GPP and their Farmers Market smack dab in Kercheval.

**Goose** · June-20-14, 02:43 PM

white Detroiters will have no problem circumnavigating this obstacle? is the inference here that black Detroiters will be confused and be unable to get through this? that thought in itself, is at minimal pandering... and at worst - RACIST!!!!

**Mackinaw** · June-20-14, 03:04 PM

My take, as someone from GP originally who stays tuned in via people who live there:

1. This is driven by the city government's somewhat contrived vision of improved urbanism. They want more pedestrianism and higher downtown occupancy. That's great. But as-is was a traditional urban setting that perfectly facilitated this. I think traditional traffic flow and pedestrianism can coexist, and that this is unnecessary. Temporary road closures for the farmer's market, as they had been doing, is the better course. I disagree on the vision of urbanism, but I emphasize that they are pursuing a vision of urbanism. [[Also, is the building at the NW corner of Wayburn getting torn down for a parking lot? That would be bad urbanism.)

2. To some extent, some of the votes [[or at least some of the popular support) in favor of this are motivated by a desire for another barrier.

3. That desire is mostly because the other side of Alter is mostly urban prairie and downright scary to many reasonable people. Not because of "coloreds," as the usually hack-ish Muckracker reports, but because it is truly an urban void. I am not totally hopeless about the far east side-- and I would personally invest a little bit of money trying to develop the area near Alter-- but some people are.

4. GP'ers don't share the above desire. There is truly division on the matter, not consensus. I am with the opponents: I don't think a barrier could make anyone, on either side, better off. And I am not hopeless about the future of the far east side, either.

5. At the end of the day, I don't think GPP will be any better or worse off with their little marketplace. I think Kercheval will get nicer thanks to various new tenants, particularly restaurants, who do a good job attracting people, and because that 'Cabbage Patch' community has great bones and is really one of the nicer urban residential areas in the region, IMO. This marketplace will enhance in some ways, detract in others, but the area will get nicer on the whole.

6. I resent this plan to the extent it perpetuates an image problem that continues to bog us down in racial politics. I recommend to Mayor Theokas and the City counsel taking down the barriers on nearby St. Paul Street to send a positive message. I truly think it could be a powerful message that heals some wounds. To current GP'ers on this board, I recommend writing a letter or making a call to the mayor/council along these lines.

**nain rouge** · June-20-14, 04:05 PM

I think it's an obvious move by GPP to disassociate from Detroit. The incident with the GPP man going the wrong way on Vernor certainly didn't do the situation any favors and has likely increased tensions along the border.

**Wesley Mouch** · June-20-14, 04:22 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

If it wasn't stupid, why did she apologize?

Because the activists of the left will burn her at the cross if she doesn't flail herself first. Or maybe she just wants to speak at a university commencement and not be booed off the stage?

**Detroitnerd** · June-20-14, 04:31 PM

Originally Posted by Wesley Mouch

Because the activists of the left will burn her at the cross if she doesn't flail herself first. Or maybe she just wants to speak at a university commencement and not be booed off the stage?

Too dramatic. When journalists get stuff wrong, they sometimes apologize.

I swear, for all the invective some of our Caucasian posters here heap upon Al Sharpton, they often behave like white versions of him when it comes to stuff like this.

**middetres** · June-20-14, 04:49 PM

http://blogs.metrotimes.com/news-bla...corktown-head/

This is a response to the above blog in the Metro Times criticizing the NYT fluff piece on Corktown, bemoaning the absence of any mention of African-Americans in a city that's 82% black.

This is from an African-American [[whom I've known for close to 20 years):

"This blog post pretty much sums up the reason I can't live in Detroit. I've never seen a demographic with such an insatiable appetite for self-pity and an entitled sense of reward for complete failure."

I'm glad he said it, because it was very much how I was feeling about it.

Detroit is the only place left where conspiracy lurks around every corner to keep the black man out and/or down.

Stop living in the past and looking for a slight every time a white person blinks.

Yes, there have been huge injustices perpetrated on the black community, but Detroit has milked those injustices for far too long while the rest of the country has matured and changed.

Oh my god...they're turning 2nd into a 2-way street...how can they treat the black community like that? We've been living here for decades. How dare they!!

If, as a black person, you feel uncomfortable enjoying some of the great new businesses in Detroit that have an overwhelming white customer base, you need to look inside yourself.

If you're not comfortable going to Astro, that's your fault.

And I make the same challenge to white people. If you feel uncomfortable at any business with a majority black clientele, you need to look inside yourself as well.

I never feel uncomfortable anywhere, so it always pisses me off when I'm with someone who's not comfortable where we are. But I've never been known for my sense of empathy...

