report was out? That didn't happen so now Trump is guilty about trying to ascertain if the Bidens had done something wrong. It could have been coincidence that Biden's son was chosen as the best person in the world to man the Burisma board after all. If Trump had uncovered corruption, that wouldn't have only been good for him. It would have been good for the country. By Democratic rules, however, Trump was just supposed to go along with the corruption and not look into it; just write checks.

    Those U.S. taxpayer checks to buoy the Ukranian government wouldn't of course been even necessary had the Obama administration not so badly bungled foreign policy in Ukraine by helping overthrow its elected government and inadvertently drawing Russia in. There was no constitutional basis for overthrowing Libya, Ukraine, and using ISIS to try to overthrow Assad either. If misusing cigars in the oral office and investigating corruption in Ukraine are worthy of impeachment proceedings, conducting unconstitutional wars and the millions of Russian dollars that went into the Clinton Family Foundation while Hillary was SOS were larger constitutional abridgments by orders of magnitude. Yet, Democrats hypocritically ignore that.

    While China has deployed 18,000 miles of high speed trains and is creating weapons the U.S. has no answer for, Democrats are busy tying up our Country for four years trying to unseat our elected President like he was the head of Libya, Syria, or Libya. How would the Founding Fathers have ever guessed that any Americans would do that?

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