Media giant buys Detroit home for reporters to track city

[Buy American]

lilpup and Sstashmoo, I couldn't have said it better. Seems to me that any "dissing" that was shown was done on Dove-7's post.

[dove-7]

Oakland is not thriving at all. It's one of the least desirable cities in Northern California, and most Bay Area residents regard it as "ghetto".

San Francisco is thriving, but does not have a crime rate comparable to Oakland or Detroit [[though you're right that it does have considerable crime).

Bro.

I live here. If you compare the other areas where the locals have a choice, of course many are going to say San Francisco over Oakland, BUT, there are a lot people moving out of San Francisco into Oakland. Oakland isn't as bad as some people think or make it out to be. It's certain parts of Oakland. I thought the same before I came here. Anywho, my point is, Oakland has a population, things are moving around compared to the current state of Detroit. It's like night and day.

As for the San Francisco and Oakland comparison, I had said either on this thread or similar thread, don't read stats in papers, San Francisco two years ago crime rate was higher than Oakland. The key point of this compare and contrast was/is to say that cities still manage with crime and crime isn't the sole reason why over half the population pack up and leave.

[dove-7]

lilpup and Sstashmoo, I couldn't have said it better. Seems to me that any "dissing" that was shown was done on Dove-7's post.

Irony much?

[dove-7]

If you were stating facts you'd state the fact that despite your opinion of Big 3 cars, GM has never been outsold in the US market by any Asian manufacturer and Ford has also outsold the Asian companies a few months this year.

You'd also state that, if not for the mess that is the investment banks, GM and Chrysler wouldn't have needed to use the government as financier or have been forced through bankruptcy.

But, nooooo, it's all because Detroit has sucked for thirty years, despite being the mainstay industry of middle class America.

Oh? And their car sells declined while Japanese cars increased.

[lilpup]

Toyota has benefitted greatly from the Japan government over the years - their government policy looks out for Japanese based companies. Yet Toyota has still lost money and has lost market share [[particularly to Ford). Toyota has delayed work its much-vaunted new assembly facilities in Mississippi and even Honda has shuttered its US motorcycle assembly facility. So much for the infallibles.

http://www.freep.com/article/2009081...ota-seek-No.-1

[Sstashmoo]

Sensitive much?

About Detroit and our manufacturing sector? Yes I am.

I have much disdain for some of the business community in California [[Not really a business community, more like a cesspool of opportunists) as they jump over each others ass flooding our US markets with Chinese shit and killing our manufacturing sector, that it took us over a hundred years to create. And our government is allowing it to continue for some insane reason. Many will suffer as it profits a few.

Quote: "Seeing that Ford is right next door, it's a cheaper drive down the road. "

You just keep on driving down the street to buy something made elsewhere, read a newspaper lately? This isn't just a Detroit problem. We went in to this first and we'll come out of it first, we always do.

[pffft]

"As for Japanese crap, you can get emotional all that you want, but they're not asking for a bail out and having to shut down car dealers. Funny, the dealers that are selling the most cars through this junk for new cars are the Japanese and Ford."

Oh dove, I guess you didn't see that photo that went all around the world of the parking lots rented by Toyota and other Asian manufacturers at the San Francisco port, to hold all the new models because the dealers told them STOP! Don't send anymore, we are full.
You have a delusional view of how the worldwide recession/depression has affected the Pacific Rim manufacturers -- they've been hit exceedingly hard. If you knew anyone who does business with them, you'd know that.
As for cash for clunkers, the largest percentage of new cars sold om the program are GM products. Depending upon what list you consult, the No. 1 new model being sold is either a Ford or a Toyota. Two different calculations.

[davewindsor]

Come on, guys,. How did an article about Time Magazine reopening a small office that they closed over decade ago in Detroit turn into a debate about crime rates and foreign automakers ruining Detroit's economy? It's the same theme over and over again that repeats itself in every thread. Everyone keeps focusing on negatives.

Let's try focusing on the positives for once. The cost of living and overhead is a lot cheaper in downtown Detroit than Chicago or Manhattan. Imagine if those few reporters who will be working out of Detroit at the end of the month also mentioned that this city would be great to work out of and the owners of Time decided to move one of their head offices out of NY into, say the Old Free Press Building or 1001 Woodward? You might get a 1000 employees in the Time Publishing empire moving to downtown. We have the infrastructure. Wouldn't that help our unemployment rate? We'd get people buying up condos in the BC and renting out apartments in the Book Tower. The future is in media and film and Detroit needs to reinvent itself to bring this industry here. It's time to evolve.

