Theodore Wafer will do at least 17 years.

[Jimaz]

Excuse me while I don my Kevlar longjohns.

There.

Then can we say in this case that the presence of the firearm was a cause of a problem rather than a solution?

[Johnnny5]

What bothers me is that it now seems evident Wafer bought that gun because the kids in the neighborhood were annoying him. That is truly scary.

That is an accusation by the prosecutor. I have not seen any article that mentions Mr. Wafer making that claim or any evidence to suggest that was his reasoning.

[Johnnny5]

Excuse me while I don my Kevlar longjohns.

There.

Then can we say in this case that the presence of the firearm was the cause of a problem rather than the solution?

I would have to agree that in this case the presence of a firearm did nothing but escalate things and lead to tragedy. That being said, I still think McBrides actions were the initial cause of the problem. There are dozens instances of Detroiters legitimately defending themselves and their homes with firearms. This tragedy and Wafer's poor decisions do nothing to change my opinion that people still deserve that right.

[aoife]

Pounding on doors is usually a cry for help.

Thieves don't knock on doors, create a ruckus, and announce their intentions. They try to do things with minimal notice hoping not to be detected and certainly don't want to enter an occupied house. That is when things can really go wrong. The thief could get shot. And thieves don't want to shoot people either. That isn't their motivation.

Not to defend the guy's paranoia, but thieves do in fact knock on doors. It is a very specific kind of home invasion ploy. I had it happen to me when I was in college. Knock on the apartment door, assumed it was a friend who was stopping by and the guy, gun drawn, forced his way in once the door was cracked. It did not end well, for me at least.

Let's not pretend this fellow is unjustified in being frightened -- he did not know it was a teenage girl until he shot her. He had every reason to be scared, he just reacted in a totally ridiculous way. He deserves jail. And probably some help with his mental issues.

[mam2009]

It troubles me that we are holding Mr. Wafer to a very high standard.

Ignoring this partcular case, a man in his own house is disturbed by an apparent intruder. He prepares for the worst, and in his half-awake, adrenaline-fueled stupor makes a bad decision in a moment of fear.

In this case, apparently the jury was presented evidence that this wasn't the case. That he was under little threat. And his actions weren't reasonable.

Maybe that's true. But let's be careful when we apply very high standards while Monday Morning quarterbacking. It can be very hard to know how to deal with intruders. I have. And it can be very hard to deal with drugged up fools. I have. And I've seen harm innocent people in unprovoked attacks.

Let's just hope that the evidence truly supports locking up a man who might just have wanted a good night's sleep.

Anyone who KILLS another human being should be held to a high standard. The human he killed could easily have been a neighbor or a police officer checking on the alleged suspicious activity in the neighborhood, or a woman seeking help... Mr. Wafer said Ms. McBride said nothing. Mr. Wafer had no idea of who was outside and whether they were a threat, whether they were checking on a threat or whether they were running FROM a threat. He only knew SOMEONE was OUTSIDE his house. I'm no anti-gun advocate, but I believe you MUST be properly trained to handle a gun responsibly. A gun is a weapon designed to destroy. I took a week-long gun safety course and a day-long gun safety course. Both classes emphasized the huge responsibility that you take on when you choose to own, transport and/or operate a gun. And both classes emphasized the huge legal [[and emotional) consequences you take on when you aim the gun at a person and pull the trigger which is why the first rule of gun safety is to always point the business end of a gun in a safe direction [[away from anything you are not willing to destroy) regardless of whether it is loaded. To do otherwise with an instrument DESIGNED TO KILL/DESTROY is RECKLESS! If Ted Wafer was WILLING to destroy a human being outside his house [[while he was locked inside his house) for standing on his porch after allegedly knocking on his locked door, he SHOULD be put away for the maximum amount of time. That makes him a demonstrated danger to society!

[Cincinnati_Kid]

Ask the kid who got stabbed to death by a 12 year old on a Kentwood playground. Or the guy that got yanked out of his car and beaten by a 16 year old. Or any of the multitudes of others beaten or killed by teens or younger.

The kid that did the stabbing wasn't a female. Again, I know there are some deranged female teenagers out here, but I'm more likely to fear a male. That's all I'm saying. Wafer had no reason to fear her, period.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

Not to defend the guy's paranoia, but thieves do in fact knock on doors. It is a very specific kind of home invasion ploy. I had it happen to me when I was in college. Knock on the apartment door, assumed it was a friend who was stopping by and the guy, gun drawn, forced his way in once the door was cracked. It did not end well, for me at least.

