Ilitch announces Huge plans for Red Wings Arena Project - Renderings Released

[Danny]

It won't be called Joe Louis Arena. But Little Caesar's Palace instead.

[drpoundsign]

There is some historic apartments, and Victorian homes on Charlotte Street. This is part of the character of the City.

[nain rouge]

Looks pretty good, though I'd like to see old renderings of the Comerica Park project to get a feel for how likely this is to get pulled off.

[cman710]

Overall, the design plans exceed my expectations, and I really hope that they come to fruition. This article, however, mentions that there will be some kind of internal streetscape:

Glass covered streetscape: The area between the seating bowl and the outer buildings will be covered by glass to create a “covered via,” or interior streetscape, filled with trees, retail, dining and other amenities. Bridges and walkways will connect the outer buildings to the seating bowl through this covered interior street.

Christopher Ilitch, president and CEO of Ilitch Holdings, said the covered via will be open year-round, not just on game or event days, and could play host to a variety of daytime or nighttime events. Like any good urban street, it will be designed to be walkable, with flexible programming, and to be “a very festive area. ... The net effect is a very energetic, very exciting space,” Ilitch said.

This is a bizarre element to include an otherwise very urban-friendly plan. The "indoor via" sounds to me like an indoor shopping mall made to look like a street. While this could be fantastic in the winter, it will either [[a) take people away from the actual streets outside, harming the atmosphere there, or [[b) end up mostly empty on non-game days.

On the whole, though, this is a small concern because the plan sounds great.

[Mackinaw]

Overall, the design plans exceed my expectations, and I really hope that they come to fruition. This article, however, mentions that there will be some kind of internal streetscape:

This is a bizarre element to include an otherwise very urban-friendly plan. The "indoor via" sounds to me like an indoor shopping mall made to look like a street. While this could be fantastic in the winter, it will either [[a) take people away from the actual streets outside, harming the atmosphere there, or [[b) end up mostly empty on non-game days.

On the whole, though, this is a small concern because the plan sounds great.

It's a bit confusing, but it seems to me that the 'deconstructed arena' means that the souvenir stands and concessions will be in out-buildings along a covered alley. Great concept. Perhaps like Ford Field's Hudson Warehouse side. That said, I am not understanding how this works with security and ticketing. If you are supposed to pop out onto the alley for food and gear, and said alley is publicly accessible, are you allowed back in? Will that be onerous?

By covered streets I am guessing something a bit mall-like, or, in John Gallagher's mind [[and I don't particularly blame him, upon close inspection of the renderings), galleria-like. You know, all Milanese and what not This doesn't bother me too much if this galleria is going to constitute the arena concourse. Again, though, some of the assertions that this is going to be public space still kind of make me scratch my head.

[emu steve]

It's a bit confusing, but it seems to me that the 'deconstructed arena' means that the souvenir stands and concessions will be in out-buildings along a covered alley. Great concept. Perhaps like Ford Field's Hudson Warehouse side. That said, I am not understanding how this works with security and ticketing. If you are supposed to pop out onto the alley for food and gear, and said alley is publicly accessible, are you allowed back in? Will that be onerous?

By covered streets I am guessing something a bit mall-like, or, in John Gallagher's mind [[and I don't particularly blame him, upon close inspection of the renderings), galleria-like. You know, all Milanese and what not This doesn't bother me too much if this galleria is going to constitute the arena concourse. Again, though, some of the assertions that this is going to be public space still kind of make me scratch my head.

BTW, I've tried to disaggregate the rendering and this is what I got [[using that beautiful drawing with the Red Wing logo on the roof of the arena):

Upper right hand corner could be an Ilitch-built office building at Woodward/Temple.

Next, the Wings' offices.

Next, the Wings' store.

Next, lower right hand corner, appears to be maybe general retail or food or ?

Next, there are two perpendicular buildings which appear to be a hotel [[not an Ilitch-built building).

Next, adjacent to the hotel are green space and a parking garage.

Next, moving north from the hotel are two Ilitch-built residentials [[mid-rise) 'attached' to the arena.

Next, immediately north of the parking garage are connected buildings. I have no idea what? who?

Next, moving to the left side of the drawing, I see a plaza with some unidentified buildings behind them. What? Who?

Next, I see parking and the two big buildings folks here want to save.

Next, at the very top of the drawing is some housing? What? Who? [[I'd assume that is an artist's creation and not something Ilitches plan on building but who knows...).

[cman710]

It's a bit confusing, but it seems to me that the 'deconstructed arena' means that the souvenir stands and concessions will be in out-buildings along a covered alley. Great concept. Perhaps like Ford Field's Hudson Warehouse side. That said, I am not understanding how this works with security and ticketing. If you are supposed to pop out onto the alley for food and gear, and said alley is publicly accessible, are you allowed back in? Will that be onerous?

By covered streets I am guessing something a bit mall-like, or, in John Gallagher's mind [[and I don't particularly blame him, upon close inspection of the renderings), galleria-like. You know, all Milanese and what not This doesn't bother me too much if this galleria is going to constitute the arena concourse. Again, though, some of the assertions that this is going to be public space still kind of make me scratch my head.

