Which areas safe to walk all hours -incl evening?

[Novine]

"The difference is, in major metropolises you can wander around on foot for several hours and never be in an area that is "dangerous", for lack of a better word."

What cities have you visited? You're delusional if you think this is true.

[crawford]

Novine, try 100% of Manhattan, 95% of Queens and Staten Island, and 80% of Brooklyn and the Bronx.

All these areas are completely safe to walk around in during daylight hours, and almost all are safe at night.

In Detroit, it would be something like 30% of the city is completely safe to walk around during daylight hours.

[detmich]

"The difference is, in major metropolises you can wander around on foot for several hours and never be in an area that is "dangerous", for lack of a better word."

What cities have you visited? You're delusional if you think this is true.

Again Novine, Detroit is not that different from many other of America's dying smaller cities. Baltimore, Cleveland, StL, Kansas City, et cetera. The "delusion", I would call it "denial", is this silly claim that Detroit is still a thriving major metropolitan center. Sadly, it is not. That doesn't mean that there aren't cool things about Detroit, but being a walker friendly city isn't one of them.

Maybe Detroiters just need to grow up? I don't know. I do know that denying the truth does not change it.

[jjw]

Again Novine, Detroit is not that different from many other of America's dying smaller cities. Baltimore, Cleveland, StL, Kansas City, et cetera. The "delusion", I would call it "denial", is this silly claim that Detroit is still a thriving major metropolitan center. Sadly, it is not. That doesn't mean that there aren't cool things about Detroit, but being a walker friendly city isn't one of them.

Maybe Detroiters just need to grow up? I don't know. I do know that denying the truth does not change it.

Where on Earth are you getting the information that Baltimore or the other cities mentioned are dying? Baltimore is expected to gain population in the next census and has many thriving areas/neighborhoods. Yes, it has tough pockets and sections but it has no where near the problems Detroit is facing.
Also, walking is very much an option in Baltimore as I do it daily. Would I have 10-15 years ago? Probably not. But today without hesitation. Sadly, misery wants company so lumping other places into Detroit's madhouse does not help.

[President Sekou]

I've come to the conclusion that he has no idea what he is talking about, anyone naive enough to assume all of Chicago and NY is completely safe to walk about, and all of Detroit is completely unsafe is not worth arguing with. Only Siths and idiots deal in absolutes.

[detmich]

I've come to the conclusion that he has no idea what he is talking about, anyone naive enough to assume all of Chicago and NY is completely safe to walk about, and all of Detroit is completely unsafe is not worth arguing with. Only Siths and idiots deal in absolutes.

Not all of anywhere is perfectly safe. The problem, relatively speaking, none of Detroit is. Nicely deflected though, the person who says the truth is obviously an idiot. How's the real estate selling in Detroit? I'll bet since prices are down people are swarming into those really cheap safe areas right in Downtown. You folks are right, All those buyers must know something I don't.

[NoHeartAnthony]

When someone asks where is it safe to walk in Manhattan the answer is "anywhere".

Wrong. Some areas north of 100th is sorta shady at night [[Spanish Harlem, Inwood, Washington Heights, etc). How about the projects on the Lower East Side?

You're right, Detroit has no completely safe zones. However, the areas most visited and walked are alright if you're smart about how you go about your business.

[Prodigal_Son]

Novine, try 100% of Manhattan, 95% of Queens and Staten Island, and 80% of Brooklyn and the Bronx.

All these areas are completely safe to walk around in during daylight hours, and almost all are safe at night.

In Detroit, it would be something like 30% of the city is completely safe to walk around during daylight hours.

Uhhhh, you're trying to tell me that 100% of Manhattan is "completely safe" during daylight hours? Sorry, no.

Of course, no place is completely safe, and some are more dangerous than others. You can't let your life be determined by fear, however.

My kids and I walk around my Detroit neighborhood [[Woodbridge) almost every day. Nothing has happened to us yet, and I'm not stupid enough to move away from my city just because I am not perfectly safe.

[detmich]

You're right, Detroit has no completely safe zones.

Thank you. All I am saying is that it is untruthful and irresponsible to tell someone like Ocean that they can come on up to Detroit and wander around the city on foot to get a feel for the neighborhoods. Why this gets so much anger in response is beyond me. Kill the messenger perhaps?

[NoHeartAnthony]

I think a guy like Ocean is free to wander if he so chooses. He better do his research though, know his directions, and be well-prepared for what ever comes his way.

[crawford]

When someone asks where is it safe to walk in Manhattan the answer is "anywhere".

