Janet's Lunch is Closed

[p69rrh51]

How do GP residents deal with all the meters? Do most places validate?

I always wondered how this works. I can't imagine everyone walks around with a bucket of change for every time they go to the library or grocery store.

Pretty much the same way they do in Birmingham.

[bailey]

I was there a few weeks ago, and yes, currently it IS a cluster*&%@. Once they get all their stock out and get organized, I think they're going to be a very profitable store. I find it hard to believe they couldn't pay their rent @ the old location. They had a lot of good traffic there. As far as parking, how can you go wrong being located on an old car dealer lot? PLENTY of spaces to choose from. Unfortunately, both the new ACE and The Village Mkt. are a bit too far for me now to run across the border, [[time & materials, gas prices), everytime I need something for a repair @ home. I guess I'll have to make like a REAL Detroiter and haul it in from the 'burbs on my way home from work.

You'd think that but there isn't a ton of parking. Am I missing something, I thought the only place to park was that little lot in front of the building? IIRC, most of the old dealer "lot" became the new McDonalds.

[Honky Tonk]

Maybe I'm missing something, but there's that whole strip going East on Mack.

[Bham1982]

Pretty much the same way they do in Birmingham.

I can't think of anyplace in Birmingham [[or in any other suburb) with a similar setup. All the supermarkets and the like have normal free surface parking.

In the Pointes, if you want Kroger, or Trader Joes, you have to pay for parking, I think. Is there a way around it?

[bailey]

I can't think of anyplace in Birmingham [[or in any other suburb) with a similar setup. All the supermarkets and the like have normal free surface parking.

In the Pointes, if you want Kroger, or Trader Joes, you have to pay for parking, I think. Is there a way around it?

TJs validates in the deck. and it's like 50 cents for an hour. It's not RO type gouging.

[Bham1982]

Exactly. when did parking meters become difficult to deal with?

Where else specifically in Metro Detroit have you seen a similar arrangement?

[bailey]

Where else specifically in Metro Detroit have you seen a similar arrangement?

In every "downtown" in the region?

[Bham1982]

In every "downtown" in the region?

Where, specifically? Downtown Birmingham has a Kroger and a Papa Joes, both with free surface parking.

[Honky Tonk]

Where else specifically in Metro Detroit have you seen a similar arrangement?

Please read my "Dearborn" post above. I feel slighted.

[rondinjp]

HT, the Cottons make a s**tload of money off of our taxes. They do 3rd party medical billing mainly through medicare/medicaid. The latest issue of the Pointer has an article on them. The very large mansion on Lakeshore just past the Alger house is being built by one the family members.

It's actually being built by both sons. There is supposed to be a second house built on the accompanying lot [[i'm guessing it won't be as big due to size of the lot).

As for the family, I grew up a few houses down from the cotton's. The parents still live in GPP down the street from my parents. All-in-all, a really nice family and they are trying hard to change Grosse Pointe [[as a whole) into an even more desirable place to live. Unfortunately, they are getting push-back from older Grosse Pointer's that don't want change. However, there is enough younger blood moving in and running for office positions that I think we will see some real positive changes the next couple of years.

Not sure about the Borders/Ace hardware block. We have heard lots of rumors including everything from one or more high end retail shops [[not TV) to Beaumont acquiring the whole block for offices. This is actually the the first i've heard of True Value moving in. Due to the proximity of ace and pointe hardware i'm a little skeptical about this rumor.

As for Ace, it's my understanding they needed to get out quick, hence the disorganized layout. They are supposedly going to renovate the new store in stages.

Again, this is all hearsay so take for what it's worth as rumors run rampant in GP.

[bailey]

Where, specifically? Downtown Birmingham has a Kroger and a Papa Joes, both with free surface parking.

I assume they are like that because Kroger and Papa joes own the lots. I can't think of any other public road or deck in downtown Bham that isn't metered or pay.

In GP all the surface lots are city owned. Some one older than me will have to comment, but i don't recall a time when they were ever not metered.

While a bit uncommon, I don't understand why one would be flustered at seeing meters.

[bailey]

Re the Beaumont offices rumor. Fairly certain that the zoning requires the first floor of all buildings in the village be retail. I suppose Beaumont could buy...er I mean..."argue" for a variance.

[Honky Tonk]

Again, this is all hearsay so take for what it's worth as rumors run rampant in GP.

Not like Detroit YES!, where everything is backed by fact!

