Car vs. Train = 4 dead in Canton Twp.

**MCP-001** · July-11-09, 09:34 AM

Lesseehere.

An active railroad crossing that was working property.

Another motorist who stopped for several seconds prior to the train crossing.

Someone driving with a suspended license getting him and his friends killed.

Stupidity should be painful!

**Bloomfield Pills** · July-11-09, 11:18 AM

Driver had a warrant out for his arrest, which was issued the day before the crash:

http://www.detnews.com/article/20090...O01/907110352/

My favorite quote in the whole article: The uncle blames Amtrak for the accident.

**Novine** · July-11-09, 12:18 PM

I don't agree with the uncle about the blame but if we ever get true high speed rail in Michigan, the crossings will need to be secured to protect rail passengers from foolish risk-takers. Imagine what could have happened if the engine and cars had derailed at 70 MPH? Some of the worst Amtrak and commuter train wrecks have been caused by vehicle/train collisions.

**Bloomfield Pills** · July-11-09, 01:00 PM

That's a good point, Novine. I was thinking of the question at the other end of the spectrum: Why should the railroads protect these idiot drivers who don't heed the barriers? I didn't think about the danger these morons pose to the passengers.

**Patrick** · July-11-09, 02:30 PM

"If Amtrak is going to have high-speed trains, they need to have road barriers where nobody can go around them,"

Uncle of driver

Buy American · July-11-09, 02:49 PM

Like I said before, when does a person take responsibility for his own actions. Unfortunately, the driver of the car is dead, as is 4 other young people. Blaming Amtrak is ludicrious. If there were high speed trains, nothing would keep a stupid, "cool dude" [[as some of his pot smoking friends aluded to on My Space), from making a fatal mistake, he would have found a way to try and beat that train, pure and simple. The family of the driver will do their damndest to find someone to blame other than the driver himself. The dollar signs are flashing now.

**mjs** · July-11-09, 03:20 PM

"When he went to pay the tickets, they didn't tell him he had to pay a reinstatement fee, so they never reinstated his license," Ridenour said. "He found out later that his license was suspended when he got pulled over later."

So, even the uncle attests that he knew on the day of the crash that his license was suspended. An insurer is prohibited by Michigan No-Fault from insuring an unlicensed driver. Wouldn't he have known when the insurer sent the notice of cancellation? Shouldn't he have read the notice of suspension he received from the Secretary of State that describes the reinstatement fee and unsafe driver fees?

If his parents were insuring the vehicle as some wonder, the notice of cancellation would have came in their name and they would have been aware at that time. If the car is in their name, they have both a legal right and legal obligation to keep him from driving it. Even if it wasn't, they could have always reminded their son that Canton police have the resources to respond to a call that someone is driving while license suspended.

Driving without insurance or under the influence also acts as a bar against litigation under Michigan No-fault even if the other side were clearly at fault. The uncle can sue, but he won't make it past a motion to dismiss and a judge can add attorney fees to any frivolous motions.

Sludgedaddy · July-11-09, 04:11 PM

Hopefully, out of this horrible incident ,a message is sent to all driving age teens, those in a hurry, and distracted cell phone users. And yes, Mr. Blarf, I've often expounded on Darwin's Theory of Natural Selection when lecturing my kids on recklessness and the folly of youth.

I am reminded of another car / train collision which took place awhile back. The car was stalled. The engine was dead upon the railroad track. The passanger was removed from the vehicle, but she went running back. When investigators arrived on the scene, they said they discovered a high school ring cluctched tightly in the corpse's hand.

**jcole** · July-11-09, 04:19 PM

Originally Posted by Sludgedaddy

Hopefully, out of this horrible incident ,a message is sent to all driving age teens, those in a hurry, and distracted cell phone users. And yes, Mr. Blarf, I've often expounded on Darwin's Theory of Natural Selection when lecturing my kids on recklessness and the folly of youth.

I am reminded of another car / train collision which took place awhile back. The car was stalled. The engine was dead upon the railroad track. The passanger was removed from the vehicle, but she went running back. When investigators arrived on the scene, they said they discovered a high school ring cluctched tightly in the corpse's hand.