**bailey** · June-20-14, 04:55 PM

Originally Posted by middetres

http://blogs.metrotimes.com/news-bla...corktown-head/

This is a response to the above blog in the Metro Times criticizing the NYT fluff piece on Corktown, bemoaning the absence of any mention of African-Americans in a city that's 82% black.

This is from an African-American [[whom I've known for close to 20 years):

"This blog post pretty much sums up the reason I can't live in Detroit. I've never seen a demographic with such an insatiable appetite for self-pity and an entitled sense of reward for complete failure."

I'm glad he said it, because it was very much how I was feeling about it.

Detroit is the only place left where conspiracy lurks around every corner to keep the black man out and/or down.

Stop living in the past and looking for a slight every time a white person blinks.

Yes, there have been huge injustices perpetrated on the black community, but Detroit has milked those injustices for far too long while the rest of the country has matured and changed.

Oh my god...they're turning 2nd into a 2-way street...how can they treat the black community like that? We've been living here for decades. How dare they!!

If, as a black person, you feel uncomfortable enjoying some of the great new businesses in Detroit that have an overwhelming white customer base, you need to look inside yourself.

If you're not comfortable going to Astro, that's your fault.

And I make the same challenge to white people. If you feel uncomfortable at any business with a majority black clientele, you need to look inside yourself as well.

I never feel uncomfortable anywhere, so it always pisses me off when I'm with someone who's not comfortable where we are. But I've never been known for my sense of empathy...

Stop it. Grosse pointe is all racist and every.single.decision made about anything is to fuck over black people. Period. End of sentence. End of paragraph.

http://www.metromodemedia.com/featur...rsity0349.aspx

**TKshreve** · June-20-14, 05:00 PM

I live in the patch and I think this redesign has great potential. I for one am glad someone is dumping money into this area. Ever since they closed the liquor stores near Alter, the riff-raff factor has been minimalized. It's great to see an area taking off with new restaurants and businesses alike.

I wish the other side of Alter would have some skin in the game, but status quo prevails in good old fashioned Detroit. Maybe though, they'll invest in a sky-bridge so Detroiters going to the village don't have to spend hours finding their way all the way up to Vernor, and all the way back down to Kercheval. It has to be so insulting. Racist GP and their racist buildings. I thought we had this all figured out when that racist white snow pile melted away..... but apparently not. And who said something about a burning cross in the middle of the roundabout? Can you imagine the reaction if they actually put that there? Yeah..... wow.

**Jason** · June-20-14, 05:32 PM

gee golly it just happens that this farmers market blocks of the street they've been wanting to block off for forever. What a coincidence!

**rex** · June-20-14, 06:50 PM

I think its an excellent idea.

**ABetterDetroit** · June-20-14, 07:37 PM

I still don't understand why anyone gives a shit. All the Points are what they are, nothing but bedroom communities. A tiny farmer market, little art shows, and cute little candles in bags at Christmas who gives a fuck? If that's your thing then go they'd love to have you! Lame ass boring to me, but to each his own live and let live. Detroit is a city, not a little bedroom community why would anyone in a city care what they want to do with their stupid flower show? To those folks the middle of the street to stop traffic is a great idea, still why care? Next week they will want a bake sale on the sidewalk, good for them I'm still not going because I could care less about what old ladies think is going to be "wonderful".

**Dan Wesson** · June-20-14, 08:03 PM

Tis nothing but a Tempest in Teapot. This is nothing more than emulating some of the posh Northwest Michigan Burgs of affluence. Harbor Springs, Petosky, M22, Traverse City.

Not a thing wrong with that.

**nain rouge** · June-20-14, 08:39 PM

That Metro Times article is RIDICULOUS.

**Goose** · June-20-14, 10:10 PM

Originally Posted by ABetterDetroit

I still don't understand why anyone gives a shit. All the Points are what they are, nothing but bedroom communities. A tiny farmer market, little art shows, and cute little candles in bags at Christmas who gives a fuck? If that's your thing then go they'd love to have you! Lame ass boring to me, but to each his own live and let live. Detroit is a city, not a little bedroom community why would anyone in a city care what they want to do with their stupid flower show? To those folks the middle of the street to stop traffic is a great idea, still why care? Next week they will want a bake sale on the sidewalk, good for them I'm still not going because I could care less about what old ladies think is going to be "wonderful".

because there is nothing worse than being told you aren't wanted somewhere you would never want to be......

**DetroitPlanner** · June-20-14, 10:23 PM

What will happen to the 610?

**Danny** · June-21-14, 02:50 AM

the SMART bus RTE. 610 will not affected from Richville. It will Maryland St. to connect to E. Jefferson to Kercheval St.

GUSHI · June-21-14, 07:08 AM

Wow what a great idea, it give detroiters another place to purchase food, in the food desert,. wow Farmet market, wow real potatoes instead of better maid potatoes chips from the local party store. I think people are over reacting, to this, no story here folks move on. I don't see any ne bitching about the royal oak or shelby twp farmers market. Shit I think gross pointe should annex part of the east side, maybe a dozen blocks or so, that probaly the only chance the east side has to survive.