Perhaps it will be open to the public aside from certain hours before and after a game? Even then, though, they would need some way to prevent people without tickets from getting into the seating area.

[Zads07]

Looks pretty good, though I'd like to see old renderings of the Comerica Park project to get a feel for how likely this is to get pulled off.

Here's the link to the renderings of Comerica Park.

http://www.stadiumpage.com/future/Comerica_G.html

[dtowncitylover]

Looks pretty good, though I'd like to see old renderings of the Comerica Park project to get a feel for how likely this is to get pulled off.

If you saw the renderings for Comerica, it was not as bold as this plan is. It was mostly just building a stadium as opposed to an entire new district.

Also, it's interesting to see the creation of new "neighborhoods". Columbia Park. Cass Park [[more solidified). Wildcat Corner [[a better name could've been chosen...sounds like a country bar).

[emu steve]

If you saw the renderings for Comerica, it was not as bold as this plan is. It was mostly just building a stadium as opposed to an entire new district.

Also, it's interesting to see the creation of new "neighborhoods". Columbia Park. Cass Park [[more solidified). Wildcat Corner [[a better name could've been chosen...sounds like a country bar).

I've wondered about this.

Columbia Park and Wildcat Corner aren't anything really new. I see minimal change here.

The big one is Cass Park. That could be trying to build a whole new neighborhood out of an area which doesn't have much going on now.

I drove through it when I was in Detroit two weeks ago and it was blah.

[ghettopalmetto]

If you saw the renderings for Comerica, it was not as bold as this plan is. It was mostly just building a stadium as opposed to an entire new district.

Also, it's interesting to see the creation of new "neighborhoods". Columbia Park. Cass Park [[more solidified). Wildcat Corner [[a better name could've been chosen...sounds like a country bar).

About that "district":

The Ilitches are under no obligation to construct anything beyond an arena. It has been reported, however, that they will commit $200 million toward building retail, offices, and residential spaces.

To put that in perspective, the Compuware building cost $350 million when it was constructed. So this entire pre-fab shopping mall district, despite what the drawings show, will be approximately half of one Compuware. Depending on what bells and whistles they've included within the scope of the actual arena, the $200 million may only be enough money to construct the privately-owned "arcades" that Ilitch will use to keep your money inside his building.

Suffice it to say, the $636 million price tag is only sufficient to construct a very small fraction of what is shown in the renderings. And you bet your ass that each and every one of those new buildings will be designed to funnel your cash directly into Mike Ilitch's taxpayer-fattened wallet.

Good work, Detroit!

[dtowncitylover]

About that "district":

The Ilitches are under no obligation to construct anything beyond an arena. It has been reported, however, that they will commit $200 million toward building retail, offices, and residential spaces.

To put that in perspective, the Compuware building cost $350 million when it was constructed. So this entire pre-fab shopping mall district, despite what the drawings show, will be approximately half of one Compuware. Depending on what bells and whistles they've included within the scope of the actual arena, the $200 million may only be enough money to construct the privately-owned "arcades" that Ilitch will use to keep your money inside his building.

Suffice it to say, the $636 million price tag is only sufficient to construct a very small fraction of what is shown in the renderings. And you bet your ass that each and every one of those buildings will be designed to funnel your cash directly into Mike Ilitch's wallet.

Good work, Detroit!

You are very bitter. As much as a bold plan this is, I don't think the Illitches want to spend all their money building an entirely new neighborhood. They are probably looking for other investors/developers, both public and private, to go in with them on this.

[Detroitnerd]

I have a prediction. The areas controlled by Ilitch and his organizations will see slower growth than adjoining areas that were given no subsidies. In fact, the area between the stadium and the casino will mostly be a dead zone and any new construction completed by 2017 will have to be taken down in 30 years.

See? No arguing, just an informed guess. Take it or leave it.

[bailey]

You are very bitter. As much as a bold plan this is, I don't think the Illitches want to spend all their money building an entirely new neighborhood. They are probably looking for other investors/developers, both public and private, to go in with them on this.

There is nothing "bold" about a plan that is mostly make believe. Nothing on that drawing that isn't stadium or parking deck is getting built.

Seriously folks, how many times are we going to let Lucy hold the football?

[dtowncitylover]

There is nothing "bold" about a plan that is mostly make believe. Nothing on that drawing that isn't stadium or parking deck is getting built.

Seriously folks, how many times are we going to let Lucy hold the football?

I'm pretty sure you said this about the M-1 tram...of course what did you think about Book Cadillac, Broderick Tower, Compuware?

Anyways...just because this may or may not get built doesn't mean it's not a bold plan. This is a bold plan. What did I hear? The largest building undertaking since the Renaissance Center? 40 years of scaled back projects or nothing, then this!

I'm pretty left of center but believe in the capitalist system in most instances. Many people cry, "let the private sector build it!". Now that the private sector wants to build something, we are dispraging it. I think some of you are pissy because it's an interesting and engaging plan coming from an unlikely source.

