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  1. #26

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    I'm glad to see someone besides me is seeing past the smoke and mirrors of the company named Shinola. On their overpriced wallets and watches I won't hazard an opinion, but as a cyclist, I was rather interested in the bicycles. When I visited the shop, I spoke with the guy behind the bike counter -- "So I realize you probably don't make the components (derailleurs, brakes, etc.), but you make the frames here" -- "Well, no we buy them from X...." -- "Well, with your watch-and-wallet leather business, certainly you make the saddles" -- "No, we buy those from Y......" -- "So what DO you make yourselves?" Turns out, nothing -- all pre-manufactured parts simply assembled on site; no more than any decent mom-and-pop bike shop does, but at ten times the cost.

    FYI, I know there is at lest one, and possibly more, genuine bike frame manufacturer working in Detroit.

  2. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast View Post
    No I'm not. It's just a way of saying I think the original complaint is baseless.
    It's great you have an opinion.

    Do you dislike the marketing tactics of any company? Big fan of the super sleazy American Apparel?

  3. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by CleveBill View Post
    I'm glad to see someone besides me is seeing past the smoke and mirrors of the company named Shinola. On their overpriced wallets and watches I won't hazard an opinion, but as a cyclist, I was rather interested in the bicycles. When I visited the shop, I spoke with the guy behind the bike counter -- "So I realize you probably don't make the components (derailleurs, brakes, etc.), but you make the frames here" -- "Well, no we buy them from X...." -- "Well, with your watch-and-wallet leather business, certainly you make the saddles" -- "No, we buy those from Y......" -- "So what DO you make yourselves?" Turns out, nothing -- all pre-manufactured parts simply assembled on site; no more than any decent mom-and-pop bike shop does, but at ten times the cost.

    FYI, I know there is at lest one, and possibly more, genuine bike frame manufacturer working in Detroit.
    But do they manufacture the frame of Detroit-made metal? Or do they just bend and play with metal from - OMG - some place else? If so, they don't "manufacture" the frame in Detroit, do they?

  4. #29

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    Some local perspective. As opposed to that guy in New York claiming to be a Detroiter.

    http://www.freep.com/article/2014040...-fahle-made-in

  5. #30

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    I'm still surprised that disapproving of a company's gross marketing strategies is "baseless".

  6. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast View Post
    But do they manufacture the frame of Detroit-made metal? Or do they just bend and play with metal from - OMG - some place else? If so, they don't "manufacture" the frame in Detroit, do they?
    Sure, they do manufacture. They do much more than assemble.

  7. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by noise View Post
    Sure, they do manufacture. They do much more than assemble.
    .

    Nothing is is more inherently "Detroit" than the assembly line. Perhaps you've heard of Henry Ford .

  8. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by noise View Post
    Sure, they do manufacture. They do much more than assemble.
    Do they forge their own metal? Or does someone supply a bunch of components that they weld ("assemble") together?

  9. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast View Post
    .

    Nothing is is more inherently "Detroit" than the assembly line. Perhaps you've heard of Henry Ford .
    No kidding. Assembly is what made Detroit a world class city, and people are complaining that assembling something here isn't Detroit enough?

  10. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan View Post
    .... and people are complaining that assembling something here isn't Detroit enough?
    that isn't what's being said. I wish people would stop saying that it is. This is Kid Rock screaming about how detroit he is while growing up in Romeo and making his beer in Webberville and his Made in Detroit label in Warren. At some point can't we call people out for being poseurs?

    What is being said is this group is claiming some "detroitness" some tie to american manufacturing that the world says Detroit can't do... But what ARE they doing? Nothing that can't be done literally ANYWHERE ELSE IN THE WORLD.

    There is nothing...none...zilch...that makes Shinola a "detroit" thing OTHER than this is where they decided to set up shop to put all the pieces they sourced elsewhere together... and apparently did so based on market testing the Detroit "brand".

    and for the eleventybillionth time that is not saying they are not a net positive for the employment picture. Just making a rather small point about the marketing (and insane markup) and silliness of it.

    I'm saying Shinola's...like Bob Ritchie's... "made in detroit" claim is literally a meaningless statement at this point because it is a marketing contrivance. Maybe in the age of globalism "made in {_____}" is always meaningless. Again though, as I've stated before, all I want to see is some connection to Detroit, some link, that makes the whole shtick have some meaning. If these people from Texas found "Made in Gary, IN" market tested better and carried more cache than Detroit.....they'd be in Gary.

    That is all.
    Last edited by bailey; April-08-14 at 12:45 PM.

  11. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast View Post
    .

    Nothing is is more inherently "Detroit" than the assembly line. Perhaps you've heard of Henry Ford .
    Are you implying Ford only assembled? Because that's what Shinola does.

  12. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast View Post
    Do they forge their own metal? Or does someone supply a bunch of components that they weld ("assemble") together?
    No, they "manufacture", by definition. They don't simply "assemble", by definition. You're the one using these words. Understand them.

  13. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan View Post
    No kidding. Assembly is what made Detroit a world class city, and people are complaining that assembling something here isn't Detroit enough?
    I don't think anyone has made this argument, aside from those misunderstanding the actual argument.