**Gannon** · June-21-14, 07:23 AM

Originally Posted by p69rrh51

DN, sniviling failed to point out that the developers plans were to include Kercheval in Detroit, but the neighborhood told them to f*** off and die. Its to bad, I would have very happy to see the area, especially around the library given the attention it deserves. There is more to the story than one alarmist story and as usual many on here fly off the handle without all the facts.

Driving through there the other day, I realized that MOST of the intact buildings on Kercheval on the 'other' side of this controversial area are those dastardly bastard storefront churches...one with a Pastor who drives a vehicle worth more than the building. Next time I go past, I'll look up the brand...but I swear there was a black Maybach parked on the south side of the street, in front of one church...with its mirror folded back to the driver's door.

So yeah, the planners in GPP have the strongest political force in the city entrenched against their plans to disturb the established profiteering and fleecing...in Jesus' holy name.

No cheers on this one...

**the rock** · June-21-14, 07:55 AM

Originally Posted by GUSHI

Wow what a great idea, it give detroiters another place to purchase food, in the food desert,. wow Farmet market, wow real potatoes instead of better maid potatoes chips from the local party store. I think people are over reacting, to this, no story here folks move on. I don't see any ne bitching about the royal oak or shelby twp farmers market. Shit I think gross pointe should annex part of the east side, maybe a dozen blocks or so, that probaly the only chance the east side has to survive.

Thanks for your support, Gushi. Let me add that Grosse Pointe Woods has opened its Farmer's Market on Sundays in front of City Hall and has proven quite popular in its short existance. [[This will give some the opportunity to moan, groan and wail all over again).

**DetroitPlanner** · June-21-14, 09:01 AM

Originally Posted by Danny

the SMART bus RTE. 610 will not affected from Richville. It will Maryland St. to connect to E. Jefferson to Kercheval St.

Thanks Danny.

**SyGolden48236** · June-21-14, 10:55 AM

Hello everybody! I am a long time reader of this board but this is my first time posting here.

So much hue and cry over this project, this is so much rubbish! Nobody is going to have to show their papers to enter Grosse Pointe. All are welcome to attend the market as well as the other establishments in the Park. Forget about the phony symbolism and worry about real problems.

Detroiters have patronized businesses in GPP for many years and are welcome to do so in the future.

**Wesley Mouch** · June-21-14, 11:28 AM

Originally Posted by GUSHI

Wow what a great idea, it give detroiters another place to purchase food, in the food desert,. wow Farmet market, wow real potatoes instead of better maid potatoes chips from the local party store. I think people are over reacting, to this, no story here folks move on. I don't see any ne bitching about the royal oak or shelby twp farmers market. Shit I think gross pointe should annex part of the east side, maybe a dozen blocks or so, that probaly the only chance the east side has to survive.

The hunt for micro-aggressions of racism can't see the good. First and only goal -- attack others who don't agree and behave like us.

I think once you get past the radical fools, you'll find good people who will greatly enjoy this market.

Perhaps the new neighborhood council member will start one on the Detroit side.

And a farmers markets makes sense when you live next to an agricultural area.

**Dan Wesson** · June-21-14, 01:54 PM

Can you imagine how this board would light up iffin a Chicago Style Flash Mob wilded the Area on a busy weekend.

**cjd** · June-21-14, 08:41 PM

I think this thread is a real microcosm of why I don't have a boatload of hope for Detroit and the suburbs to peacefully coexist and grow together. GPP has a underused 'downtown' that happens to be near Detroit. They try to slow the traffic down / decrease it and put in a farmer's market. It happens to be near the border with Detroit.

I look at it and say, hey- now ppl from GPP and *anywhere* else can maybe skip the dastardly crowds at Eastern Market and pick up some produce. There's no "no coloreds" signs being put up and the area will be walkable for anyone, no matter the race.

Others look at it and say, See, they are putting in a traffic circle to keep out 'Detroiters' [[aka AAs). More of the same crap from an all white enclave that seeks to continue 100 years of racism.

Its very strange to me to think that if this project was moved 20 yards west, and paid for by someone else, it would be the greatest thing since sliced bread.

**Dumpling** · June-21-14, 09:32 PM

I live in Detroit. I enjoy having diverse neighbors in my area including AA. That said,
If I could put a traffic circle right in front of my house, I would. The casualties in front
of my house since 2006 include one child injured, one raccoon killed, one gray cat killed,
a parked SUV belonging to my neighbors to the south smashed in, and another parked car belonging to the neighbors diagonally across from my house smashed in. The damage to
the cars was more serious than bumper dinks. Each needed body work.