So, what's the DDA and the Mayor gonna do to try to recruit them to move one of their head offices in another city to downtown Detroit? Has anyone from the city or State approached them, offering them tax credits, a vacant skyscraper or anything else that might entice them to move a lot of jobs down here?

[Lorax]

What our fellow poster from California leaves out is the fact that Japanese businesses don't have staggering health care costs, since they have a single payer health care system, while we still lag behind in keeping up with the industrialized world on that level, and add to that how Rethuglicans decided tariffs should be repealed on foreign imports, and you have the disparity.

And still, they are suffering the economic collapse like the rest of us, perhaps not as badly, but with all of their advantages, still they falter.

Chrysler still outsells all other manufacturers in minivans, I should know, my father invented them.

If anything, the Time House should be an interesting foray into some face time for Detroit in the national/international spotlight, good, bad, or indifferent.

[Sludgedaddy]

Hey, Lynette "Squeaky" Fromme just got out of the slammer after some 30 odd years. I wonder if she'll head back to California and shill for Asian Auto Companies with the slogan: "What Would Charlie Drive ?"

[Gannon]

Chrysler still outsells all other manufacturers in minivans, I should know, my father invented them.

So, your father was the one who COPIED the VW MicroBus after all those years and then claimed to INVENT the concept?!

Laughable...VW was doing reasonable-sized family vans three decades before Chrysler did theirs...with an engine they derived from a VW 4-cylinder [[although admittedly they solved an oil-consumption problem the Germans couldn't fix).


Cheers!

[Toolbox]

Chrysler still outsells all other manufacturers in minivans, I should know, my father invented them.

So, your father was the one who COPIED the VW MicroBus after all those years and then claimed to INVENT the concept?!

Laughable...VW was doing reasonable-sized family vans three decades before Chrysler did theirs...with an engine they derived from a VW 4-cylinder [[although admittedly they solved an oil-consumption problem the Germans couldn't fix).

Sorry boys, the Stout Scarab is widely viewed as the first production mini van.





That house belonged to a fourmer till he took a sweet job on the Westcoast a few years ago.

[Haikoont]

Chrysler still outsells all other manufacturers in minivans, I should know, my father invented them.

Regarding sales analysis of the correction fluid business in 2009, Michael Nesmith should know. His mother invented Liquid Paper.

[56packman]

I lived on Parker just off Mack back in the 50s. Didn't know there was a fancy section of Parker.

Oldertimer, Did you know a Richard Naylor who lived on Parker then?

[barnesfoto]

I can understand people resenting out of town media types jetting into town, doing a quick ride around the city, making notes from behind the glass of a rented sedan, perhaps talking to several people at a diner, then meeting up with the photographer to get quick and easy cliché photos of downtown as seen from Brush Park, [[crumbling house in foreground, crackoid walking through the landscape)...
These folks are buying a piece of property and opening [[or perhaps reopening) a bureau here. Besides taking a closer look at what happened to Detroit, they will in some small way, be contributing to the economy.
I'd say that some of you sound like a bunch of bitter old ladies, but that would be both ageist and sexist, as well as a possible violation of forum rules, so I'll just shake my head.

[Lorax]

Yes, my father invented the minivan on a cocktail napkin at Joanne's Restaurant on 8 mile road in 1974 during a business lunch. As the head of Advanced Design and Engineering for the Dodge Division at the time, he had the mockups finished within a year, and it was presented to the board in 1976 as a actionable model.

It was rejected at the time as being too odd, not in keeping with the "vision" of bigger gas guzzlers at the time, but as Chrysler's fortunes were waning at the end of the 70's, and with the bankruptcy looming, Iacocca came in and dusted off these plans, tried to fire my dad so he could give credit to his Ford cronies he brought with him, and being unsuccessful in removing my dad, capitulated, and left credit for the design concept to him.

As we all know, the first models hit the road in 1984, and have outsold all other copies from all other manufacturers eversince.

Due to the anonimity of this thread, I won't reveal his name, or mine, but suffice to say, I have the origial dated drafts in my possession, slides used at the presentation, and my father is still living and working on an autobiography [[finally!) on the subject.

So don't give me any crap about VW or other such rot.

He also concepted the Ram Charger, Club Cab, Dakota, among other less sexy designs like drivetrain/engine improvements which we all take for granted today. Those truck geeks out there will no doubt know his name if they have any insider information on Chrysler and Dodge.

[Toolbox]

Yes, my father invented the minivan on a cocktail napkin at Joanne's Restaurant on 8 mile road .

So don't give me any crap about VW or other such rot.

He also concepted the Ram Charger, Club Cab, Dakota, among other less sexy designs...