Let's not pretend this fellow is unjustified in being frightened -- he did not know it was a teenage girl until he shot her. He had every reason to be scared, he just reacted in a totally ridiculous way. He deserves jail. And probably some help with his mental issues.

That's an excuse. All he had to do was look out the window or peephole in the door before he pulled the trigger, and if he was really spooked, call the PO-PO, in Dearborn Heights, they would have been there lickety split. And if she forced entry into the home before they arrive, then he's justified in pulling the trigger.

[Cliffy]

I kind of feel bad for the guy in one hand that he is at home minding his own business and some loser that is high and drunk is pounding on the house for who knows what reason. It was just his horrible luck. He shouldn't get more than 5 years.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

I would have to agree that in this case the presence of a firearm did nothing but escalate things and lead to tragedy. That being said, I still think McBrides actions were the initial cause of the problem. There are dozens instances of Detroiters legitimately defending themselves and their homes with firearms. This tragedy and Wafer's poor decisions do nothing to change my opinion that people still deserve that right.

How did her actions cause the problem when she was just seeking help? Inspite of being drunk and incoherent?

[Cincinnati_Kid]

I kind of feel bad for the guy in one hand that he is at home minding his own business and some loser that is high and drunk is pounding on the house for who knows what reason. It was just his horrible luck. He shouldn't get more than 5 years.

Disagree, he didn't follow proper protocol when using a firearm.

[ABetterDetroit]

Anyone who KILLS another human being should be held to a high standard. The human he killed could easily have been a neighbor or a police officer checking on the alleged suspicious activity in the neighborhood, or a woman seeking help... Mr. Wafer said Ms. McBride said nothing. Mr. Wafer had no idea of who was outside and whether they were a threat, whether they were checking on a threat or whether they were running FROM a threat. He only knew SOMEONE was OUTSIDE his house. I'm no anti-gun advocate, but I believe you MUST be properly trained to handle a gun responsibly. A gun is a weapon designed to destroy. I took a week-long gun safety course and a day-long gun safety course. Both classes emphasized the huge responsibility that you take on when you choose to own, transport and/or operate a gun. And both classes emphasized the huge legal [[and emotional) consequences you take on when you aim the gun at a person and pull the trigger which is why the first rule of gun safety is to always point the business end of a gun in a safe direction [[away from anything you are not willing to destroy) regardless of whether it is loaded. To do otherwise with an instrument DESIGNED TO KILL/DESTROY is RECKLESS! If Ted Wafer was WILLING to destroy a human being outside his house [[while he was locked inside his house) for standing on his porch after allegedly knocking on his locked door, he SHOULD be put away for the maximum amount of time. That makes him a demonstrated danger to society!

Or... Someone involved in a bad car accident [[happened to me at 1am once) or a neighbor who's wife died suddenly and unexpectedly [[happened to me at 3am once) or a young man looking for the young girl who's family I bought the house from [[happened to me lots of times, she had lots of young men looking for her, but only once at 1am) all of them pounding on the door late at night. I guess that's why I don't get the people supporting this guy. Was I prepared for the worst? You bet I was. Was I ready to help who needed help, yes. The help she needed was one 911 call away. Instead he opened the locked door and killed her. mam2009 Thank You

[Johnnny5]

How did her actions cause the problem when she was just seeking help? Inspite of being drunk and incoherent?

If it wasn't for her drinking to excess, wrecking her car and then pounding on a strangers doors at 4am Mr. Wafer would simply have spent the rest of the night sleeping. I'm not saying what the guy did was right and he deserves to go to prison, but the woman does bear some responsibility for what happened. Other articles have mentioned that witnesses to the wreck offered assistance, yet she still left the scene. The idea that she was simply looking for help just doesn't seem likely to me, more likely that as here parents stated the home looked similar to her own and in her state she may have confused the two.

[MSUguy]

I kind of feel bad for the guy in one hand that he is at home minding his own business and some loser that is high and drunk is pounding on the house for who knows what reason. It was just his horrible luck. He shouldn't get more than 5 years.

