How many "yuppies" have actually moved to Detroit the past couple of years?

[e.p.3]

Is there an independent [[read: not the Gilbert Press, Gilbert News, or Crain's Gilbert Business) source that proves there has been this deluge of yuppies living in Detroit? I see a lot of people reference this Midtown/downtown/corktown uptick, but the census data doesn't show any uptick in Detroit. Furthermore, do these people actually stay put, or are they bolting after a year or two? Anecdotal, but a few kids from my church tried the city and left after a frustrating 12 months. So, how many people are actually moving to these prime neighborhoods?

[nain rouge]

Truth is - yes - yuppies have been moving into the heart of Detroit, but working class people have been moving out about an equal pace. That's because most new employers in the area only really benefit white collar employees, or hipsters that are helped out by their parents in one way or another and just "need a job". Obviously, NPR, NYT, and CNN find the yuppie's businesses way more interesting than another working class establishment, and hence the increased visibility.

[dtowncitylover]

Census data doesn't show an uptick for the city as a whole, but I do believe it shows an uptick for the downtown and midtown neighborhoods.

Did your church kids go to Wayne State then decide to commute? Or did they think they were city people and then leave. Not everyone is cut out for city living, and I mean that in the broadest sense. If you couldn't survive in this city then you might not be able to survive in Chicago or Brooklyn.

[e.p.3]

Census data doesn't show an uptick for the city as a whole, but I do believe it shows an uptick for the downtown and midtown neighborhoods.

Did your church kids go to Wayne State then decide to commute? Or did they think they were city people and then leave. Not everyone is cut out for city living, and I mean that in the broadest sense. If you couldn't survive in this city then you might not be able to survive in Chicago or Brooklyn.

Most moved to other cities, out of state. A pair moved to Royal Oak.

[TTime]

Census data doesn't show an uptick for the city as a whole, but I do believe it shows an uptick for the downtown and midtown neighborhoods.

Did your church kids go to Wayne State then decide to commute? Or did they think they were city people and then leave. Not everyone is cut out for city living, and I mean that in the broadest sense. If you couldn't survive in this city then you might not be able to survive in Chicago or Brooklyn.

I would never suggest that someone could gauge if they were able to survive city living based on their experiences in Detroit. Living in Detroit is a very unique experience to be sure with a number of pluses and minuses but very few parallels to Brooklyn or Chicago.

[artds]

Can we get a definition of "yuppie" before proceeding with this thread?

[gvidas]

Can we get a definition of "yuppie" before proceeding with this thread?

Wikipedia pegs it as "short for "young urban professional" or "young upwardly-mobile professional." In this context 'professional' is a term of art that I take as 'on track to a white collar job.'

So we're basically talking about young people, probably with a college degree, working in office jobs or otherwise starting a career.

Coming at it from the other direction, I don't think that I'd lump into this category anyone who is self-employed or working in art, the service industry, manufacturing [[ha), construction, or a dead-end corner of an office.

[jiminnm]

Wikipedia pegs it as "short for "young urban professional" or "young upwardly-mobile professional."

Wouldn't a "young upwardly-mobile professional" be a Yumpie?

[DetroitPlanner]

Can we get a definition of "yuppie" before proceeding with this thread?

Good point. Yuppie was a term used in the mid 1980's. That demographic is at youngest mid-40's to 60 years of age by now and are characterized by very high wealth, an affinity for boat shoes and cardigan sweaters with alligators on them.

Perhaps the poster means Hipster?

[daveyarm]

Can we get a definition of "yuppie" before proceeding with this thread?

It refers, of course, to "young urban professionals". Most of all of us take that to mean attorneys, accountants, advertising people, IT folks, etc.

[Mackinaw]

Look, you're not going to get anyone official to tell you how many yuppies are moving in [[at least until the census, when you can look at demographic and educational-background breakdowns), but there should be a source on population inflow to the central city, including downtown, midtown, Lafayette Pk/E.Market, and Corktown. While the inflow is not as monolithic in demographic as some believe, it is generally young, and these numbers will answer your question.

What we're starting to see, and it's really good news, is some other neighborhoods further from the central city gain new residents, like West Village.

My anecdotes are reporting better things than yours.

But people will come and then go because city living might not be for them. There is a noticeable flow of young, often privileged state-school-educated metro Detroit youth to Chicago or DC-- but only certain, safe parts of Chicago or DC, where they live in fear of and with considerable prejudice toward other areas where yuppies haven't touched. You can't really have that sheltered existence anywhere in Detroit. Detroit is still for the tough and/or open-minded, and particularly for those who gain street smarts quickly. I am honestly okay with that, as the Chicago and D.C. model still promotes too much prejudice, segregation, and sheltering. If people move to Detroit trying to really dig in and be Detroiters, not just people existing in a place for the sake of trendiness, I think we'll be much better off. And we'll be even better off if, as Nain alludes to, we bring the outer-neighborhood outflow down to a more normal trickle.

[e.p.3]

1. A yuppy is a young, urban profession. You know, 22 to 40 [[?), college degree, real job.

2. Nobody has provided one piece of evidence to prove there is an influx of yuppy residents to these neighborhoods. The drivers license has nothing to do with census or independent data. Furthermore, it's a misdemeanor to not change your address. I've never been in a business meeting where I closed the deal without real data. Anecdotal optics and excuses [[e.g. drivers licenses aren't changed??!) don't pass the smell test.

[313WX]

2. Nobody has provided one piece of evidence to prove there is an influx of yuppy residents to these neighborhoods. The drivers license has nothing to do with census or independent data. Furthermore, it's a misdemeanor to not change your address. I've never been in a business meeting where I closed the deal without real data. Anecdotal optics and excuses [[e.g. drivers licenses aren't changed??!) don't pass the smell test.