Wrong. Some areas north of 100th is sorta shady at night [[Spanish Harlem, Inwood, Washington Heights, etc). How about the projects on the Lower East Side?

You're right, Detroit has no completely safe zones. However, the areas most visited and walked are alright if you're smart about how you go about your business.

Um, I said [[and we were talking about) daytime. No place in Manhattan is remotely unsafe during daytime hours.

No, not East Harlem, not Washington Heights and not Inwood.

No, it is not unsafe to walk past a housing project in Manhattan [[you do realize there is public housing in every neighborhood in Manhattan, even the very best ones?).

[crawford]

Uhhhh, you're trying to tell me that 100% of Manhattan is "completely safe" during daylight hours? Sorry, no.

I do not know how to to come up with a safety barometer, but I am sure of this: there is no neighborhood anywhere in Manhattan that could be compared with Woodbridge in Detroit in terms of relative safety.

Woodbridge is MUCH more dangerous than anything in Manhattan. Whether it's fine for you is another question; everyone has their own personal requirement of minimum safety.

[NoHeartAnthony]

Um, I said [[and we were talking about) daytime. No place in Manhattan is remotely unsafe during daytime hours.

No, not East Harlem, not Washington Heights and not Inwood.

No, it is not unsafe to walk past a housing project in Manhattan [[you do realize there is public housing in every neighborhood in Manhattan, even the very best ones?).

I quoted detmich, not you.

But anyway, you should probably stop dealing in absolutes, it's pretty illogical. There has been crime committed in the daytime in Manhattan, believe it or not. You're acting as if it would NEVER happen.

[Bearinabox]

This is a stupid thread.

[Ravine]

I second Bear's remark.
This thread was not totally doomed at its outset, but it quickly sank.
Just for the record, I don't think the corner of Livernois & Tireman looks that scary or dangerous.
If you walk around with an anxious, hope-I-get-out-of-here-alive look, every spot in every city is dangerous.

[detmich]

I second Bear's remark.
This thread was not totally doomed at its outset, but it quickly sank.
Just for the record, I don't think the corner of Livernois & Tireman looks that scary or dangerous.
If you walk around with an anxious, hope-I-get-out-of-here-alive look, every spot in every city is dangerous.

Again, a lie to make Detroiters feel better about Detroit. You could look like that all day on the Miracle Mile of Michigan Avenue and no one would bother you. You could do the same thing just up and down Park, Madison, or 5th in Manhattan. PLease, let's just call a spade a spade, Detroit is dangerous. So why deny it?

[Novine]

"Detroit is dangerous. So why deny it?"

Because it's not true. No doubt there's parts of Detroit that aren't safe. No one has denied that. Your claim that everywhere in Detroit is unsafe is a lie. I'm a typical suburbanite. I've walked various stretches of Woodward [[and the Miracle Mile in Chicago and 5th in NYC) where a typical tourist might go both during the day and night. I've never felt like my personal safety is at risk or that I'm in a dangerous area. I've been in enough good and bad parts of big cities across the US to know the difference. It's an obsession with you to repeat that lie and I know you'll continue to do so. But repeating it doesn't make it true.

[crawford]

I quoted detmich, not you.

But anyway, you should probably stop dealing in absolutes, it's pretty illogical. There has been crime committed in the daytime in Manhattan, believe it or not. You're acting as if it would NEVER happen.

Of course; there's obviously lots of crime in all big cities [[excepting maybe Japan or Singapore).

My point isn't that Manhattan doesn't have crime; it's that on a relative basis, it cannot be compared to Detroit. Yes, bad things happen in Manhattan too, but the statistics for that jurisdiction are wildly different than the statistics for Detroit.

Manhattan's crime rate is below the NYC average, and NYC's crime rate is basically one-fifth of Detroit's crime, so Manhattan is logically MUCH safer than the vast majority of Detroit.

[Ocean2026]

This has been a good thread.

Let me clarify - and maybe fine tune it.

One can look at statistics and show for example that Detroit has more assaultive crime than NYC and way more than say El Paso-ok we don't need to argue that. Years of statistics will win out over anecdotal evidence [[ie. "but my uncle knew someone who had a YUGO and it drove just fine")

Likewise we can all agree that a violent crime can happen in any neighborhood in America and such happens frequently.


What I'm getting at is areas where one can generally walk without being even hassled, sized up as potential prey, and where there isn't any visible signs of current or recent activity. So if you're walking on the riverfront and a car blares by stops and the occupants get out and shoot you, its not necessarily that that neigbhorhood isn't safe its more a Detroit of Urban Crime incident. Likewise there may be some areas that are really vacant. They might not look nice and they can be extremely poor but perhaps have few occupants --maybe older residents that haven't been able to flee or fix things up.