You feel bad for the guy who shot someone for knocking in his door? The only loser is you for defending this asshole. Stubbing your toe is bad luck, opening your door to shoot whoever is knocking on it makes you a fucking murderer

[MSUguy]

If it wasn't for her drinking to excess, wrecking her car and then pounding on a strangers doors at 4am Mr. Wafer would simply have spent the rest of the night sleeping. I'm not saying what the guy did was right and he deserves to go to prison, but the woman does bear some responsibility for what happened. Other articles have mentioned that witnesses to the wreck offered assistance, yet she still left the scene. The idea that she was simply looking for help just doesn't seem likely to me, more likely that as here parents stated the home looked similar to her own and in her state she may have confused the two.

She bears responsibility for knocking on a door? Only one person committed a crime on that porch.

[Johnnny5]

She bears responsibility for knocking on a door? Only one person committed a crime on that porch.

I don't feel like I need to repeat myself [[again). Just reread my last post as this one will be my last in this thread.

[ABetterDetroit]

I don't feel like I need to repeat myself [[again). Just reread my last post as this one will be my last one in this thread.

I'm with you on the last post part.
Congrats on being in the minority who didn't do something stupid while drinking at 19. I guess the bright side is that all of us didn't get shotgunned to the face for being drunk and stupid at 19.

[Downriviera]

Not surprised by the verdict. I expected this and accept it, but I don't entirely agree with it. I think not guilty on 2nd degree and guilty on manslaughter and fire arms charges. I know I'm in the minority on this here and I accept that, too. So what have we learned from this?

If you don't have a land line you must know where your cell phone is and be able to find it easily in the dark. Have it on a charger next to a night light. If you think someone is trying to break into your home under no circumstances do you open the door. Even if you look out and see a 19 year old girl, she could be a decoy and the armed perps are just waiting for you to open the door. He never really explained why he opened the door other than he didn't want to be a victim. Makes no sense.

Had he not opened the door I think she would have eventually got in. I believe she thought this was her house and was desperate to get in and away from the police to avoid a DUI and leaving the scene of an accident. I don't know if she had a previous record but if she did all the more desperate to get in.

Know this: many homeowners are armed and fearful of home invasions. They are also not well trained in the use of fire arms. Not a good idea to knock, let alone pound on doors in the middle of the night. Take the DUI and live. Being drunk and stupid is a lot riskier these days. Sad case all the way around.

[runnerXT]

Yes. Complete over-reaction. But on your own property, inside your own home, I'm quite all right with the over-reaction. I believe inside your home, you are to be granted extreme discretion to be left alone to peaceably enjoy life.

But she was on the outside. And he could have sat in a chair with his rifle. And when she crossed into the house --- there would have been much less doubt about whether he acted reasonably.

Don't they always say if you have to shoot someone as they crawl in your window, make sure the body falls inward?

Ain't that a great society you live in. I'm visiting another city right now and renting a short term rental. 55 West whatever looks exactly the same as West 53. I forgot which was which and was trying my key over and over late night in the wrong address. OMG I had beers in me too. Blow my head off!!!

[mam2009]

I'm all for the guy going to prison and paying for his actions, but do you really think the maximum sentence [[Life in prison) would be justified is this case?

Yes. He admitted to INTENTIONALLY using deadly force to kill an unarmed human for a reason that is not justified by the law.

[Wesley Mouch]

Anyone who KILLS another human being should be held to a high standard. The human he killed could easily have been a neighbor or a police officer checking on the alleged suspicious activity in the neighborhood, or a woman seeking help... Mr. Wafer said Ms. McBride said nothing. Mr. Wafer had no idea of who was outside and whether they were a threat, whether they were checking on a threat or whether they were running FROM a threat. He only knew SOMEONE was OUTSIDE his house. I'm no anti-gun advocate, but I believe you MUST be properly trained to handle a gun responsibly. A gun is a weapon designed to destroy. I took a week-long gun safety course and a day-long gun safety course. Both classes emphasized the huge responsibility that you take on when you choose to own, transport and/or operate a gun. And both classes emphasized the huge legal [[and emotional) consequences you take on when you aim the gun at a person and pull the trigger which is why the first rule of gun safety is to always point the business end of a gun in a safe direction [[away from anything you are not willing to destroy) regardless of whether it is loaded. To do otherwise with an instrument DESIGNED TO KILL/DESTROY is RECKLESS! If Ted Wafer was WILLING to destroy a human being outside his house [[while he was locked inside his house) for standing on his porch after allegedly knocking on his locked door, he SHOULD be put away for the maximum amount of time. That makes him a demonstrated danger to society!

