'Magic Plus' Plan for Michigan State Fairgrounds?

**MSUguy** · August-18-20, 10:59 AM

Originally Posted by Satiricalivory

Looks like Amazon is adding some very high paying jobs too.

Amazon to hire 100 more white-collar jobs in Detroit that pay $150K
https://www.freep.com/story/money/bu...it/3379498001/

Does anybody know what the total white collar jobs would be there after this? I think last I heard they had 200-500 people there already?

Seriously? It's in the second paragraph of the article

"These new hires would join the 400 existing Amazon employees who, if not for the coronavirus pandemic, are situated in the building."

**Satiricalivory** · August-18-20, 11:47 AM

Originally Posted by MSUguy

Seriously? It's in the second paragraph of the article

"These new hires would join the 400 existing Amazon employees who, if not for the coronavirus pandemic, are situated in the building."

I skimmed it, but thanks for being so nice!

**hybridy** · February-09-21, 10:50 AM

DDOT finalizes new State Fair Transit Center location

On Monday, the Detroit Department of Transportation [[DDOT) announced where a new transit center would fit in to the current site plan. The new transit center would be constructed off of 8 Mile, with connected pathways to the nearby Meijer. The new facility will have indoor and outdoor waiting areas, and bathroom facilities.

**casscorridor** · February-11-21, 11:40 AM

Originally Posted by hybridy

DDOT finalizes new State Fair Transit Center location

Regardless what you think of Amazon, it's clear that there was zero reason why the historic structures needed to be destroyed. None.

**Dexlin** · February-11-21, 11:50 PM

Originally Posted by casscorridor

Regardless what you think of Amazon, it's clear that there was zero reason why the historic structures needed to be destroyed. None.

Yeah, that's the other part that got me and relates to the site plan. It's like when you clear-cut an entire forest for a set of powerlines or something.

**401don** · February-13-21, 09:40 AM

Originally Posted by Dexlin

Yeah, that's the other part that got me and relates to the site plan. It's like when you clear-cut an entire forest for a set of powerlines or something.

Was site design by Olympia Development?

**Hamtragedy** · February-13-21, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by 401don

Was site design by Olympia Development?

LOL! Seems to have the foresight and creativity of Olympia, doesn't it.

Which is to say none of the above.

**Ray1936** · February-13-21, 06:16 PM

Originally Posted by casscorridor

Regardless what you think of Amazon, it's clear that there was zero reason why the historic structures needed to be destroyed. None.

Um.....just because something is old, it does not necessarily mean it is historic. WTF, I'm old, but I'm sure not historic. I don't think, anyway.

**bust** · February-13-21, 06:27 PM

Originally Posted by Ray1936

Um.....just because something is old, it does not necessarily mean it is historic. WTF, I'm old, but I'm sure not historic. I don't think, anyway.

I still hope you document your experiences on the job.
I can only imagine the history you have to share.
A precious perspective, don't take it for granted.

**masterblaster** · February-13-21, 07:54 PM

Originally Posted by Ray1936

Um.....just because something is old, it does not necessarily mean it is historic. WTF, I'm old, but I'm sure not historic. I don't think, anyway.

Many of the world's foremost musical talents performed at the Coliseum and the Bandshell - Louis Armstong, Johnny Cash, Chuck Berry, Michael Jackson, Nirvana, Al Green, Tim McGraw, Ray Charles, amongst many others.

The Shrine Circus performed in the Coliseum for many decades

The Detroit Symphony Orchestra and the Detroit Concert Band performed outdoor concerts at the Bandshell for decades

WWF events were held at the Michigan State Fairgrounds

Seabiscuit - the world-renowned Triple Crown winning horse from the 1930's competed in races at the State Fairgrounds.

In the 1950's, NASCAR races were held there, and famous NASCAR drivers of that period competed in them [[the horse racing and auto racing facilities were demolished in 2001, however)

Ronald Reagan, when he was running for president in 1980 and the Republican Convention was in Detroit, visited the Michigan State Fair.

All of that is HISTORY. You were around when all that happened.