My thinking is that since Illitch can't get a Tigers championship, this will be his own monument for us to remember. Like a pharoah building a pyramid.

[canuck]

You are very bitter. As much as a bold plan this is, I don't think the Illitches want to spend all their money building an entirely new neighborhood. They are probably looking for other investors/developers, both public and private, to go in with them on this.

Fair enough. As long as the 40-odd city block hoarder does better than his past record shows. I understand the frustration that the Russians have vis-à-vis the oligarchs. Detroit has a couple of controversial capitalists in need of supervision. The kind of block intervention Tyree Guyton does creates steam between the eats of some, Illitch can take the heat at his level of comfort.

[emu steve]

About that "district":

The Ilitches are under no obligation to construct anything beyond an arena. It has been reported, however, that they will commit $200 million toward building retail, offices, and residential spaces.

To put that in perspective, the Compuware building cost $350 million when it was constructed. So this entire pre-fab shopping mall district, despite what the drawings show, will be approximately half of one Compuware. Depending on what bells and whistles they've included within the scope of the actual arena, the $200 million may only be enough money to construct the privately-owned "arcades" that Ilitch will use to keep your money inside his building.

Suffice it to say, the $636 million price tag is only sufficient to construct a very small fraction of what is shown in the renderings. And you bet your ass that each and every one of those new buildings will be designed to funnel your cash directly into Mike Ilitch's taxpayer-fattened wallet.

Good work, Detroit!

And, on the other hand, Ilitches spend 200 - 300M [[beyond the arena) AND some venture capitalists come along and drop another 100M or so.

You say arena + NOTHING? Maybe it is an arena + 300 - 400M?

There are orgs like CalPers [[California employees retirement system) looking to invest big dollars on projects which will guarantee a good return. [[the money could be secured by the Tigers or Wings).

There is a lot of money sitting on the sidelines waiting for a good project to invest in.

[Novine]

I'm going to predict that the parking lots in front of Comerica aren't going anywhere soon. Check back in a year and we'll see if there's construction or cars in that area.

[mikeg19]

About that "district":
Depending on what bells and whistles they've included within the scope of the actual arena, the $200 million may only be enough money to construct the privately-owned "arcades" that Ilitch will use to keep your money inside his building.

And you bet your ass that each and every one of those new buildings will be designed to funnel your cash directly into Mike Ilitch's taxpayer-fattened wallet.

Good work, Detroit!

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't buildings/restaurants/bars/stadiums/malls/casinos, well basically every place you go, designed to "keep your money inside his building"? Kinda the purpose of going to a destination. You could say that Dan Gilbert is trying to keep your money in his businesses and venues. Maybe that's why these guys are successful business owners.

Don't get me wrong Ghetto, I'm not trying to jump on your back, as I'm sure we are all skeptical regarding any Illitch developments, but for all intensive purposes, it appears that this development is legit for what they are proposing. I don't think they are promising anything pie-in-the-sky for $50 bucks where we can say it ain't gonna happen.

[rondinjp]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't buildings/restaurants/bars/stadiums/malls/casinos, well basically every place you go, designed to "keep your money inside his building"? Kinda the purpose of going to a destination. You could say that Dan Gilbert is trying to keep your money in his businesses and venues. Maybe that's why these guys are successful business owners.

Don't get me wrong Ghetto, I'm not trying to jump on your back, as I'm sure we are all skeptical regarding any Illitch developments, but for all intensive purposes, it appears that this development is legit for what they are proposing. I don't think they are promising anything pie-in-the-sky for $50 bucks where we can say it ain't gonna happen.

While I'm very excited with the stadium renderings, I have to admit that I am a little skeptical on the other disclosed "plans." The same exact plans have been proposed/disclosed by the Ilitch's in the past and have never come through to fruition.

http://tinyurl.com/ocs55s4

http://tinyurl.com/ok47yms

http://tinyurl.com/ppyb5fo

Hopefully this time it is for real and the Ilitch's really were just hamstrung by not having gathered all the property together.

[1953]

I'm just glad they intend to put the Statler back up, per the rending.

[dtowncitylover]

While I'm very excited with the stadium renderings, I have to admit that I am a little skeptical on the other disclosed "plans." The same exact plans have been proposed/disclosed by the Ilitch's in the past and have never come through to fruition.

http://tinyurl.com/ocs55s4

http://tinyurl.com/ok47yms

http://tinyurl.com/ppyb5fo

Hopefully this time it is for real and the Ilitch's really were just hamstrung by not having gathered all the property together.

What he proposed then is pretty much the same he proposing now, but without one thing: downtown and midtown are coming back. Downtown was dead in 2000 and no one was investing. Now we have not only the Illitches, but also Glibert, Penske, etc doing their thing. They weren't around 15 years ago.

[buckster1986]

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20140905/BIZ/309050103/1361/Launch-of-$650M-Detroit-development-plan-expected-to-begin-Thursday