[Bham1982]

I assume they are like that because Kroger and Papa joes own the lots. I can't think of any other public road or deck in downtown Bham that isn't metered or pay.

The decks in Birmingham are all free for two hours, and free Sundays. And no way would they ever put a supermarket where you have to park in the decks or feed the meters.

It isn't really the "wow, parking sometimes costs money downtown" issue I'm curious about, but rather the placement of supermarkets and the like in areas where you need to deal with paid meters and the like, but it's probably just because the Pointes don't have much sprawly big-box stuff, and like to keep the commercial stuff in downtown environments.

The good part, of course, is that the streetscape looks much nicer in the Pointes, with less big box strip mall garbage everywhere.

[p69rrh51]

I can't think of anyplace in Birmingham [[or in any other suburb) with a similar setup. All the supermarkets and the like have normal free surface parking.

In the Pointes, if you want Kroger, or Trader Joes, you have to pay for parking, I think. Is there a way around it?

Trader Joe's validates parking, but B'ham has all those meters at Maple and Old Woodward you cannot go anywhere in that area without paying the meter or the free parking in the city lots[[which a ways away and a hassle). To me they are pretty similar.

[Bham1982]

Trader Joe's validates parking, but B'ham has all those meters at Maple and Old Woodward you cannot go anywhere in that area without paying the meter or the parking in the city lots. To me they are pretty similar.

But they aren't similar, because [[A) the decks and lots are free; and [[B) they don't have supermarket/big box stores in this location.

But I'm beating a dead horse at this point.

[bailey]

The decks in Birmingham are all free for two hours, and free Sundays. And no way would they ever put a supermarket where you have to park in the decks or feed the meters.

It isn't really the "wow, parking sometimes costs money downtown" issue I'm curious about, but rather the placement of supermarkets and the like in areas where you need to deal with paid meters and the like, but it's probably just because the Pointes don't have much sprawly big-box stuff, and like to keep the commercial stuff in downtown environments.

The good part, of course, is that the streetscape looks much nicer in the Pointes, with less big box strip mall garbage everywhere.

Yup. and again, the meters were there before the Kroger. Could they put them in now without an outcry... probably not.

In any event, the lots and all street parking is free on sundays in GP as well. Which i would think is the busiest time for Kroger.

Also FWIW the Kroger up on Mack and Vernier is a free lot...while all the rest of Mack is metered.

[p69rrh51]

But they aren't similar, because [[A) the decks and lots are free; and [[B) they don't have supermarket/big box stores in this location.

But I'm beating a dead horse at this point.

Kind of beating a dead horse the lots in B'ham are far away from where we want to be unless you are going to the library, and you are comparing a very small 3 block area to a much larger area i.e. "downtown" Birmingham. Its apples and oranges when its all said and down. Everyone here deals with it and for the most part nobody complains except when they have to pay a meter violation.

[p69rrh51]

Yup. and again, the meters were there before the Kroger. Could they put them in now without an outcry... probably not.

In any event, the lots and all street parking is free on sundays in GP as well. Which i would think is the busiest time for Kroger.

Also FWIW the Kroger up on Mack and Vernier is a free lot...while all the rest of Mack is metered.

Marter Road, 8 Mile & Harper, and 9 Mile & Greater Mack are free parking also.

[cramerro]

A few thoughts.

First, the whole parking meter fiasco. All three branches of the library offer free parking. As for shopping, the parking fees in the Village are 50 cents an hour. Most stereotypical shoppers [[women) have at least two quarters in thier change purse most times. TJ's validates, and the lot behind the former Ace has an addendant/machine that will provide change and/or accept credit cards. It makes sense to have meters on the actual streets, to make people who are going to be there for a longer trip park in the back and keep the front spaces turning over... similar to Birmingham's street meters. In addition, BHam, the two stores that you provided as examples of no-brainers for free parking are neither in Downtown Birmingham nor part of larger shopping districts [[where multiple independently owned buildings compete for parking spaces). They are both not much more than [[very nice looking) strip malls located across Woodward from Downtown Birmingham [[on private property without risk that people will park there and walk off-site to shop elsewhere).

Second, the West Park area [[Janets lunch, etc) is being developed as a upper-end restaurant district. And, sorry to say, I heard from more than one source that the hardware store finally sold out as well after holding out for a long time. I have heard that there is a proposal taking shape to cut off Kercheval to through traffic before Alter.