Maybe areas that "feel " safe 24/7 would have been a better title.

[detmich]

"but my uncle knew someone who had a YUGO and it drove just fine"

I liked Nick and Nora's Infinite Playlist.

[Ravine]

Just now re-checking this thread and noticing that detmich called my statement "a lie to make Detroiters feel better about Detroit."
Bullshit. And, if you're going to shuffle around this forum calling statements with which you disagree "lies," you will be spending a lot of time getting your ass kicked.
My statement is not a lie. Predators smell fear, and that scent is not blown away by the wind in Chicago, nor is it covered up by the stench of garbage in Manhattan.
I'm not trying to make anyone feel better, or worse, about anything. In fact, I have been repeatedly castigated for making comments, about Detroit, which were perceived as being overly negative, arguably racist, or just too snide for the tender ears of some of our more zealously defensive Pro-Detroit associates.
In any case, detmich, feel free to continue picking a fight with me. I'm sure the rest of the forum will enjoy the results.

[detmich]

Just now re-checking this thread and noticing that detmich called my statement "a lie to make Detroiters feel better about Detroit."
Bullshit. And, if you're going to shuffle around this forum calling statements with which you disagree "lies," you will be spending a lot of time getting your ass kicked.
My statement is not a lie. Predators smell fear, and that scent is not blown away by the wind in Chicago, nor is it covered up by the stench of garbage in Manhattan.
I'm not trying to make anyone feel better, or worse, about anything. In fact, I have been repeatedly castigated for making comments, about Detroit, which were perceived as being overly negative, arguably racist, or just too snide for the tender ears of some of our more zealously defensive Pro-Detroit associates.
In any case, detmich, feel free to continue picking a fight with me. I'm sure the rest of the forum will enjoy the results.

Not trying to pick a fight with anyone. If anything, the fights were picked with me for stating the obvious.

If you walk around with an anxious, hope-I-get-out-of-here-alive look, every spot in every city is dangerous.

That, Ravine, is quite simply a falsehood. I'll say it again, on the corner of 5th Avenue and 57th street that look will not put you in danger. It's on the faces of tourists everyday. Nor will it put you in danger on Michigan at the Water Tower. Nor on Boston's Freedom trail. Attack me and say I am being contentious all you wish.

All I said is it is irresponsible to tell someone who is visiting Detroit for the first time that it is safe for them to walk around town. That seems to have set of a cacophony of bullshit in response.

[Ravine]

"All I said is it is irresponsible to tell someone who is visiting Detroit for the first time that it is safe for them to walk around town."
OK; we can shake on that one, detmich.
But, while we may agree more than we disagree, that is not all you said. You called my comment "a lie," and compounded the affront by presuming to identify my reason for making the comment. Kinda pissed me off, but I'm not going to harbor any ill will over it or chase you down on the playground during Recess.
I still say the look I described is a magnet for trouble in any city where there are nogoodniks wandering around looking for folks to take advantage of, and I would like to think that you are not suggesting that Chicago & New York are free of that character-type.

[NoHeartAnthony]

Not trying to pick a fight with anyone. If anything, the fights were picked with me for stating the obvious.


That, Ravine, is quite simply a falsehood. I'll say it again, on the corner of 5th Avenue and 57th street that look will not put you in danger. It's on the faces of tourists everyday. Nor will it put you in danger on Michigan at the Water Tower. Nor on Boston's Freedom trail. Attack me and say I am being contentious all you wish.

All I said is it is irresponsible to tell someone who is visiting Detroit for the first time that it is safe for them to walk around town. That seems to have set of a cacophony of bullshit in response.

There are other parts to Boston, Chicago, and NYC than the most popular areas. Just sayin'.

[detmich]

"All I said is it is irresponsible to tell someone who is visiting Detroit for the first time that it is safe for them to walk around town."
OK; we can shake on that one, detmich.
But, while we may agree more than we disagree, that is not all you said. You called my comment "a lie," and compounded the affront by presuming to identify my reason for making the comment. Kinda pissed me off, but I'm not going to harbor any ill will over it or chase you down on the playground during Recess.
I still say the look I described is a magnet for trouble in any city where there are nogoodniks wandering around looking for folks to take advantage of, and I would like to think that you are not suggesting that Chicago & New York are free of that character-type.

Ravine- Yeah I was tired of getting beat up, so I did call it a little too strongly.

There are other parts to Boston, Chicago, and NYC than the most popular areas. Just sayin'.

Of course, no one said otherwise.