And it was from her own true love.

**Meddle** · July-11-09, 02:58 PM

70 MPH is not a high speed train. They use traditional tracks and crossings. 70 MPH is a common speed for both passenger and freight trains.

High speed trains may run at 150 MPH or more and will use special tracks where there are no grade crossings. They'll either go over or under roadways.

**luckycar** · July-11-09, 04:40 PM

My parents took the Amtrack to Florida one winter.On the return trip a truck hit the train.It was ruled a suicide.Two dead in a heartbeat.The people in the truck had an domestic situation before leaving the house.The driver,a male,ended the discussion by pulling around the waiting vehicles at the crossing,and hit the train in the second or third car behind the locco.My father saw the under side of the truck blast past his window,along with sparks and fire.He gave his statement to the police,and they continued home by bus.This was outside of Niles.The lawyer from the railroad came to our house to get more info,a deposition.He explained that the family of the woman in the truck was filing a suit against Amtrack and Conrail.He also said that the railroads don't lose many of these cases.He also told us that they don't pay out any "go away money",just to stay out of court.This would have been around 1993.My heart goes out to these families,the uncle needs to wise-up.

**da_cheif** · July-11-09, 06:07 PM

it seems obvious that the girl and the driver were brought up by single parents or it appears that way as we dont hear any reference to a father.......so they were both on their own finding out how to survive in this high speed world....I was there myself .....at 8 my mother left me alone with my father. There were many close calls in my youth......i was lucky.......Dan the driver if he turned out to have been the lone survivor no doubt with his record would have been put away for years for vehicular manslaughter.......as it turned out it was a murder suicide.......sigh.....btw there was a girlfriend of one of the victims who avoided being there as she had to attend a family gathering at a cemetery to honor here grandfather........she made it.

Buy American · July-11-09, 06:30 PM

Originally Posted by da_cheif

it seems obvious that the girl and the driver were brought up by single parents or it appears that way as we dont hear any reference to a father.......so they were both on their own finding out how to survive in this high speed world....I was there myself .....at 8 my mother left me alone with my father. There were many close calls in my youth......i was lucky.......Dan the driver if he turned out to have been the lone survivor no doubt with his record would have been put away for years for vehicular manslaughter.......as it turned out it was a murder suicide.......sigh.....btw there was a girlfriend of one of the victims who avoided being there as she had to attend a family gathering at a cemetery to honor here grandfather........she made it.

I disagree with the "murder-suicide" theory....the young man didn't intend to kill himself and take the others with him...in my opinion he was probably showing off, driving fast, maybe high on something, had the radio full blast, thought he was invincible, and in the blink of an eye 5 lives are ended.

**da_cheif** · July-11-09, 07:04 PM

Originally Posted by Buy American

I disagree with the "murder-suicide" theory....the young man didn't intend to kill himself and take the others with him...in my opinion he was probably showing off, driving fast, maybe high on something, had the radio full blast, thought he was invincible, and in the blink of an eye 5 lives are ended.

ur right......manslaughter suicide would be more fitting.......the slaughter on the highways mostly involve the young and the drunk......like that drunk that snuffed out the lives of 4 or 5 teenagers in roseville recently........america has its own home grown terrorists who murdered 40 thousand of our citizens last year......drunk drivers.......

**gibran** · July-11-09, 07:07 PM

we strive for order in our lives ...but heart aches comes randomly....how many times has kids raced a train and won...we are shocked in these scenarios...families ask "why me"...and the analysis never makes any sense to those injured emotionally[[train and people responding) and those left without their kids..regardless of the character..these are dead children and friends...let's hope that the chaos of random heartbreak spares other families when it comes to racing trains from this sad, sad scene...

In my youth I attended a class for school bus drivers...[[ had to work two jobs to afford being a teacher)...we had a train engineer come in and speak to us about these type of accidents..he had been involved in two...this horror is long in leaving your cognition.
This never makes sense...and there sometimes is no way to assign blame other than to the participants..but then again they or he has paid the ultimate price..we can only hope for peace in their families lives .