**Dexlin** · February-13-21, 09:59 PM

Originally Posted by Ray1936

Um.....just because something is old, it does not necessarily mean it is historic. WTF, I'm old, but I'm sure not historic. I don't think, anyway.

Well, accept for the fact that, you know, that the Michigan State Fair Riding Coliseum, Dairy Cattle Building, and Agricultural Building are literally on the National Register of Historic Places.

And, I'd argue you're historic, because you're certainly one of a kind...

**Wheels** · February-14-21, 04:10 PM

Originally Posted by hybridy

DDOT finalizes new State Fair Transit Center location

This could be the last useful transit development in Detroit with budajunk running the show unless you ride a bicycle, scooter or wheelchair!

https://www.bizpacreview.com/2021/02...ravel-1027592/

**Seven&wyo** · February-14-21, 04:18 PM

Originally Posted by Wheels

This could be the last useful transit development in Detroit with budajunk running the show unless you ride a bicycle, scooter or wheelchair!

https://www.bizpacreview.com/2021/02...ravel-1027592/

Yep, federal politics that’s exactly what this thread needs. Christ, get a hobby

**Gistok** · February-14-21, 05:04 PM

Originally Posted by Wheels

This could be the last useful transit development in Detroit with budajunk running the show unless you ride a bicycle, scooter or wheelchair!

https://www.bizpacreview.com/2021/02...ravel-1027592/

Wheels, can you leave your anti-Biden cabinet name calling and agenda bias against Buttigieg over at the kiddie table [[Non-Detroit Issues). People are trying to have meaningful discussions here.

**Wheels** · February-14-21, 06:30 PM

Originally Posted by Gistok

Wheels, can you leave your anti-Biden cabinet name calling and agenda bias against Buttigieg over at the kiddie table [[Non-Detroit Issues). People are trying to have meaningful discussions here.

Thats hilarious coming from the orange man bad crowd!

**Seven&wyo** · February-14-21, 06:48 PM

Originally Posted by Wheels

Thats hilarious coming from the orange man bad crowd!

This is a thread about busses....

**KnnNike** · February-09-21, 01:19 PM

I just cannot believe that this is the limit of the City's imagination; for Pete's sake, build several stories of apartments on top of that transit center at the very least; that alone would sow the seeds for a true transit-oriented development, and could easily be accomplished on that footprint.

**hybridy** · February-09-21, 02:10 PM

Originally Posted by KnnNike

I just cannot believe that this is the limit of the City's imagination; for Pete's sake, build several stories of apartments on top of that transit center at the very least; that alone would sow the seeds for a true transit-oriented development, and could easily be accomplished on that footprint.

Indeed. Some workforce housing adjacent to retail, jobs and integrated into a transit station isn't a stretch by any imagination.

There's even handy graphics out there:
http://www.tod.org/stations.html

**bust** · February-09-21, 03:45 PM

Indeed, indeed.
That's a good link, hybridy.
But here I suggest patience.
Hopefully the "future developments" will include residential on higher floors.
If that proves successful, the dinky "transit center" shouldn't be hard to replace.
However until the entire bus fleet has been upgraded I wouldn't want to live above so much traditional diesel bus exhaust.
The "future development" sites would be more attractive, wouldn't they?

Apologies for my low expectations, but the current plan will be a huge improvement over vacant land. It will be good to see it happen.

**masterblaster** · February-09-21, 11:14 PM

Originally Posted by bust

Apologies for my low expectations, but the current plan will be a huge improvement over vacant land. It will be good to see it happen.

The future plans will be light industrial. Duggan is trying to get auto suppliers to set up shop there.

A poster above said it best: lack of IMAGINATION. The Fairgrounds could have been a one-of-kind mixed use development/public space incorporating some of the old fairground buildings. Duggan never solicited an RFP for a mixed-use redevelopment of the site in the 2 years the city owned it before they announced Amazon. He never had any public meetings with the neighborhoods around the Fairgrounds to get their input on what they would have liked.

**KnnNike** · February-11-21, 04:48 PM

Originally Posted by bust

Indeed, indeed.
That's a good link, hybridy.
But here I suggest patience.
Hopefully the "future developments" will include residential on higher floors.
If that proves successful, the dinky "transit center" shouldn't be hard to replace.
However until the entire bus fleet has been upgraded I wouldn't want to live above so much traditional diesel bus exhaust.
The "future development" sites would be more attractive, wouldn't they?