I share your concern for his behavior, but I don't like to judge when I don't know the facts.

To suggest that to protect yourself with an instrument DESIGNED TO KILL is reckless. Go tell that to the multiple recent incidents where there really were home invasions going on.

I think its RECKLESS to think you know what happened here. I think its RECKLESS to suggest that self-defense against uncivilized behavior is wrong. That logic condemns people in deteriorating neighborhoods to a life of being victim to crime. I think its RECKLESS to judge when you don't know.

[Danny]

This is not a race issue, but the reason that Wafer is found guilty out of fear and bad judgement.

1. From his human nature, a bump in the night means black males wearing Trayvon Martins are casing his house and plan to break in the rob him and his property.

2. Inside his home Wafer got out his shotgun and went to the front door where the pounding is at.

3. He open the door and only a see 'black image' the looks like a black male wearing a Trayvon Martin and shoot him. Only to turn its a black female who needed help.

4. If so Wafer shoots a black female thinking was a black male wearing a Trayvon Martin on purpose. So its not self defense not justified.

Wafer may receive 20 years to life for second degree murder on August 25.

This is will be a lesson to those who live by the gun and balancing self defense.

Self defense in America works if the enemy attacks you out of judgement and predatory nature with bodily harm. Getting your weapon or attacking your foe or an approaching intruder quickly is not self defense or justified. That is why we have to careful while we stand our ground and protect ourselves and right of property.

God didn't give us a spirit of fear, but power, and of love, and a sound mind.

[EastsideAl]

Ain't that a great society you live in. I'm visiting another city right now and renting a short term rental. 55 West whatever looks exactly the same as West 53. I forgot which was which and was trying my key over and over late night in the wrong address. OMG I had beers in me too. Blow my head off!!!

Yes, you were drunk, but were you a negro?

If so, you might frighten people by having the same complexion as someone you don't know who committed a home invasion at some other time. Now, you may be an unarmed person just suffering with some confusion from being drunk, or, you know, injuring yourself in a car accident, but a few of the 66 million people in this country who look vaguely like you have committed a home invasion. So when you come onto the porch it's just obvious self-defense to blast first, and ask questions never. And then Wesley can go back to sleep, dammit!

[gazhekwe]

There are more than a few white folk committing home invasions and burglaries. It is not just a black thing by a long shot.

Wesley Mouch, you keep wringing your hands over 'not knowing all the facts.' What makes you think the jurors did not know all the facts?

[mam2009]

I share your concern for his behavior, but I don't like to judge when I don't know the facts.

To suggest that to protect yourself with an instrument DESIGNED TO KILL is reckless. Go tell that to the multiple recent incidents where there really were home invasions going on.

I think its RECKLESS to think you know what happened here. I think its RECKLESS to suggest that self-defense against uncivilized behavior is wrong. That logic condemns people in deteriorating neighborhoods to a life of being victim to crime. I think its RECKLESS to judge when you don't know.

I never suggested protecting oneself with a deadly weapon was reckless. I was referring to the manner in which he handled his tool of destruction. Mr. Wafer has every right to defend himself with deadly force, as does every U.S. citizen.

He was judged by a jury of his peers. I simply agree with their decision. My opinion comes directly from Mr. Wafer's testimony as reported by the newspapers and tv news. HE said he opened his front door and intentionally shot an unarmed human through his locked storm door, who had not spoken to him as she appeared on his porch from the side of his view. Those facts are not in dispute.

[Meddle]

Nawh, no reason for an adult to be 'afraid' of a teen. None at all. What's a poor little teeney bopper gonna do to a big bad adult?

A 14-year-old alleged gang member was charged as an adult Thursday with murder, accused of stabbing a man to death in downtown San Jose.

Marvin Garcia and two other defendants, Garcia’s brother, Luis Garcia, 21, and Luis Alvarez, 20, are now charged with murder as well as a gang enhancement in the slaying of 33-year-old Marvin Maynard.

http://blog.sfgate.com/crime/2014/08...-jose-slaying/