**da_cheif** · July-11-09, 07:07 PM

buy american....by ur handle i c ur could be an auto worker.......i heard about a couple of japanese guys having a conversation on a hong kong street recently railing agains all the high paying auto jobs they lost to mississippi and tennnesse........same complaint coming from germany.........just to balance things out.......

Buy American · July-11-09, 09:12 PM

Originally Posted by da_cheif

buy american....by ur handle i c ur could be an auto worker.......i heard about a couple of japanese guys having a conversation on a hong kong street recently railing agains all the high paying auto jobs they lost to mississippi and tennnesse........same complaint coming from germany.........just to balance things out.......

Not an autoworker nor affiliated with suppliers either....just someone who believes strongly in the Big 3 and what the companies have done for Americans.

MIRepublic · July-11-09, 09:01 PM

MDOT: Barricades at crossing may have deterred fatal crash

**Novine** · July-11-09, 11:11 PM

".btw there was a girlfriend of one of the victims who avoided being there as she had to attend a family gathering at a cemetery to honor here grandfather........she made it."

Everyone loves to tell these stories. "That could have been me." But if that person would have been there, the car probably wouldn't have crossed the tracks at that exact moment because that extra person would have taken an extra 10 seconds to get in the car which would have led to them being stopped at some red light or otherwise delayed along the way and they never would have seen the train. Unless you believe that your fate is predetermined, these 5 were the victims of a very bad driver with very unlucky timing.

**Meddle** · July-11-09, 11:47 PM

And it continues;

http://freep.com/article/20090711/NE...ates-were-down

Witness Ashley Vaughn said neither she nor her husband Dwayne saw the railway arms lower or the crossing lights flashing that day as they drove south on Hannan Road. They saw people standing near the track.

All that says to me is that they arrived AFTER the impact and the gates had gone back up.

However, I see one thing in the panoramic picture in the linked article that is of concern. Anyone else see it?

**Meddle** · July-12-09, 12:42 AM

Woodhaven -- The mother of a 19-year-old man police said drove a car into the path of an Amtrak train, killing himself and four young friends, told The Detroit News Saturday she did not know her son's license was suspended.

"I would not have let him take my car if I knew," Donna Broughton said of her son Daniel. "That would not have happened."

http://detnews.com/article/20090711/...-was-suspended

**reddog289** · July-12-09, 01:39 AM

OkMeddle clue me in on what you see.
Never paid no mind at first to the picture of the locomotive on the side of my fridge, But then noticed the #128 and said "damn" same one that was involved. If people want to get picky about car/train rules I think that railroads were around a bit before the auto and after over 100 + years cars will most always lose to a train, sad fact but true.

**Meddle** · July-12-09, 01:56 AM

Originally Posted by reddog289

OkMeddle clue me in on what you see.

I'll wait for some others to comment. It stands out to me in the panoramic picture, but I haven't been to the crossing and this is the only picture I've seen so I'm not sure if it's distorted or accurate.

**Novine** · July-12-09, 05:12 AM

Their story doesn't make sense. If they were driving south on Hannan and could see the crossing before the train arrived, wouldn't they have seen the car coming northbound before it was struck by the train? Hannan is a two-lane road and the only way for the driver to pass the stopped SUV was to pass in the opposite lane. If I was heading south and saw a car swerve into my lane, as a driver, I think that would have caught my attention, especially as the car was then struck by a train.

Here's the view heading north on Hannon. See how the building and trees obscure any view of the tracks to the east.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sour...358.36,,0,5.51

Even at the crossing, the view down the tracks is very limited.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sour...358.36,,0,5.51

The view south on Hannon. You can see the car south of the crossing. Wouldn't have the witnesses seen the accident car coming north in their lane?

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sour...358.36,,0,5.51

and coming south on Hannan.

**Meddle** · July-12-09, 05:32 AM

See how the building and trees obscure any view of the tracks to the east.

Bingo!

Now that in NO way excuses the driver's actions. In fact that REQUIRES a full stop at the crossing before proceeding even if the gates are up and lights off.

However, that's the stuff lawyers thrive on and they'll try to make a case against the railroad, the township and/or the county.