Someone believes there's now enough demand to renovate the Strathmoor apartments and Broderick Tower [[both of which are huge) that have been vacant for years, for one.

Also, Whole Foods wouldn't have opened down there [[even with the generous tax credits) if there wouldn't be enough customer demand.

[e.p.3]

Someone believes there's now enough demand to renovate the Strathmoor apartments and Broderick Tower [[both of which are huge) that have been vacant for years, for one.

Also, Whole Foods wouldn't have opened down there [[even with the generous tax credits) if there wouldn't be enough customer demand.

Demand != subsidies to build something != influx of yuppies.

[drjeff]

Demand != subsidies to build something != influx of yuppies.

Who do you think is occupying all the rental units in downtown, including many that have opened up in the past 2 years? Occupancy is near 100%. Are these all poor black people paying the highest rents in the city? Your criticism doesn't pass the smell test either.

[313WX]

Demand != subsidies to build something != influx of yuppies.

I don't necessarily agree with subsidizing this growth and these developments, but if Detroit has any chance of survival, what else do you suggest we do to make the city an attractive place to live again?

[dtowncitylover]

1. A yuppy is a young, urban profession. You know, 22 to 40 [[?), college degree, real job.

2. Nobody has provided one piece of evidence to prove there is an influx of yuppy residents to these neighborhoods. The drivers license has nothing to do with census or independent data. Furthermore, it's a misdemeanor to not change your address. I've never been in a business meeting where I closed the deal without real data. Anecdotal optics and excuses [[e.g. drivers licenses aren't changed??!) don't pass the smell test.

I'm apprehensive about responding to you because in the dozen or so posts you have posted I can already tell you hold the antagonistic and old school suburb vs. city views.

You say anecdotal evidence doesn't pass your smell test yet you give one in your initial post. The we give examples of the Broderick Tower, Whole Foods, The Auburn, and you disregard them.

Go downtown on an average week day and tell me no one is down there. 5-6 years ago Woodward was still dead at 1 pm, I would beg to differ now. Many of the Merchant Row buildings are being used now. 1528 Woodward, Moosejaw, DIME, D:Hive, Somerset sometimes are truly pioneers along that strip. There is an influx of residents and workers that hasn't been officially documented because 2010 Census was too close to the turning point.

[313WX]

There is an influx of residents and workers that hasn't been officially documented because 2010 Census was too close to the turning point.

You were right on in your post up to this point.

If these people moving downtown are still using suburban addresses, their influx will never be officially documented.

[noggin]

You were right on in your post up to this point.

If these people moving downtown are still using suburban addresses, their influx will never be officially documented.

With the high cost of Detroit auto insurance and income tax, I would agree that many of these young people are voting or being counted in any census data. They most likely would have an outstate or suburban "official address".

[dtowncitylover]

You were right on in your post up to this point.

If these people moving downtown are still using suburban addresses, their influx will never be officially documented.

Haha, yes and I would agree. I would say that they might love living in the city but know it could be any day or week when they decide they've had enough and move out. I don't blame them necessarily. I would rather live in a neighborhood than in the city center. But that's because I like to have yardage and a house or at least a brownstone [[wishful thinking here I know). I think many of these kids do too, but when they get sick of the apartment/loft living they have to move past 8 Mile because of crime and schools and many neighborhoods are predominately black and they don't know how to handle it growing up in white bread America . I've heard that in many neighborhoods there is a level of distrust towards whites [[can't say I blame them either). I would love to live there, but I don't want to be eyed as the carpetbagger. Now, I know this excludes N. Rosedale Park, EEV, the tony neighborhoods.

[DetroitPlanner]

1. A yuppy is a young, urban profession. You know, 22 to 40 [[?), college degree, real job.

2. Nobody has provided one piece of evidence to prove there is an influx of yuppy residents to these neighborhoods. The drivers license has nothing to do with census or independent data. Furthermore, it's a misdemeanor to not change your address. I've never been in a business meeting where I closed the deal without real data. Anecdotal optics and excuses [[e.g. drivers licenses aren't changed??!) don't pass the smell test.

That was 30 years ago.

[313WX]

Many call themselves "living" downtown, but still claim their residence at mommy and daddy's house in the suburbs to avoid city taxes and the high car insurance rates.

This still hurts Detroit as far as political representation and federal funding is concerned.

BTW, in the 2010 census, the downtown/midtown census tracts actually saw a sizable net loss of people.

[dtowncitylover]

BTW, in the 2010 census, the downtown/midtown census tracts actually saw a sizable net loss of people.

And I would guess that would still be too early to tell about the growth of the city center. Quicken Loans didn't move downtown until August 2010 and alot of projects open today were still on going or not yet realized, like the Auburn or Broderick Tower.

[motz]

Many call themselves "living" downtown, but still claim their residence at mommy and daddy's house in the suburbs to avoid city taxes and the high car insurance rates.

This still hurts Detroit as far as political representation and federal funding is concerned.

BTW, in the 2010 census, the downtown/midtown census tracts actually saw a sizable net loss of people.

Yep, that's basically it. Some of people would like to live in the City, but can't afford the absurdly high premiums there. Keep an address in the suburbs [[yeah, it's always mommy and daddy's, cute 313) but it's mainly because insurance is absolutely outrageous for neighborhoods that are pretty universally accepted as "safer than some suburbs".

[nain rouge]

Honestly, this report, 7.2 Square Miles, tells you all you need to know about Greater Downtown's demographics: http://detroitsevenpointtwo.com/reso...fullreport.pdf . Greater Downtown lost about 5,000 people, but gained diversity.