Apologies for my low expectations, but the current plan will be a huge improvement over vacant land. It will be good to see it happen.

With all due respect, no. You're more than entitled to your preferences, but the fact is that even the oldest DDOT fleet right now is only 7 years old [[and those are a very small %). Nearly all of their fleet is now-diesel electric, and even the current diesel-only buses emit a minute amount of emissions.

The bigger concern would be noise from the buses, but this is a completely solvable problem; literally thousands of cities have done so with transit-oriented developments.

**bust** · February-13-21, 03:18 PM

Originally Posted by KnnNike

...even the oldest DDOT fleet right now is only 7 years old [[and those are a very small %). Nearly all of their fleet is now-diesel electric, and even the current diesel-only buses emit a minute amount of emissions.

Thanks.

Originally Posted by KnnNike

The bigger concern would be noise

Came so close to writing that too.

Originally Posted by KnnNike

literally thousands of cities have done so with transit-oriented developments.

I know, at least hundreds. I fully support transit-oriented development.

But transit-oriented development succeeds in cities that are much denser, where much more is possible without a car. The fairgrounds and its vicinity are nothing like dense. People will want a car.

If the "future development" materializes and includes residential I'd still consider it transit-oriented, and definitely a win.

I've only owned cars in Detroit. Everywhere else I chose where I didn't need one.

I don't disagree with your vision, at all. I hope the proposed design will be steps towards it, bringing many direct and collateral benefits along the way. And if it succeeds it has plenty of room to grow closer to it.

Of course it could it be better. It should absolutely not be the end goal. And it isn't.

It's smaller steps, more likely to find their footing, especially right out of the gate. Would be a shame for this project to fail because before it gained momentum it tried to leap too far.

I hate parking lots. That's obvious from my previous posts. And I put quotes around "transit center" for a reason.

But there's almost nothing easier to develop than a parking lot. Until then they serve a useful purpose. And like I said, that transit center structure will be easy to replace if demand for more residential coalesces and that's the best location.

Until then, let's not expect Detroit and Metro-Detroiters to turn on a dime. Let's push in the right direction, toward our goals. Progress is still progress, even when it's not as fast as some want.

I'm hopeful for this first phase, optimistic it will get better-- unless it trips up before it nears critical mass.

**Dexlin** · February-09-21, 11:28 PM

Don't ask how, but I've seen updated renderings one of the Magic+ site. It will be your typical mixed-use [[i.e. multi-story buildings, ground floor commercial) and mixed-tenancy [[market-rate, senior, 'affordable,' etc) modernist architectural development .

As for the city's portion, it's embarrassing. I don't mind them developing it with light industrial space; it's the only kind of space selling and leasing like hotcakes in the region, right now. But the site plan is so 1980's Southfield; such an incredibly waste of good land by placing it setback so far from everything, like literally the only orientation of the building that is horrible. If they wanted it setback from the Magic+ stuff they could have wedged it up against the CN tracks. You're gonna move the transit center to literally across the street and then still surround it with suburban-sized setbacks and surplus parking?

**Danny** · February-10-21, 07:37 AM

What up with this 'Magic Plus' Plan? It better not be some Disneyworld-eqsue theme park or a just a one big large greenspace with nothing. I would like to see housing going up in that area with hub shopping and tight security to keep out of the riff-raffs.

**royce** · February-11-21, 02:44 AM

My gripe is that this transit center should have built along with the retail development years ago. What was the reason for that? Was it a lack of cooperation between the state and the city; the city and the developer? Better late than never. Now, as someone mentioned earlier, there needs to be some affordable housing and senior housing. One thing that improves a senior's quality of life is being able to walk to things they need - the grocery store, bank, and pharmacy.

Redeveloping the Michigan State Fairgrounds should have been a no-brainer. Was politics, greed, or just a lack of imagination[[as someone mentioned earlier) the reason? It's time for a Detroit News or Detroit Free Press expose.