Dad like drag queens?

You need to learn automotive history and not the Detroit is king version. Everything new IS old.

1963 Dodge Club cab.



1959 VW

[pffft]

Rather than a mysterious enclave of reporters, this sounds like a guy [[or gal) being sent to Detroit as a bureau correspondent. Time used to have a bureau here...Not as sexy or breathless a description as this gang of out of town scribes sent here to study us...

[Lorax]

Dad like drag queens?

You need to learn automotive history and not the Detroit is king version. Everything new IS old.

1963 Dodge Club cab.



1959 VW

What kind of a crack was that, Tool?

Living up to your name, I see.

I wasn't aware that Joanne's was a drag restaurant back in 74, gee, I'll have to ask my dad.

Doesn't change the facts as they are. It was my dad's idea to call them "Minivans" as well, and was first introduced as such with Chrysler's rollout of the vehicles. Sorry to disappoint you.

[Sstashmoo]

Quote: "father invented the minivan on a cocktail napkin at Joanne's Restaurant on 8 mile"

He pulled out a napkin and drew a box with four wheels on it? No disrespect to your Father, but the term "invent" is being used quite liberally in this context. I think this story has been morphed or confused over the years perhaps with the great Kelly Johnson of Lockheed and his concept of the P38 lightning also drawn on a table napkin, and a flying prototype in six months.

[Sstashmoo]

Quote: "He also concepted the Ram Charger, Club Cab, Dakota, among other less sexy designs..."

Gee, what was the rest of the Chrysler design division doing while they were waiting for your Father to blink? Sorry, this just sort of irritates me when I see one person taking the credit of many others. Sort of the like Edison/Dickson situation.

"He blinked, yeah I seen it too"

[Detroit_uke]

I say good for Time. That means one less empty house in Detroit. If they need more houses there are 11 of them on my block alone.

[gravitymachine]

What kind of a crack was that, Tool?

Living up to your name, I see.

I wasn't aware that Joanne's was a drag restaurant back in 74, gee, I'll have to ask my dad.

Doesn't change the facts as they are. It was my dad's idea to call them "Minivans" as well, and was first introduced as such with Chrysler's rollout of the vehicles. Sorry to disappoint you.

ok, so lets disregard the scarab and the vw for a moment, for fun, on the basis that they weren't FWD transverse engined minivans [[even though IMO toolbox is totally right and the concept is larger than any specific drivetrain configuration). It has been my understanding that the minivan concpet as it has existed in the american market was the brainchild of lee iaccoca while at ford, however ford never took it up and the idea went with iaccoca to chrysler ..

and according to the piece below, your dad must be hal sperlich

http://www.motivemag.com/pub/feature...ve_Built.shtml

Hindsight is, as the saying goes, 20:20. Still, axing Carrousel and Minimax concepts may have been the biggest "oops" in Ford's long history. The former was slated for production in 1975 as a smaller, garage-friendly version of the Econoline, but the gas crisis and recession put a halt on any all-new products in development. The Minimax was a smaller, front-wheel-drive alternative with less space but better economy. Henry Ford II fired Lee Iacocca in 1978, and with him went Minimax [[and Dodge Caravan) designer Hal Sperlich. They continued the project at Chrysler, combining the space and packaging of the Carrousel with the size and efficiency of the Minimax to create a little bit of history. Now, Chrysler is still a leader in the minivan segment while Ford has struck out. The Carrousel didn't die off completely, though - take a look at the rear end of the 2009 Flex and guess what inspired it.

[gravitymachine]

or is your dad glenn gardener?

http://www.allpar.com/model/m/history.html

Glenn Gardner, Dodge Truck product planning manager in the late 1970s, was given the job of turning the concept of a "Super Wagon" into a real vehicle. By 1978, it was included in the long-range product plan. Full-size clay models and engineering studies were created by fewer than 100 designers from a variety of Chrysler organizations. Aerodynamic extremes were rejected by customers in research. Customers also were uncomfortable with having engines tunneling into the cabin and with high floors, leading engineers to decide that front wheel drive was the only way to go. [[Glen Gardner was later to lead the highly successful LH car project.)

this part though, is the real truth

Full-size clay models and engineering studies were created by fewer than 100 designers from a variety of Chrysler organizations

that while credit may be assigned to or claimed by one person, behind the scenes, its an organizational effort, always

[Danny]

Detroit is going to get a corporate journalism community in its ghettohoods. I hope it works. Then lots of corporations will turn Detroit's ghettohoods into a New York-esque community filled with very expansive dwellings making ti very hard to buy a decent home in Detroit's ghettohoods.