    Most comments are concerning their marketing/branding without disparaging them as a company or what they produce (aside from those who don't value high quality goods).

  14. #39

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    If I buy a Waterford frame from Wisconsin and a bunch of Shimano components from Nashbar.com, but assemble it in Detroit, can I say I have a "MADE IN DETROIT" bike?

    I mean, at least I'm from the Detroit area...unlike Fossil.

  15. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by bailey View Post
    and for the eleventybillionth time that is not saying they are not a net positive for the employment picture. Just making a rather small point about the marketing (and insane markup) and silliness of it.
    But is it an insane markup relative to the typical markup for clothes, accessories, lifestyle stuff or other such products? There's a reason Coach or Marc Jacobs are multi-million or billion dollar companies. Even at the low end, you can buy something from Target for $8 dollars and maybe it cost Target $2, an insane markup if you ask me.

    There has been a lot of discussion about Shinola but I've yet to hear from someone who really knows watches on this board. Personally, I've heard from someone who collects watches and who owns a Shinola watch say that they are good watches and that I should get one. But he didn't say why or what makes them different, just that they are good watches. With Shinola, are you getting a $1,000 watch for $600 or a $40 watch for $600? I don't know. I'm interested.

    I think the Detroit script on the watch is cool. I've paid extra for kitchen knives made from quality material and at one time I paid extra for Tigers or Red Wings gear, so how much extra am I paying for quality materials or for the Detroit script on a watch? How good are these Shinola watches? For starters, the lifetime guarantee is plus.
    Last edited by xD_Brklyn; April-08-14 at 04:11 PM.

  16. #41

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    I like how the bikes are all black, like the first Ford cars. I'll probably get one now that the weather is getting warmer.

  17. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by noise View Post
    No, they "manufacture", by definition. They don't simply "assemble", by definition. You're the one using these words. Understand them.
    actually, if you check Websters, it lists assembly as a synonym for manufacture. And by your definition, cars are not manufactured. Cars parts are simply assembled. Jeeps are not made at Jefferson North; they are only assembled there. Its nice that one firm makes bike frames in the city if they do (too bad they don't "manufacture" a whole bike though). Its also nice that another firm assembles bikes with a skilled workforce.

    I think that its great that someone is marketing the Detroit workforce as the reason that a product is well made.
    Last edited by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast; April-08-14 at 06:55 PM.

  18. #43

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    Shinola's assembly model does harken back to the early days of the auto industry. For the first twenty years, the big auto brands bought and assembled most of their components from other companies. They started consolidating in the 20's, with GM buying Fisher and other suppliers, and Henry Ford trying to do everything from steel making to planting rubber trees.

  19. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast View Post
    actually, if you check Websters, it lists assembly as a synonym for manufacture. And by your definition, cars are not manufactured. Cars parts are simply assembled. Jeeps are not made at Jefferson North; they are only assembled there. Its nice that one firm makes bike frames in the city if they do (too bad they don't "manufacture" a whole bike though). Its also nice that another firm assembles bikes with a skilled workforce.

    I think that its great that someone is marketing the Detroit workforce as the reason that a product is well made.
    Unfortunately, your misunderstandings and emotions are clouding your judgment on this.

    There is a definitional difference and automakers do more than assemble. This is just a matter of fact.

  20. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast View Post
    I think that its great that someone is marketing the Detroit workforce as the reason that a product is well made.
    This is telling, however.

    You think a marketing lie is great. I certainly do not.

  21. #46

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    Is a Detroit bakery's loaf of bread not "local" if they dont mill their own flour and use King Author brand instead?

    Is a custom made dress shirt not "local" if the fabric or thread weren't produced here?

    Not all businesses are able produce everything from "scratch", stories like Vernors are stuff of legend.

  22. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dbest View Post
    Is a Detroit bakery's loaf of bread not "local" if they dont mill their own flour and use King Author brand instead?

    Is a custom made dress shirt not "local" if the fabric or thread weren't produced here?

    Not all businesses are able produce everything from "scratch", stories like Vernors are stuff of legend.
    Not all businesses plaster "Made In Detroit" all over their product or advertising.

  23. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast View Post
    I think that its great that someone is marketing the Detroit workforce as the reason that a product is well made.
    except that workforce didn't actually exist and they all needed to be trained...according to Shinola. Detroit is completely irrelevant to the assembly of anything Shinola makes.

  24. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by bailey View Post
    except that workforce didn't actually exist and they all needed to be trained...according to Shinola. Detroit is completely irrelevant to the assembly of anything Shinola makes.
    Not quite true, IMO, Detroit IS relevant because of their marketing strategy. They're currently riding the crest. Good for them, good for Detroit, and welcome! Hope they get it to the point they're running 24/7. I just want to separate the #$%! from Shinola.

  25. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dbest View Post
    Is a Detroit bakery's loaf of bread not "local" if they dont mill their own flour and use King Author brand instead?

    Is a custom made dress shirt not "local" if the fabric or thread weren't produced here?

    Not all businesses are able produce everything from "scratch", stories like Vernors are stuff of legend.
    Read the thread. This is not the issue and it's been explained multiple times.

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