Third, I have heard that the Village ACE decided to move to their new location because they did not own the building and the rent was rising somewhat quickly. They bought the building on Mack themselves, renovated, and moved in. I was excited, as it is closer to my house, but I was very upset with my first visit there. I'm letting myself cool down a bit an giving them a chance to get all thier stock and systems worked out before I give them another chance. The aisles were tiny, the merchandise was poorly organized, the registers are basically four machines along one long service counter [[like a Barnes and Noble, except I have a shopping cart and giant merchandise like a trash can that I'm trying to maneuver to my register). I'm glad to hear on another post that thier move was hasty and they have plans for more thorough rennovations as time goes by... they should let thier customers know that!!

[jackie5275]

I don't know how they're doing financially, but Dearborn went with that nonsense a few years back, and there are a LOT of empty storefronts on the West side of town.

Those empty storefronts aren't all attributable to the start of paid parking. Most of it is due to developer Hakim Fakhoury bailing on developing all those storefronts after extended disputes with the city. That's the major reason. In comparison, the parking is miniscule.

[Honky Tonk]

Those empty storefronts aren't all attributable to the start of paid parking. Most of it is due to developer Hakim Fakhoury bailing on developing all those storefronts after extended disputes with the city. That's the major reason. In comparison, the parking is miniscule.

Ok, but it's still a PITA.

[Honky Tonk]

A few thoughts.

Second, the West Park area [[Janets lunch, etc) is being developed as a upper-end restaurant district. And, sorry to say, I heard from more than one source that the hardware store finally sold out as well after holding out for a long time.

WHICH hardware store? NOT Pointe??????

[rondinjp]

A few thoughts.

First, the whole parking meter fiasco. All three branches of the library offer free parking. As for shopping, the parking fees in the Village are 50 cents an hour. Most stereotypical shoppers [[women) have at least two quarters in thier change purse most times. TJ's validates, and the lot behind the former Ace has an addendant/machine that will provide change and/or accept credit cards. It makes sense to have meters on the actual streets, to make people who are going to be there for a longer trip park in the back and keep the front spaces turning over... similar to Birmingham's street meters. In addition, BHam, the two stores that you provided as examples of no-brainers for free parking are neither in Downtown Birmingham nor part of larger shopping districts [[where multiple independently owned buildings compete for parking spaces). They are both not much more than [[very nice looking) strip malls located across Woodward from Downtown Birmingham [[on private property without risk that people will park there and walk off-site to shop elsewhere).

Second, the West Park area [[Janets lunch, etc) is being developed as a upper-end restaurant district. And, sorry to say, I heard from more than one source that the hardware store finally sold out as well after holding out for a long time. I have heard that there is a proposal taking shape to cut off Kercheval to through traffic before Alter.

Third, I have heard that the Village ACE decided to move to their new location because they did not own the building and the rent was rising somewhat quickly. They bought the building on Mack themselves, renovated, and moved in. I was excited, as it is closer to my house, but I was very upset with my first visit there. I'm letting myself cool down a bit an giving them a chance to get all thier stock and systems worked out before I give them another chance. The aisles were tiny, the merchandise was poorly organized, the registers are basically four machines along one long service counter [[like a Barnes and Noble, except I have a shopping cart and giant merchandise like a trash can that I'm trying to maneuver to my register). I'm glad to hear on another post that thier move was hasty and they have plans for more thorough rennovations as time goes by... they should let thier customers know that!!

You are correct on the west village plan is to block off kercheval at alter. Not sure if this will fly as they would be blocking it off from Detroit, and other posts have commented on this being a bus route that can't be denied access, but we'll wait and see. There was a write-up in crains on the whole renovation [[http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article/20130120/NEWS/301209966)

It sounds like it will be a very great and promising investment for GPP. The west village section has always been way underutilized IMO.

My understanding of the ACE move was more than just the rent [[although that was a huge issue) but also they wanted to build out again and they were denied the ability to do so. Back when it was Damman's hardware it was only half the size. The first expansion [[which was noticable by the elevation in the floor) was done some time in the late 1990's-early 2000's. I guess they wanted to expand again and take over the defunct Borders but couldn't coupled with rents being outrageous justified the move. I'm hopeful they can make a run on Mack as this would be a great alternative to having to run out to Lowes/HD everytime i'm doing a project.

[DetroitArtSeen]

I'm so glad we are finally willing to get these key issues discussed fairly and openly!!
;-)